Do you believe in life after Death?

[The Anointed]

There is no such thing as a glorious spiritual body of incorruptible light. This is not in the Bible anywhere.

There is no such thing as a physical body that is transformed into an immortal body. It is not in the Bible anywhere. This is a Christian belief that came about because the Bible was misinterpreted. ALL these misconceptions about a Resurrection Body came about because Christians believe that Jesus rose from the dead.

It is clear and plain what the Bible SAYS.

There are physical bodies and spiritual bodies, as Paul said. The physical body is the source of all corruption as the Bible says, it is the source of dishonor, it is weak, and that is because the physical body is subject to sin.

The spiritual body is incorruptible because spirit can never die. Paul said that the body is raised in glory and raised in power and that is because the spiritual body has glory and power. The soul (spirit) is glorified and has power because it was created by God.

Jesus said that spirit and flesh are not equivalent. The spirit quickens, the flesh profits nothing. The flesh profits nothing because it is subject to sin and it is mortal, not everlasting.

John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

1 John 2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

Baha’is believe that souls go to heaven and take on a spiritual body, which is the same thing as what Paul says in 1st Cor:

We are raised in a spiritual body and only spiritual bodies can enter heaven.

(1st Corinthians 15:35) "But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?"

36 Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:

44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

Trailblazer wrote..... There is no such thing as a glorious spiritual body of incorruptible light. This is not in the Bible anywhere.

There is no such thing as a physical body that is transformed into an immortal body. It is not in the Bible anywhere. This is a Christian belief that came about because the Bible was misinterpreted. ALL these misconceptions about a Resurrection Body came about because Christians believe that Jesus rose from the dead.

1 Corinthians 15: 51-52; "Listen to this secret truth: we shall not all die, but when the last trumpet sounds, we shall all be changed in an instant, as quickly as the blinking of an eye. For when the trumpet sounds, the dead will be raised, never to die again, and we (Who have not fallen asleep in death) shall all be changed. 53For what is mortal must be changed into what is immortal; what will die must be changed into what cannot die. 54So when this takes place, and the mortal has been changed into the immortal, then the scripture will come true: “Death is destroyed; victory is complete!”

1 The words of the blessing of Enoch, wherewith he blessed the elect and righteous, who will be 2 living in the day of tribulation, when all the wicked and godless are to be removed. And he took up his parable and said -Enoch a righteous man, whose eyes were opened by God, saw the vision of the Holy One in the heavens, which the angels showed me, and from them I heard everything, and from them I understood as I saw, but not for this generation, but for a remote one which is 3 for to come. Concerning the elect I said, and took up my parable concerning them:

The Holy Great One will come forth from His dwelling,
4 And the eternal God will tread upon the earth, (even) on Mount Sinai,
[And appear from His camp]
And appear in the strength of His might from the heaven of heavens.
5 And all shall be smitten with fear
And the Watchers shall quake,
And great fear and trembling shall seize them unto the ends of the earth.
6 And the high mountains shall be shaken,
And the high hills shall be made low,
And shall melt like wax before the flame
7 And the earth shall be wholly rent in sunder,
And all that is upon the earth shall perish,
And there shall be a judgement upon all (men).
8 But with the righteous He will make peace.
And will protect the elect,
And mercy shall be upon them.
And they shall all belong to God,
And they shall be prospered,
And they shall all be blessed
And He will help them all,
And light shall appear unto them,
And He will make peace with them'
9 And behold! He cometh with ten thousands of His holy ones
To execute judgement upon all,
And to destroy all the ungodly:
And to convict all flesh
Of all the works of their ungodliness which they have ungodly committed,
And of all the hard things which ungodly sinners have spoken against Him.

The brother of the Lord, Jude's verbatim quote from the book of Enoch, 'the anointed one.'

9 And behold! He cometh with ten thousands of His holy ones
To execute judgement upon all,
And to destroy all the ungodly:
And to convict all flesh
Of all the works of their ungodliness which they have ungodly committed,
And of all the hard things which ungodly sinners have spoken against Him.

