What was your original reason to become a RF member?

[Wu Wei]

I know some people have been members for years, so maybe you don't recall the true reason you signed in to RF the first time. But if you recall it, Why did you choose RF?

I was a religious seeker and RF was a site about religion so it seemed the logical thing to do at the time. I joined a few other religion focuses sites at the time but I no longer go to those

 

[ChristineM]

I joined for the cold beer and hot women.

Ok, I'm here so where is the beer?

 

[Nimos]

I know some people have been members for years, so maybe you don't recall the true reason you signed in to RF the first time. But if you recall it, Why did you choose RF? And how do you feel about RF today? In my case, I signed in because I was in a mood of searching and when seeing RF discussion from the outside it looked really good. But now a little over a year since I become a member I wonder why I bothered in the first place. In one year the RF has declined a lot in what we discuss and how the discussion goes.

And of course, there is the question that been lingering for some time. Why do aggressive Atheists sign in to a religious forum? I don't mind atheists in general, and I respect you're disbelieve, but why choose a religious forum to discuss? Maybe I am wrong, but it almost seems like you trying to tear apart spiritual people and make them suffer???? I do not understand this. Should Spiritual people respect the Atheists but not be respected back??

I can't remember why I original joined, if I could find my first post somehow I would know. But im pretty sure it was back when I started getting an interest in religion and probably asked some question. I then didn't post for a long time.

Some people might see me as one of these aggressive atheists, don't know. But I see nothing wrong in asking questions about what people believe, just as I don't mind them asking or commenting on what I believe.

I think one of the biggest issues and why some atheists might be seen as aggressive, is obviously because some are, just as we get told on a regular basis that we are going to hell, or how we are sinners etc. and other forms of personal attacks, such as we are basically to "stupid" to understand the scriptures. Rarely you will get anything out of such conversations, but I do think it goes both ways.

I do however think that many religious people take critic of scriptures, God/Jesus etc. as a personal attack. And doesn't seem to make a distinction between one criticizing an idea, rather than them personal. So that it can make it appear, at least in some cases as atheists are being aggressive. Obviously only speaking for my self, I will strongly disagree with all religious view as being true, but that doesn't mean that I don't respect the person holding the believe and think they are a terrible person.

Its basically no different than a person expressing racisme and how that is a valid or good idea, I would jump on that as well and how that makes no sense either, regardless of whether they are a believer or not.

But im also not a person that, if I think I present a decent case for why my believe are a certain way in regards to some religious claim and present quotes from scriptures etc backing it up. Then I wont just accept what appears to be some random responds from a believer based on their personal opinion of how they think it ought to be, even if its clear that it is not what the texts say and they present nothing to back it up.

So I agree, in general it would be good if people could comment on ideas or material that is presented rather than making it a personal attack. And in cases where atheists do that, obviously you should respect them just as much as you would anyone else doing it. But always make sure, whether its meant towards you are just one of your ideas.

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

Why did you choose RF?

For me, I like the social interaction, the chance to refine my arguments, the chance to practice writing skills, the chance to assess arguments to identify and name logical fallacies, to learn from people who process information the way I do (faith-free), to share my favorite ideas, and to observe the spectrum of believers compared to the spectrum of unbelievers in a way not possible outside of forums like this one in order to understand the type and degree of impact of faith on thought, intelligence, and education.

And one more reason, which I get to at the bottom of this post : To oppose the bigotry of Christianity, which I do every time I see atheist bashing from Christians as we see in this thread. I am here to rebut Christian atheophobia, and in doing so, hoping to weaken Christianity a little to return the favor.

Why do aggressive Atheists sign in to a religious forum? ... it almost seems like you trying to tear apart spiritual people and make them suffer????

Why do aggressive theists start forums called Religious Forums? And why do they start so many atheist-bashing threads? Isn't that what you're doing here? All I see here are criticisms of atheists and you aligning yourself with the religious. Maybe that's why some of us are here..

