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about the new testament

syo

Well-Known Member
I've read the new testament. My opinion is that it's fake. Jesus is fake. He never existed. Why? Because the books don't make sense at all! :cool:

The books are about miracles that go against nature. Please! :confused:
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
I've read the new testament. My opinion is that it's fake. Jesus is fake. He never existed. Why? Because the books don't make sense at all! :cool:
I'm more or less with you on that. At least the Jesus described in the NT - highly doubtful that he existed. A Jesus may have existed - just not the NT's version.

However, you've opened a can of worms here. You'll probably be bombarded by Christians. Maybe Muslims and Baha'is, too. Good luck.
 

RabbiO

הרב יונה בן זכריה
I've read the new testament. My opinion is that it's fake. Jesus is fake. He never existed. Why? Because the books don't make sense at all! :cool:

The books are about miracles that go against nature. Please! :confused:
Care to flesh this out a bit?
 

syo

Well-Known Member
I'm more or less with you on that. At least the Jesus described in the NT - highly doubtful that he existed. A Jesus may have existed - just not the NT's version.

However, you've opened a can of worms here. You'll probably be bombarded by Christians. Maybe Muslims and Baha'is, too. Good luck.
Isn't it strange that NO historian ever mentioned Jesus?
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
I don't know him. A little information would be nice. What did he say and when?
Flavius Josephus (Hebrew name Yosef ben Matityahu) was a Jewish historian to the Roman emperors. Originally a Judean rebel, he became a turncoat and switched over to the Roman side in exchange for being allowed to live.

Here's what he says about Jesus:
"About this time there lived Jesus, a wise man, if indeed one ought to call him a man. For he was one who performed surprising deeds and was a teacher of such people as accept the truth gladly. He won over many Jews and many of the Greeks. He was the Christ. And when, upon the accusation of the principal men among us, Pilate had condemned him to a cross, those who had first come to love him did not cease. He appeared to them spending a third day restored to life, for the prophets of God had foretold these things and a thousand other marvels about him. And the tribe of the Christians, so called after him, has still to this day not disappeared." (Antiquities of the Jews, 18:3:3) (Josephus on Jesus - Wikipedia)​
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
I've read the new testament. My opinion is that it's fake. Jesus is fake. He never existed. Why? Because the books don't make sense at all! :cool:

The books are about miracles that go against nature. Please! :confused:
Its all borrowed theology with bits and pieces from the vast pantheon of gods and demigods as the early Christians hijacked Judaism with some spins and turns. The books don't even make sense with each other for that matter along with contradicting its own theology such as it is. Especially early Christians and Pauline theology as they mismash the two together to form......

Paste.
 

syo

Well-Known Member
Flavius Josephus (Hebrew name Yosef ben Matityahu) was a Jewish historian to the Roman emperors. Originally a Judean rebel, he became a turncoat and switched over to the Roman side in exchange for being allowed to live.

Here's what he says about Jesus:
"About this time there lived Jesus, a wise man, if indeed one ought to call him a man. For he was one who performed surprising deeds and was a teacher of such people as accept the truth gladly. He won over many Jews and many of the Greeks. He was the Christ. And when, upon the accusation of the principal men among us, Pilate had condemned him to a cross, those who had first come to love him did not cease. He appeared to them spending a third day restored to life, for the prophets of God had foretold these things and a thousand other marvels about him. And the tribe of the Christians, so called after him, has still to this day not disappeared." (Antiquities of the Jews, 18:3:3) (Josephus on Jesus - Wikipedia)​
When was this written?
 

syo

Well-Known Member
Its all borrowed theology with bits and pieces from the vast pantheon of gods and demigods as the early Christians hijacked Judaism with some spins and turns. The books don't even make sense with each other for that matter along with contradicting its own theology such as it is. Especially early Christians and Pauline theology as they mismash the two together to form......

Paste.
Borrowed theology? It's fiction, in my opinion. It has nothing to do with theology, in my opinion. And it hijacked Judaism.
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
When was this written?
According to Wikipedia, around 93-94 CE. Indeed, there's a debate whether this is definitive proof of the existence of Jesus.

Josephus himself lived from 37 CE to 100 CE.
 

syo

Well-Known Member
According to Wikipedia, around 93-94 CE. Indeed, there's a debate whether this is definitive proof of the existence of Jesus.

Josephus himself lived from 37 CE to 100 CE.
It seems to me that all Josephus did was to read an evangelist book. He wasn't a witness but a reader of an evangelion.
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
It seems to me that all Josephus did was to read an evangelist book. He wasn't a witness but a reader of an evangelion.
That's exactly what the debate is about. How about looking into that? (bearing in mind that I'm still on your side in this :))
 

syo

Well-Known Member
That's exactly what the debate is about. How about looking into that? (bearing in mind that I'm still on your side in this :))
Actually, Josephus wrote this from the passage you posted.

About this time there lived Jesus, a wise man, if indeed one ought to call him a man.

If he was a man. A real man and not a fiction man.
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
Actually, Josephus wrote this from the passage you posted.

About this time there lived Jesus, a wise man, if indeed one ought to call him a man.

If he was a man. A real man and not a fiction man.
Now that's a question, isn't it? Is your interpretation of the paragraph the correct one, or not?
Perhaps he meant "one ought to call him a man" as in 'he was more amazing than any average person'? And why? "For he was one who performed surprising deeds and was a teacher of such people as accept the truth gladly."
 

syo

Well-Known Member
Now that's a question, isn't it? Is your interpretation of the paragraph the correct one, or not?
Perhaps he meant "one ought to call him a man" as in 'he was more amazing than any average person'? And why? "For he was one who performed surprising deeds and was a teacher of such people as accept the truth gladly."
I doubt. Did Josephus mention anything else about Jesus?
 

Thief

Rogue Theologian
I've read the new testament. My opinion is that it's fake. Jesus is fake. He never existed. Why? Because the books don't make sense at all! :cool:

The books are about miracles that go against nature. Please! :confused:
ok fine....

but the Carpenter remains my Inspiration
because of the parables

He didn't save anyone by walking on water
He was just showing off

He didn't save anyone by healing the sick
He could....so He did

and He didn't save anyone by dying like He did
that was just the cumulation of events going against Him

His ministry is that of teaching
and He did so in parable
 

Polymath257

Think & Care
Staff member
Premium Member
When was this written?

Josephus was a first century Jewish historian. The difficulty is that the passage in question is very likely to be a later insertion and not original with him. That is, however, debated. Those that think it was an insertion tend to attribute it to Irenaeus.

Josephus does give a LOT of good information about the Levant and its culture and history covering the time when Jesus is supposed to have taught.
 

syo

Well-Known Member
ok fine....

but the Carpenter remains my Inspiration
because of the parables

He didn't save anyone by walking on water
He was just showing off

He didn't save anyone by healing the sick
He could....so He did

and He didn't save anyone by dying like He did
that was just the cumulation of events going against Him

His ministry is that of teaching
and He did so in parable
I see.
 
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