We are that far and distant remote generation that Enoch was referring to. The great day of tribulation begins immediately before the Great Sabbath of one thousand years, of which the weekly Sabbath was but a shadow of the future reality. The day of the Lord, the seventh day from the day in which Adam ate of the forbidden fruit and died in that day at the age of 930, and the day in which the Lord will judge the whole world with justice by means of a MAN that he has CHOSEN. He has given proof of this to everyone by raising that MAN from death. See Acts 27: 31.

It was the prophet Zephaniah through whom the Lord said; "I am going to destroy everything 'ON EARTH', All human beings and animals, birds and fish. I will bring about the downfall of the wicked. I will destroy mankind and no survivors will be left. I the Lord have spoken. . . . . . . . . "On the day when the Lord shows his fury, not even all their gold and silver will save them. The whole 'EARTH' will be destroyed by the fire of his anger. He will put an end----a sudden end----to everyone who lives 'ON EARTH.' "

When Adam was dying at the age of 930, toward the close of the first day, Eve, who has become the great pregnant androgynous body of mankind in whom, ‘The Son of Man’ is developing, and who is to crush the head of Satan, was told that she would follow her brother in six days. It is after the great seventh day Sabbath that heavenly fire incinerates all physical life forms that remain on this planet, and the umbilical cord that binds the SON OF MAN to his mother body, is severed, as Eve is re-united with her Lord ‘ADAM.’ See Revelation 20: 7-9; after the thousand year Sabbath is over heavenly fire will incinerate all that remains on this planet.

The weekly Sabbath, said Paul, in Colossians 2: 17; was but a shadow of the reality in the future, which is the Great Sabbath, the Lord's day of one thousand years.

From the Book of Jubilees 4: 30; "And He (Adam) lacked seventy years of one thousand years; for one thousand years are as one day in the testimony of the heavens and therefore was it written concerning the tree of knowledge: "On the day thou eat thereof ye shall die." For this reason, Adam did not complete the years of that first day; for He died during it." Adam died at the age of 930 in the first day.

We are now approaching the close of the 6th day and the beginning of the 7th, which is the great Sabbath, “The Day of The Lord” the seventh period of one thousand years from the day that Adam ate of the forbidden fruit and died in that first day at the age of 930, which day begins after the greatest period of tribulation that this world has ever seen.

It is at the sound of the last trumpet that heavenly fire incinerates all life on this planet, according to Paul, we shall not all fall asleep in death, but at the sound of the last trumpet we shall be changed in a moment in the twinkling of an eye, from bodies of corruptible matter into glorious bodies of incorruptible energy: "For what is mortal must be changed into what is immortal; what will die must be changed into what cannot die."

It is in that thousand years of peace that all our resources will be used to prepare for the ultimate destruction of all physical life forms that remain on this planet. Knowing that which is to occur after the one thousand year Sabbath, when heavenly fire incinerate the surface of the earth, with the great wealth that will be paid in tribute by the nations of the world during that thousand year rule of our king and high priest, genetic banks of all physical life forms will be created, (The Ark) and sent to a place of safety in order that when the incinerated earth is once again able to sustain physical life forms, Plants will be planted, animals will be created anew, and when the system for the sustainability of mankind has been put in place, the Lord, our brother, king, and high priest will say, "And now, let us make man in our image and likeness." And a new and more, humble Race of men will people this earth.

"Under the guidance of Jupiter (Planet) man prepares, by means of religious exercises, for the journey to the life beyond, and he attains rest under the influence of Saturn." (Basra Encyclopedia)- De Boer, Philosophy in Islam, p 88.

The water ocean on Enceladus, a moon that orbits the planet Saturn, is about 6 miles (10 kilometers) deep and lies beneath a shell of ice 19 to 25 miles (30 to 40 km) thick, researchers said. Further, it's in direct contact with a rocky seafloor, theoretically making possible all kinds of complex chemical reactions — such as, perhaps, the kind that led to the rise of life on Earth.