This is a common meme - we mean-spirited atheists are on the attack against believers without provocation. I think forum rules prevent me from listing and linking these threads, so I won't, but do a study of your own and count the number of threads begun by theists to criticize and condemn atheists compared the the number in the other direction. We're not the ones on the attack

Nor need we be. Once organized, politicized religion is no longer a threat to secular life, we probably will stop even noticing what the religious are doing much less objecting to it. The Druids once had theocratic control over a people that, had they still had that, would be a cause of concern and criticism by all non-Druids. But today, they have no power, and so get no attention. What would Brigid do? How does she feel about abortion?

Yeah, me neither, and that's how I prefer it. When Christianity and Islam become as irrelevant to those not interested in them as the Druids, religion will have become completely irrelevant to atheists, and they will likely cease inhabiting these threads.

And what are spiritual people? This vague term seems to be bandied about as a badge of superiority, the implication being that if you're not perpetually searching, you have been left behind.

how do you feel about RF today?

I like this forum, especially the software and editing options, but not everything about it. We are not free to be honest with criticisms here.

a reason for my question is that most countries in the world today are more towards living away from spirituality

The West is moving away from religion, which is progress. It is clear to me that man will have had a religious phase that will continue dissipating away until it has the status of flat-earthers and Zeus worshipers, In my estimation, man's religious phase will have been the period between the time when he first developed the intellectual capacity to ask why, and the time when he got his answers. In between, God did it. If you are equating that with moving away from spirituality, then yes, I agree, but as you know, I consider that progress

Once again, spiritual is such an evanescent word with such varied answers as to what it is and how one identifies it that the word really has no definite meaning and I don't know specifically what it is you think that world ois moving away from.

But many people are often "attacked" by Atheists because they believe in something that can not be seen.

So is all criticism however carefully considered, sincerely believed, and constructively offered an attack? Do you view this post as an attack?

Are you now not attacking atheists by your own criterion for attack - criticism?

maybe i am more about finding the answers why Atheists can just let Believers have their belief

Did you mean can't?

We can't stop you from holding your religious beliefs. Nor would most of us want you to. We just want religion confined to the religious. The only religious belief I care about is the belief that somebody has the right to impose their religion on non-volunteers.

i notice, almost every time a religious or spiritual person say something in this forum, there will be an argument with an Atheist down the line.

I notice that you only find fault with atheists. That's common. The religions have taught whoever will listen that atheists are immoral and that they are moral, both untrue. This is the result of Christian demonizing and marginalizing of atheists:

NEW REPORT CASTS ATHEISTS AS "OTHERS" BEYOND MORALITY AND COMMUNITY IN AMERICA
http://www.freethoughtassociation.org/eNews/200604/enews-aa-minnesotastudy.html

"Atheists have become the ultimate scapegoats in our culture... but the news isn't all bad! A new study by the University of Minnesota Department of Sociology has found that Americans perceive Atheists as the group least likely to embrace common values and a shared vision of society. Worse yet, Atheists are identified as the cohort other Americans do not want to see their offspring marrying!

[snip]

"Researchers concluded: "Americans rate atheists below Muslims, recent immigrants, gays and lesbians and other minority groups in 'sharing their vision of American society.' Atheists are also the minority group most Americans are least willing to allow their children to marry." Disturbingly, Atheists are "seen as a threat to the American way of life by a large portion of the American public," despite being only 3% of the U.S. population according to Dr. Edgell, associate sociology professor and the lead researcher in the project."

Do you not think that we have a legitimate gripe against people like that, and are entitled to do whatever we can to neutralize their bigotry?

My oldest daughter is an atheist, and is one of the most selfish individuals I've ever met.

This is what I am talking about. Continual negativity about and to atheists. But you come by it honestly through your religion (see below).