"The world being melted and re-entered into the bosom of Jupiter, this God continues for some time totally concentered in himself: . . . afterwards we see a new world spring from him, perfect in all its parts; animals are produced anew; an innocent race of man is formed under more favourable auspices, in order to people this earth." " Seneca, Epist, 9, and Qucest. Nat. L. 3, c, ult.

It is at the sound of the last trumpet that heavenly fire incinerates all life on this planet, according to Paul, we shall not all fall asleep in death, but at the sound of the last trumpet we shall be changed in a moment in the twinkling of an eye, from bodies of corruptible matter into glorious immortal bodies of incorruptible energy, etc.

 

[cataway]

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[TransmutingSoul]

Sounds really arrogant to me, but we all have out own views.

Interpreter of the Word of God is not the same thing as the Word of God. Abdu'l-Baha did more than interpret, he added to and embellished what Baha'u'llah wrote.

It almost makes me want to drop out of the Baha'i Faith, which I would have done long ago were it not for believing that Baha'u'llah is a Manifestation of God.

The great thing about Faith is, is that we will always be tested, the more we face, the more we can embrace the wisdom of the test.

Are you aware that Baha'u'llah as the Manifestation of God, tasked Abdul'baha to answer many questions submitted to Baha'u'llah, to which he did many times?

You would be aware that no Baha'i is exempt from the turmoil of this time. The turmoil is within each of us and it is all about finding submission to God.

It is God that Gave Baha'u'llah and in turn through God, Baha'u'llah as the Manifestation, gave Abdul'baha and it was Baha'u'llah that gave the Covenant so that the Faith could not be and would not be split. That is why, as a Baha'i, we submit to the Covenant. From Baha'u'llah on to Abdul'Baha on to Shoghi Effendi and to the Universal House of Justice, we submit.

That is why we can also stand confident in each of the teachings given under that Covenant, as submission will always right any wrong that may happen down the line of inferred infallibility. It is God to test His servants and we are told by Baha'u'llah any possible wongs are righted in that submission. The possible wrongs are noted in the writings as Shoghi Effendi's personal views outside the official writings of the Faith. Official writings are infallible. With the Universal House of Justice, their decisions are based on available research material, and if a decision is made and later research uncovers an alternate possibility, then they have the scope to change that decision.

Consider how fractured we can become if we all decided Abdul'Baha, or Shoghi Effendi did not get it always right! Where does that thought of fallibility stop, but in fractions and splits!

I personally see that constant atheist interaction, can and will have a toll on ones spiritual well being. Faith is always our choice Susan and you can be rest assured that I always wish you well and you and your other half are always remembered in prayers.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I was expecting this to be the next thing you said.
Fundamentalist Baha'is are all pretty much the same.
You have to be faithful to the Covenant.... My husband is the same way.

I do not need to study the Covenant because I know it like the back of my hand but that will never make Abdu'l-Baha infallible because He is not a Manifestation of God. If you and the other Baha'is choose to believe that Abdu'l-Baha cannot make a mistake that is your choice.

There is only One Baha'i Faith because of the Covenant. The Covenant is the strength of faith in this age, the promise given in the Bible.

I really thank you very much for calling me a fundamentalist person of that Covenant, I see it is a great bounty to embrace.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

by

Thanks for calling by and participating, all the best.

Regards Tony

 

[Trailblazer]

It was the prophet Zephaniah through whom the Lord said; "I am going to destroy everything 'ON EARTH', All human beings and animals, birds and fish. I will bring about the downfall of the wicked. I will destroy mankind and no survivors will be left. I the Lord have spoken. . . . . . . . . "On the day when the Lord shows his fury, not even all their gold and silver will save them. The whole 'EARTH' will be destroyed by the fire of his anger. He will put an end----a sudden end----to everyone who lives 'ON EARTH.' "

Can you quote Zephaniah saying that chapter and verse?

It is at the sound of the last trumpet that heavenly fire incinerates all life on this planet, according to Paul, we shall not all fall asleep in death, but at the sound of the last trumpet we shall be changed in a moment in the twinkling of an eye, from bodies of corruptible matter into glorious bodies of incorruptible energy:

Can you quote Paul saying that chapter and verse?

"For what is mortal must be changed into what is immortal; what will die must be changed into what cannot die."

This is what is actually written in the Bible:

1st Corinthians 15:53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

The verse above says nothing about the physical body being changed into a glorified body that cannot die. The verses below clearly state that there are two kinds of bodies, a natural body and a spiritual body; we are sown in a natural body and we are raised in a spiritual body.

1st Corinthians 15
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

I agree with what this Christian says in the following passage. I believe that after the physical body dies, the spirit (soul) passes from one world into another; so the spirit is raised (resurrected) in a spiritual body.

421. When the body is no longer able to perform the bodily functions in the natural world that correspond to the spirit’s thoughts and affections, which the spirit has from the spiritual world, man is said to die. This takes place when the respiration of the lungs and the beatings of the heart cease. But the man does not die; he is merely separated from the bodily part that was of use to him in the world, while the man himself continues to live. It is said that the man himself continues to live since man is not a man because of his body but because of his spirit, for it is the spirit that thinks in man, and thought with affection is what constitutes man. Evidently, then, the death of man is merely his passing from one world into another. And this is why in the Word in its internal sense “death” signifies resurrection and continuation of life. Heaven and Hell, p. 351

I believe that after the spirit (soul) passes from one world into another, it takes on a new form, a spiritual body; so the spirit is raised (resurrected) in a spiritual body:

“The world beyond is as different from this world as this world is different from that of the child while still in the womb of its mother. When the soul attaineth the Presence of God, it will assume the form that best befitteth its immortality and is worthy of its celestial habitation.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 157

“The answer to the third question is this, that in the other world the human reality doth not assume a physical form, rather doth it take on a heavenly form, made up of elements of that heavenly realm.” Selections From the Writings of ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, p. 194

 

[The Anointed]

There is only One Baha'i Faith because of the Covenant. The Covenant is the strength of faith in this age, the promise given in the Bible.

I really thank you very much for calling me a fundamentalist person of that Covenant, I see it is a great bounty to embrace.

Regards Tony

The promise given in the bible, is that Jesus will judge the whole world with Justice for a thousand years, before all physical life forms on this planet are destroyed. What does your Baha'i faith have to say about that event?

 

[Trailblazer]

I really thank you very much for calling me a fundamentalist person of that Covenant, I see it is a great bounty to embrace.

You are free to see anything however you want to see it... However, not every Baha'i sees things the way you do.

I believe in the Covenant of Baha'u'llah, I just do not believe in it the same exact way you do.
That is nobody's business but my own.

This is really no different from Christians who believe in the Bible but interpret it differently. They are all still Christians because they believe in Jesus Christ.

Baha'u'llah said not to let this Cause become a source of contention and strife.

 

[The Anointed]

There is no such thing as a glorious spiritual body of incorruptible light. This is not in the Bible anywhere.

There is no such thing as a physical body that is transformed into an immortal body. It is not in the Bible anywhere. This is a Christian belief that came about because the Bible was misinterpreted. ALL these misconceptions about a Resurrection Body came about because Christians believe that Jesus rose from the dead.

It is clear and plain what the Bible SAYS.

There are physical bodies and spiritual bodies, as Paul said. The physical body is the source of all corruption as the Bible says, it is the source of dishonor, it is weak, and that is because the physical body is subject to sin.

The spiritual body is incorruptible because spirit can never die. Paul said that the body is raised in glory and raised in power and that is because the spiritual body has glory and power. The soul (spirit) is glorified and has power because it was created by God.

Jesus said that spirit and flesh are not equivalent. The spirit quickens, the flesh profits nothing. The flesh profits nothing because it is subject to sin and it is mortal, not everlasting.