And it is exactly this kind of thinking that makes me anti-theist. As an atheist, I want this continual denigration of atheists to cease, and I believe that I have the right to do whatever I can to oppose the source of all of this demeaning of what is largely a hard-working, law-abiding, decent people trying to support their families and communities being subjected to continual bigotry in the service of a church that feels a need to attack those who can live without it to vaunt itself on the backs of good people.

As I indicated above, this, too, is why I am here - to counter every such attack I see with a scathing rebuking of the source of this hatred, the Christian Bible. Time to get to work.

Look at how much effort is made in that Bible to denigrate those unwilling to submit. Apart from being fit to cast into a lake of fire, according to scripture, unbelievers are lying, corrupt, vile, wicked, abominable, decadent, debauched, godless vessels of darkness in the service of evil, not one of whom does any good, fit to be shunned and to be burned alive forever as enemies of a good god, and the moral equivalent of murderers and whoremongers. Don't believe me? Here's where:

[1] "The fool says in his heart,'There is no God.' They are corrupt, their deeds are vile; there is no one who does good" - Psalm 14:1

[2] "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone." - Revelation 21:8

[3]"Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?"- 2 Corinthians 6:14

[4] Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ." - 1 John 2:22

[5] "Whoever is not with me is against me" - Luke 11:23

[6] “Anyone who does not provide for their relatives, and especially for their own household, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.” - 1 Timothy 5:8

[7] "They are puzzled that you do not continue running with them in the same decadent course of debauchery, so they speak abusively of you" – 1 Peter 4:4​

How selfish and self-serving is it to spread such hate speech and make the lives of so many good people more difficult and more dangerous for a few dollars more in the collection plate?

And what should we think of a religion willing to do that? Should I consider it spiritual or moral?

 

[Spirit of Light]

May i suggest that you report post that offend you. One of the reasons this site is above others is because of the active and fair moderation.

I have done that a few times, but it is kind of not what i want to do, because everyone is entitled to have their own view or opinion. And i don't want to be seen as a person who cant handle a little criticism, But sometimes i want to stand up for those who do not dare say things. (maybe it is wrong of me to do so)?

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

No this is not what i said, I said it would be better if none believers followed the political rules put forth, whereas spiritual people followed the spiritual rules of their chosen path. (of course traffic law of course would be for both sides and practical laws that touch both religious and none religious people.)

So which political rules aren't we atheists following?

Spiritual people should not take part in politics, whereas it's ok for Atheists to do. (i know i had my share of political comments in this forum, and i do really regret them today, i was wrong in my view)

What are you talking about? There is no requirement at all in any secular democracy that politicians must be atheists.......

Actually it is not so much about what I want, it is more toward those who struggle more in a very degraded spiritual society that I hope to be able to help.

"degraded", how exactly?

There are so many spiritual people out there who are afraid of speaking up, because they fear they will be ridiculed and looked down at

Yeah, well.... freedom of opinion, freedom of speech, freedom of/from religion, etc are off course two-way streets.....

Honestly i dont care if Atheists want to tear me apart or not.I kind of have gone past that stage in my life. So why not speak up for those who do not dare?

Do you know that in large parts of the US, arguably the biggest secular democracy in the world, the roles are in fact reversed? There, atheists are the ones that don't dare to come out of the closet because of the social stigma it creates. And the same is true for quite a few regions in Europe.

But personally, I don't consider ridiculing ideas a problem. In fact, I think it's a very important aspect of society and freedom - the right to ridicule. Because ridicule can serve to illuminate ideas, which leads to discussion. Discussion is good. It's an opportunity to learn.

 

[HonestJoe]

I have to agree on this, And my OP is not to ridicule Atheists, but i found that some atheists are more "aggressive" than other atheists in their way of speaking in this forum. I do not want to shut them off or out, I just want a nicer way of being spoken to and with.

Then your issue isn't aggressive atheists, it's aggressive people. You're just ignoring all the ones that aren't atheist, maybe because they're less likely to be aggressive towards you.

 

[Spirit of Light]

For me, I like the social interaction, the chance to refine my arguments, the chance to practice writing skills, the chance to assess arguments to identify and name logical fallacies, to learn from people who process information the way I do (faith-free), to share my favorite ideas, and to observe the spectrum of believers compared to the spectrum of unbelievers in a way not possible outside of forums like this one in order to understand the type and degree of impact of faith on thought, intelligence, and education.

And one more reason, which I get to at the bottom of this post : To oppose the bigotry of Christianity, which I do every time I see atheist bashing from Christians as we see in this thread. I am here to rebut Christian atheophobia, and in doing so, hoping to weaken Christianity a little to return the favor.



Why do aggressive theists start forums called Religious Forums? And why do they start so many atheist-bashing threads? Isn't that what you're doing here? All I see here are criticisms of atheists and you aligning yourself with the religious. Maybe that's why some of us are here..

This is a common meme - we mean-spirited atheists are on the attack against believers without provocation. I think forum rules prevent me from listing and linking these threads, so I won't, but do a study of your own and count the number of threads begun by theists to criticize and condemn atheists compared the the number in the other direction. We're not the ones on the attack

Nor need we be. Once organized, politicized religion is no longer a threat to secular life, we probably will stop even noticing what the religious are doing much less objecting to it. The Druids once had theocratic control over a people that, had they still had that, would be a cause of concern and criticism by all non-Druids. But today, they have no power, and so get no attention. What would Brigid do? How does she feel about abortion?

Yeah, me neither, and that's how I prefer it. When Christianity and Islam become as irrelevant to those not interested in them as the Druids, religion will have become completely irrelevant to atheists, and they will likely cease inhabiting these threads.

And what are spiritual people? This vague term seems to be bandied about as a badge of superiority, the implication being that if you're not perpetually searching, you have been left behind.



I like this forum, especially the software and editing options, but not everything about it. We are not free to be honest with criticisms here.



The West is moving away from religion, which is progress. It is clear to me that man will have had a religious phase that will continue dissipating away until it has the status of flat-earthers and Zeus worshipers, In my estimation, man's religious phase will have been the period between the time when he first developed the intellectual capacity to ask why, and the time when he got his answers. In between, God did it. If you are equating that with moving away from spirituality, then yes, I agree, but as you know, I consider that progress

Once again, spiritual is such an evanescent word with such varied answers as to what it is and how one identifies it that the word really has no definite meaning and I don't know specifically what it is you think that world ois moving away from.



So is all criticism however carefully considered, sincerely believed, and constructively offered an attack? Do you view this post as an attack?

Are you now not attacking atheists by your own criterion for attack - criticism?



Did you mean can't?

We can't stop you from holding your religious beliefs. Nor would most of us want you to. We just want religion confined to the religious. The only religious belief I care about is the belief that somebody has the right to impose their religion on non-volunteers.



I notice that you only find fault with atheists. That's common. The religions have taught whoever will listen that atheists are immoral and that they are moral, both untrue. This is the result of Christian demonizing and marginalizing of atheists:

NEW REPORT CASTS ATHEISTS AS "OTHERS" BEYOND MORALITY AND COMMUNITY IN AMERICA
http://www.freethoughtassociation.org/eNews/200604/enews-aa-minnesotastudy.html

"Atheists have become the ultimate scapegoats in our culture... but the news isn't all bad! A new study by the University of Minnesota Department of Sociology has found that Americans perceive Atheists as the group least likely to embrace common values and a shared vision of society. Worse yet, Atheists are identified as the cohort other Americans do not want to see their offspring marrying!

[snip]

"Researchers concluded: "Americans rate atheists below Muslims, recent immigrants, gays and lesbians and other minority groups in 'sharing their vision of American society.' Atheists are also the minority group most Americans are least willing to allow their children to marry." Disturbingly, Atheists are "seen as a threat to the American way of life by a large portion of the American public," despite being only 3% of the U.S. population according to Dr. Edgell, associate sociology professor and the lead researcher in the project."