John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

1 John 2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

Baha’is believe that souls go to heaven and take on a spiritual body, which is the same thing as what Paul says in 1st Cor:

We are raised in a spiritual body and only spiritual bodies can enter heaven.

(1st Corinthians 15:35) "But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?"

36 Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:

44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

Trailblazer wrote...... Can you quote Zephaniah saying that chapter and verse?

Yep GNB: Zephaniah 1: 2-3; "I am going to destroy everything 'ON EARTH', All human beings and animals, birds and fish. I will bring about the downfall of the wicked. I will destroy mankind and no survivors will be left. I the Lord have spoken.

Then 1: verse 18. . . . . . . . "On the day when the Lord shows his fury, not even all their gold and silver will save them. The whole 'EARTH' will be destroyed by the fire of his anger. He will put an end----a sudden end----to everyone who lives 'ON EARTH.' "

It is at the sound of the last trumpet that heavenly fire incinerates all life on this planet, according to Paul, we shall not all fall asleep in death, but at the sound of the last trumpet we shall be changed in a moment in the twinkling of an eye, from bodies of corruptible matter into glorious bodies of incorruptible energy:

Trailblazer wrote...... Can you quote Paul saying that chapter and verse?

Yep! 1 Corinthians 15: 51-54; Good News Bible Catholic Study Edition: 51-52 “Listen to this secret truth: we shall not all die, but when the last trumpet sounds, we shall all be changed in an instant, as quickly as the blinking of an eye. For when the trumpet sounds, the dead will be raised, never to die again, and we (Who are still living at that time) shall all be changed. 53For what is mortal must be changed into what is immortal; what will die must be changed into what cannot die. 54So when this takes place, and the mortal has been changed into the immortal, then the scripture will come true: “Death is destroyed; victory is complete!”

You may as well quote the writings of Homer Simpson the cartoon character to me, as quoting the writings of ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, because I believe neither one. I believe only the Holy Scriptures from which Jesus and his apostles quoted.

When the body is no longer able to perform the bodily functions in the natural world, when the respiration of the lungs and the beatings of the heart cease, man is said to die the first death.

This is when the body in which the mind=spirit that is the supreme personality to have developed within that body, is then returned to the universal elements from which it was created, the righteous mind=spirit, which has been imprinted upon the soul which is the divine animating principle that pervades, and activates all within the entire universe, lives on, while the unrighteous spirits=minds are divided from the living one, who is God.

As revealed in Matthew 25: 31-46; ““When the Son of Man comes as King and all the angels with him, he will sit on his royal throne, 32and the people of all the nations will be gathered before him. Then he will divide them into two groups, just as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33He will put the righteous people on his right and the others on his left. 34Then the King will say to the people on his right, ‘Come, you that are blessed by my Father! Come and possess the kingdom which has been prepared for you ever since the creation of the world. 35I was hungry and you fed me, thirsty and you gave me a drink; I was a stranger and you received me in your homes, 36naked and you clothed me; I was sick and you took care of me, in prison and you visited me.’

37 “The righteous will then answer him, ‘When, Lord, did we ever see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you a drink? 38When did we ever see you a stranger and welcome you in our homes, or naked and clothe you? 39When did we ever see you sick or in prison, and visit you?’ 40The King will reply, ‘I tell you, whenever you did this for one of the least important of these members of my family, you did it for me!’

41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Away from me, you that are under God's curse! Away to the eternal fire which has been prepared for the Devil and his angels! 42I was hungry but you would not feed me, thirsty but you would not give me a drink; 43I was a stranger but you would not welcome me in your homes, naked but you would not clothe me; I was sick and in prison but you would not take care of me.’

44 “Then they will answer him, ‘When, Lord, did we ever see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and would not help you?’ 45The King will reply, ‘I tell you, whenever you refused to help one of these least important ones, you refused to help me.’ 46These, then, will be sent off to eternal punishment, but the righteous will go to eternal life.”

The eternal punishment is the second death from which there is no returning, everlasting oblivion.

GNB, 21: 8; "But cowards, traitors, perverts, murderers, the immoral, those who practise magic, those who worship idols, and all liars — the place for them is the lake burning with fire and sulphur, which is the second death.” The punishment that is eternal.

ETERNAL or EVERLASTING death.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

I do not believe the Bible teaches that dead bodies will rise from their graves

But isn't that what happened to Lazarus? His sister, Martha, said she knew that "he (Lazarus) will rise in the Last Day." But she didn't have to wait. John 11.

If, as promised, this Earth becomes a paradise again -- a global one -- w/ no wicked (Psalms 37 10,11,29), more than enough food (Psalms 72:16), everyone enjoying perfect health (Isaiah 33:24), peace and happiness everywhere (Isaiah 9:6-7; Revelation 21:3-4; Isaiah 11:6-9), and never growing old (Job 33:25; Revelation 22 1,2,17), then living forever would be wonderful!! It will be!

 

[The Anointed]

But isn't that what happened to Lazarus? His sister, Martha, said she knew that "he (Lazarus) will rise in the Last Day." But she didn't have to wait. John 11.

If, as promised, this Earth becomes a paradise again -- a global one -- w/ no wicked (Psalms 37 10,11,29), more than enough food (Psalms 72:16), everyone enjoying perfect health (Isaiah 33:24), peace and happiness everywhere (Isaiah 9:6-7; Revelation 21:3-4; Isaiah 11:6-9), and never growing old (Job 33:25; Revelation 22 1,2,17), then living forever would be wonderful!! It will be!

If you believe that the body of Lazarus, has not long since decomposed and returned to the elements from which it was created, then you reject the Holy Scriptures which state that Jesus was the first man to be raised from death.

If Lazarus had been actually dead for four days and not in a death like coma, do you realise how far advanced the decomposition of that body would have been?

 

[Hockeycowboy]

If you believe that the body of Lazarus, has not long since decomposed and returned to the elements from which it was created, then you reject the Holy Scriptures which state that Jesus was the first man to be raised from death.

If Lazarus had been actually dead for four days and not in a death like coma, do you realise how far advanced the decomposition of that body would have been?

What did Martha say about that?

 

[The Anointed]

What did Martha say about that?

Yes! Like you, Martha also thought he had been dead for four days and would have smelt pretty bad after four days of decomposing, but like you she was wrong.

 

[Trailblazer]

But isn't that what happened to Lazarus? His sister, Martha, said she knew that "he (Lazarus) will rise in the Last Day." But she didn't have to wait. John 11.

Below is the spiritual interpretation of the resurrection ‘story.’ I believe that the part about the tomb and Mary and Martha is just part of the story that was necessary in order to get to the final punch line in John 11:25-26.

I Am the Resurrection and the Life

17 So when Jesus came, He found that he had already been in the tomb four days. 18 Now Bethany was near Jerusalem, about two miles[a] away. 19 And many of the Jews had joined the women around Martha and Mary, to comfort them concerning their brother.

20 Now Martha, as soon as she heard that Jesus was coming, went and met Him, but Mary was sitting in the house. 21 Now Martha said to Jesus, “Lord, if You had been here, my brother would not have died. 22 But even now I know that whatever You ask of God, God will give You.”

Jesus did not say that the body of Lazarus would rise again. He said rise: 23 Jesus said to her, “Your brother will rise again.”

Then apparently Martha assumed Jesus meant the body: 24 Martha said to Him, “I know that he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day.”

Then Jesus said that He was the resurrection and the life and that whoever believes in Him will never die. He was talking about the eternal life of the soul, NOT the life of the physical body.

25 Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. 26 And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe this?”

The Martha said Yes, I believe in you Jesus: 27 She said to Him, “Yes, Lord, I believe that You are the Christ, the Son of God, who is to come into the world.”