Do you not think that we have a legitimate gripe against people like that, and are entitled to do whatever we can to neutralize their bigotry?



This is what I am talking about. Continual negativity about and to atheists. But you come by it honestly through your religion (see below).

And it is exactly this kind of thinking that makes me anti-theist. As an atheist, I want this continual denigration of atheists to cease, and I believe that I have the right to do whatever I can to oppose the source of all of this demeaning of what is largely a hard-working, law-abiding, decent people trying to support their families and communities being subjected to continual bigotry in the service of a church that feels a need to attack those who can live without it to vaunt itself on the backs of good people.

As I indicated above, this, too, is why I am here - to counter every such attack I see with a scathing rebuking of the source of this hatred, the Christian Bible. Time to get to work.

Look at how much effort is made in that Bible to denigrate those unwilling to submit. Apart from being fit to cast into a lake of fire, according to scripture, unbelievers are lying, corrupt, vile, wicked, abominable, decadent, debauched, godless vessels of darkness in the service of evil, not one of whom does any good, fit to be shunned and to be burned alive forever as enemies of a good god, and the moral equivalent of murderers and whoremongers. Don't believe me? Here's where:

[1] "The fool says in his heart,'There is no God.' They are corrupt, their deeds are vile; there is no one who does good" - Psalm 14:1

[2] "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone." - Revelation 21:8

[3]"Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?"- 2 Corinthians 6:14

[4] Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ." - 1 John 2:22

[5] "Whoever is not with me is against me" - Luke 11:23

[6] “Anyone who does not provide for their relatives, and especially for their own household, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.” - 1 Timothy 5:8

[7] "They are puzzled that you do not continue running with them in the same decadent course of debauchery, so they speak abusively of you" – 1 Peter 4:4​

How selfish and self-serving is it to spread such hate speech and make the lives of so many good people more difficult and more dangerous for a few dollars more in the collection plate?

And what should we think of a religion willing to do that? Should I consider it spiritual or moral?

Thank you for your answer, Holy crap thats a long post I will answer some of it.
Do I intend to criticize the atheists or be the way I say Atheists can be toward Spiritual or religious people? No, my intention is not to be a bad person who only make critique of Atheists, there are many religious people who can far worse than any atheist in this world. So i try to not get it to be a one way argument from my side, And this OP is not about me against Atheism.

By the way, yes in the OP i did mean Can`t, and not can Thank you for noticing it.

Even I started a thread that included Atheists and maybe it was in a wrong way, i admit it could seem like i wanted to attack you guys, that was not my intention.
And do i more often then not support people from spiritual or religious background? Maybe I do, but it is not to say that there are many Good Atheists out there too. because there is.

 

[bobhikes]

I was seeking the truth and wanted to understand what I was finding. Other forums were extremely critical of new ideas and contrary opinion. The RF was very liberal and fun. It was still tied to the college at the time. The fun has died down and my need for information has lessened plus a lot of the regulars are regular with the opinions. Because of the loss of new college students all the time the fun and new ideas are curtailed but it is still the most liberal forum I have been on. Removing any group of people from the RF would be wrong. If you can't respect negative opinion you can stay in the DIRS.

 

[osgart]

So which political rules aren't we atheists following?



What are you talking about? There is no requirement at all in any secular democracy that politicians must be atheists.......



"degraded", how exactly?




Yeah, well.... freedom of opinion, freedom of speech, freedom of/from religion, etc are off course two-way streets.....



Do you know that in large parts of the US, arguably the biggest secular democracy in the world, the roles are in fact reversed? There, atheists are the ones that don't dare to come out of the closet because of the social stigma it creates. And the same is true for quite a few regions in Europe.

But personally, I don't consider ridiculing ideas a problem. In fact, I think it's a very important aspect of society and freedom - the right to ridicule. Because ridicule can serve to illuminate ideas, which leads to discussion. Discussion is good. It's an opportunity to learn.