I believe that the following verses are congruent with John 11:25-26 and they refer to the eternal life of the soul, not the eternal life of the body.

John 3:16: For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

John 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

John 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

1 John 5:13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.

John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life,and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

If, as promised, this Earth becomes a paradise again -- a global one -- w/ no wicked (Psalms 37 10,11,29), more than enough food (Psalms 72:16), everyone enjoying perfect health (Isaiah 33:24), peace and happiness everywhere (Isaiah 9:6-7; Revelation 21:3-4; Isaiah 11:6-9), and never growing old (Job 33:25; Revelation 22 1,2,17), then living forever would be wonderful!! It will be!

I agree that this world will become a paradise when the Kingdom of God comes, but it will be a paradise for the living and generations that follow, not for the risen dead.

Isaiah used symbolic language to describe the future He saw:

Isaiah 11:6-9 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them. And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox. And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea.

What this means to a Baha’i is that In the future diverse religions and races will become comrades, friends and companions. The contentions of races, the differences of religions, and the barriers between nations will be completely removed, and all will attain perfect union and reconciliation.

Eventually, everyone will believe in God: “for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea”. There will only be one religion, the religion of God.

 

[columbus]

Why do you assume is was a body part that discovered this?

means, you believe there's life after death ?

Chinu, why would you interpret Salix's post that way?

It makes sense to me in only one way. You only hear what you want to hear, even when it's the opposite of what's true. Perhaps you have a different explanation?
Tom

 

[columbus]

Not to all:

Luke 16:19 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day: 20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores, 21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. 22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; 23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. 24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.

What I see here is a fictional story with a message.
Just because you're rich and secure doesn't mean you're righteous.

Certain presidents might learn from that parable. And many other US Christian folks.
Tom

 

[Muffled]

I believe the spirit never dies but it does leave the body at death if the person is aware that he can. I believe the things that can happen with the spirit are re-incarnation, sojourn in Heaven, lanquish as a ghost, sleep with the body but that was when bodies weren't cremated. I believe most spirits that reject Jesus, won't be sent to Hell until the last judgment.

Heb 9:27 And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment,

I believe that means God decides which possibility the person will get.

Luke 20:38 Now he is not God of the dead, but of the living, for all live to him.”

Matt 11:14 and if you are willing to accept it, he is Elijah who is to come.

I believe that is re-incarnation.

 

[Muffled]

I do not know.

I do not know if there is an afterlife.
I do not know if there is a god.

I do not hold a belief either way in either case.
I simply do not know.

I can understand that. I believe you have been told there is one many times. It reminds me of Jesus telling his disciples that he would be resurrected but none of them believe he had been until they could see and touch him.

 

[Muffled]

I chose other in my poll reply because my understanding is that there are more option that can happen.

1: we die then get reincarnated in to life in physical world again, and it could be a life as human, animal, insect, plant.
2: we realize enlightenment before we die so when we leave physical world we go to one of the heavens at our enlightenment level.
3: if we have a lot of karma we go down to realms lower then our physical realm. Also called Hell, but it is not eternal. We can get out.
4: if we have accumulated so much karma during our time as a living being that we can not continue, we are eliminated from life. Then nothing will happen after this life.

Death is a part of life. So there will be sadness the day the person dies, then it go over to missing the person. I lost both my parents to death, and had to leave my brother so I have felt it.

I will not pull out a tiny section of the human zhuan Falun teaching, because it is not showing the teaching in the right way.no word is lesser then others in the teaching. All of it is important

I believe there is no incarnation into anything other than humanoids. A spirit can dwell in a tree but it can not actually be connected to a tree. So it is still just a spirit and not an incarnation.

I believe changing realms may or may not be beneficial but even the lowest realm is not Hell.

 

[chinu]

Perhaps you have a different explanation?
Tom

I was asking.. who is observing all this ?

By asking which body part ? I was expecting him to answer that it’s soul inside the human body which is observing all this.

Yes, soul is also the part of human body.