Ridicule breeds contempt. Contempt is a path to polarization. Polarization leads to conflict. Discussion breaks off and violence becomes more possible.

If I were to ridicule a judge for being unfair in a court of law I would be in contempt of court.

Have you ever been ridiculed?

 

[Spirit of Light]

So which political rules aren't we atheists following?

What are you talking about? There is no requirement at all in any secular democracy that politicians must be atheists.......



"degraded", how exactly?




Yeah, well.... freedom of opinion, freedom of speech, freedom of/from religion, etc are off course two-way streets.....



Do you know that in large parts of the US, arguably the biggest secular democracy in the world, the roles are in fact reversed? There, atheists are the ones that don't dare to come out of the closet because of the social stigma it creates. And the same is true for quite a few regions in Europe.

But personally, I don't consider ridiculing ideas a problem. In fact, I think it's a very important aspect of society and freedom - the right to ridicule. Because ridicule can serve to illuminate ideas, which leads to discussion. Discussion is good. It's an opportunity to learn.

So which political rules aren't we atheists following?

What are you talking about? There is no requirement at all in any secular democracy that politicians must be atheists.......
[/QUOTE] My view is that spiritual/religious people should stay away from politics and let others deal with it

"degraded", how exactly?

To me it seems very clear that the world become less an less spiritual, and more and more toward a Atheistic society, that to me is scary, because it is far from what i would like to live under. But maybe you guys think the same about spiritual or religious leadership?

 

[ChristineM]

I have done that a few times, but it is kind of not what i want to do, because everyone is entitled to have their own view or opinion. And i don't want to be seen as a person who cant handle a little criticism, But sometimes i want to stand up for those who do not dare say things. (maybe it is wrong of me to do so)?

It seems here that you object to questions and criticism... Am i wrong?

So stand up for the beleaguered atheist now and again.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Spiritual people should not take part in politics, whereas it's ok for Atheists to do. (i know i had my share of political comments in this forum, and i do really regret them today, i was wrong in my view)

Politics is open to anyone, but in an accountable democracy, the only impositions and restrictions that a government should impose on the people are ones that can be justified to the people.

Any justification that depends on a particular religious belief can't be justified to a large proportion of the people.

There are plenty of issues where a lawmaker's religious belief motivates them to care deeply about an issue, but their stance on that issue can still be justified without religion. This is the case for, say, many social programs and environmental policies. These sorts of things are fine.

This is different from issues where a lawmaker's stance on an issue can't be justified without appealing to religion... such as, for instance, same-sex marriage bans, prohibiting alcohol sales, or tax breaks for churches.

 

[Spirit of Light]

I was seeking the truth and wanted to understand what I was finding. Other forums were extremely critical of new ideas and contrary opinion. The RF was very liberal and fun. It was still tied to the college at the time. The fun has died down and my need for information has lessened plus a lot of the regulars are regular with the opinions. Because of the loss of new college students all the time the fun and new ideas are curtailed but it is still the most liberal forum I have been on. Removing any group of people from the RF would be wrong. If you can't respect negative opinion you can stay in the DIRS.

I would maybe do that, but there is no Falun Gong dir, because i guess i am the only one here who follow that path

 

[Spirit of Light]

It seems here that you object to questions and criticism... Am i wrong?

So stand up for the beleaguered atheist now and again.

I am open to both questions and critique

 

[Spirit of Light]

Politics is open to anyone, but in an accountable democracy, the only impositions and restrictions that a government should impose on the people are ones that can be justified to the people.

Any justification that depends on a particular religious belief can't be justified to a large proportion of the people.

There are plenty of issues where a lawmaker's religious belief motivates them to care deeply about an issue, but their stance on that issue can still be justified without religion. This is the case for, say, many social programs and environmental policies. These sorts of things are fine.

This is different from issues where a lawmaker's stance on an issue can't be justified without appealing to religion... such as, for instance, same-sex marriage bans, prohibiting alcohol sales, or tax breaks for churches.

I do not want to make this in to a discussion about same sex oriented topic, but in my understanding Many religions do say same gender sex is seen as sin or immoral, and yes some go to far in their description of what happens to people who do have sex with person of same gender. But I dont have a personal view of it any more. What others do in the bed is none of my business. so i will stay out of those kind of discussions, even i might have said something before

 

[ChristineM]

I am open to both questions and critique

Ok

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I do not want to make this in to a discussion about same sex oriented topic, but in my understanding Many religions do say same gender sex is seen as sin or immoral, and yes some go to far in their description of what happens to people who do have sex with person of same gender. But I dont have a personal view of it any more. What others do in the bed is none of my business. so i will stay out of those kind of discussions, even i might have said something before

Keeping it general... here's the difference I'm talking about:

- "My religion prohibits this, so I won't do it." - religious freedom. No problem.

- "My religion prohibits this, so YOU aren't allowed to do it." - theocracy. Unacceptable.

Some of the most important laws of my country were passed by religious people acting on their religious faith.

Take universal health care: the person who introduced this in Canada, Tommy Douglas, was a Baptist minister as well as a politician. He proposed universal health care in large part because of his faith: he believed he had a religious duty to see to the well-being of others, especially vulnerable people.

And that's fine. The reason it's fine is that universal health care can be justified without appealing to religion, despite the fact that implementing it was a religious act for the person behind it.

 

[Cooky]

This is what I am talking about. Continual negativity about and to atheists. But you come by it honestly through your religion (see below).

And it is exactly this kind of thinking that makes me anti-theist. As an atheist, I want this continual denigration of atheists to cease, and I believe that I have the right to do whatever I can to oppose the source of all of this demeaning of what is largely a hard-working, law-abiding, decent people trying to support their families and communities being subjected to continual bigotry in the service of a church that feels a need to attack those who can live without it to vaunt itself on the backs of good people.

As I indicated above, this, too, is why I am here - to counter every such attack I see with a scathing rebuking of the source of this hatred, the Christian Bible. Time to get to work.

Look at how much effort is made in that Bible to denigrate those unwilling to submit. Apart from being fit to cast into a lake of fire, according to scripture, unbelievers are lying, corrupt, vile, wicked, abominable, decadent, debauched, godless vessels of darkness in the service of evil, not one of whom does any good, fit to be shunned and to be burned alive forever as enemies of a good god, and the moral equivalent of murderers and whoremongers. Don't believe me? Here's where:

[1] "The fool says in his heart,'There is no God.' They are corrupt, their deeds are vile; there is no one who does good" - Psalm 14:1

[2] "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone." - Revelation 21:8

[3]"Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?"- 2 Corinthians 6:14

[4] Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ." - 1 John 2:22

[5] "Whoever is not with me is against me" - Luke 11:23

[6] “Anyone who does not provide for their relatives, and especially for their own household, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.” - 1 Timothy 5:8

[7] "They are puzzled that you do not continue running with them in the same decadent course of debauchery, so they speak abusively of you" – 1 Peter 4:4​

How selfish and self-serving is it to spread such hate speech and make the lives of so many good people more difficult and more dangerous for a few dollars more in the collection plate?

And what should we think of a religion willing to do that? Should I consider it spiritual or moral?

Or are you just being selfish, like my daughter? Looking out solely for your own interests, which includes denigrating religiosity and destroying other people's faith, since you have none?

...Just like you abandoned the United States, and hate it too?

Honestly, it all seems very self-serving and one sided... Your side.

 

[stvdv]

And of course, there is the question that been lingering for some time. Why do aggressive Atheists sign in to a religious forum? I don't mind atheists in general, and I respect you're disbelieve, but why choose a religious forum to discuss?

I need very little introspection to pinpoint the exact reason, why they do that. And I don't blame them. And if God exists then God would approve IMO