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Understanding the holy scriptures is impossible unless God gives you the interpretation

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
So why do you think there's two different lineages?
I mean, the theory is the Gospels were all put together
a century or so after Jesus, carefully crafted to make
it appear they were contemporaneous with Jesus. Yet
they made his huge blooper.
That is not the only blooper in them. What one should be asking is if one is supposedly Joseph's line and one is supposedly Mary's line why did they not say so from the start? In fact over the years both have been argued to be either Mary or Joseph's line. This is a a huge mistake. It is even larger than Luke's ten year gestation period.
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
1 Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
This is just nonsense. It's just another reason to reject the New Testament. Every person has both an inclination to good and an inclination to evil.
 

PruePhillip

Well-Known Member
That is not the only blooper in them. What one should be asking is if one is supposedly Joseph's line and one is supposedly Mary's line why did they not say so from the start? In fact over the years both have been argued to be either Mary or Joseph's line. This is a a huge mistake. It is even larger than Luke's ten year gestation period.

Bottom line is - we don't know. Leave it at that.
You don't reject science when it doesn't know something, why do it with the bible?

Previous generations didn't understand how life could emerge from the sea - but
they accepted that is what Genesis said.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Bottom line is - we don't know. Leave it at that.
You don't reject science when it doesn't know something, why do it with the bible?

Previous generations didn't understand how life could emerge from the sea - but
they accepted that is what Genesis said.
The problem is that the Bible makes contradictory claims and claims that are clearly false. And reinterpreting Genesis after the fact does not help. It is better to treat the first two books of the Bible as morality tales.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
It is interesting that the apostle Paul should mention this.
And Jesus said not to trust those who come after him and speak in his name for they are false prophets. Paul did indeed come after Jesus. Why should he be trusted when Jesus himself said not to?
 

Dan From Smithville

What's up Doc?
Staff member
Premium Member
1 Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
If a 1000 people all provide a 1000 different interpretations, then a real Christian will know which ones are false, because God will let him know? What about those seeking God, but not yet there? How will they know? If God is directing all of us personally why do Christians need to witness to others? This sounds confusing. Are you sure it is this easy?
 

Dan From Smithville

What's up Doc?
Staff member
Premium Member
Everyone is entitled to their beliefs including the Christians and ourselves. Many Christians don’t believe in taking all of Genesis literally as the scientific evidence that contradicts a young earth and a worldwide flood is overwhelming. If people want to ignore science that is their prerogative. In this modern era religion and science need to be in harmony. If religion insists on what science has categorically proved then that belief is mere superstition Imho.
I agree that people have the right to believe as they choose, even if it against overwhelming evidence to the claims you mentioned. However, it is different when they start using that belief as fact to drive changes that effect others that may believe differently or not at all. Like demanding science education be diluted or discarded in favor of religious teachings.
 

Dan From Smithville

What's up Doc?
Staff member
Premium Member
All that is obvious.

My question, though, has to do with
two people fervently claiming they got
the truth from god, bu getting opposite
results.

Do you want to address that, or not.
That is my question too. Except I had more people in mine.
 

Dawnofhope

Non-Proselytizing Baha'i
Staff member
Premium Member
I think it boils down to how you understand the Hebrew word “day” (yom) as used in Genesis. (I see lengths of time implied, as in Day 3: ”Let the land produce vegetation”....i mean, that takes a while. Same w/ the animals producing

That certainly makes sense as to why you would consider the earth would be old and also retaining a literal reading of the Genesis account of Noah.

Let me ask you: in Luke 3, it provides the genealogy of Jesus; his lineage. Would you expect those to be genuine people? Of course!

It mentions Noah and Adam, as Jesus’ ancestors.

You are clearly unfamiliar with how Baha’is view the Bible. Adam and Noah are real people. However their lives have been mythologised. So no talking serpent literally tempting Eve in the garden of Eden and no world wide flood where all the animals of the world are gathered together on the Ark.

Furthermore, in discussing divorce, Jesus directly quoted from Genesis @ Matthew 19:4-6, saying God “made them male and female,.....and the man must stick to his wife.

This would have no force, if Jesus were relating an allegorical account to real life situations...

The solution isn’t seeing the Bible as wholly literal or allegorical. Rather a careful exegesis is required. Wisdom and discernment are needed.
 

Dan From Smithville

What's up Doc?
Staff member
Premium Member
Sounds like a dodge... " I understand Holy Scripture because God has granted me understanding, YOU don't understand because God hasn't given you understanding, therefore I can claim anything I like, and when it's illogical gibberish, I just condescendingly say God hasn't given you understanding "
I have wealth and prosperity, because I am truly faithful and a true believer. You don't have all the worldly, material possessions I have, because your faith is weak and you don't really believe. Really the same claim with a dollar sign added.
 

Dawnofhope

Non-Proselytizing Baha'i
Staff member
Premium Member
I agree that people have the right to believe as they choose, even if it against overwhelming evidence to the claims you mentioned. However, it is different when they start using that belief as fact to drive changes that effect others that may believe differently or not at all. Like demanding science education be diluted or discarded in favor of religious teachings.

I live in a country called New Zealand where religious fundamentalists don’t make unreasonable demands on the education system. I personally like and respect Christians and value maintaining a positive relationship with this community as well as members from other faith communities. I had a strong science component to my education which is one of the foundations of my work. So I believe in the harmony of science and religion as do many Christians I know.
 

Hockeycowboy

Witness for Jehovah
Premium Member
I have wealth and prosperity, because I am truly faithful and a true believer. You don't have all the worldly, material possessions I have, because your faith is weak and you don't really believe. Really the same claim with a dollar sign added.
Man, I’m as po’ as dust! I guess I need more faith, then.
 

Dan From Smithville

What's up Doc?
Staff member
Premium Member
I live in a country called New Zealand where religious fundamentalists don’t make unreasonable demands on the education system. I personally like and respect Christians and value maintaining a positive relationship with this community as well as members from other faith communities. I had a strong science component to my education which is one of the foundations of my work. So I believe in the harmony of science and religion as do many Christians I know.
I believe in it too, but am noting that not all do. Some are very vocal and insistent about it. Forcing their views into areas like public education disrupts that harmony.
 

PruePhillip

Well-Known Member
The problem is that the Bible makes contradictory claims and claims that are clearly false. And reinterpreting Genesis after the fact does not help. It is better to treat the first two books of the Bible as morality tales.

Okay, but it says that God commanded the seas to bring forth life.
That's pretty straight forward. It offended generations of bible
readers until Darwin's "little warm pond."

You have to read these things in a nuanced and sensitive fashion.
And regards the morality tales - people reject the "morality" tales
more than they reject the "tales." The stories of a united monarchy,
a King David, a prophet called Isaiah, a period known as the Exile
etc. might or might not be true - but the morality issues are firmly
rejected in "our" drug addled and adulterous world.
 

Hockeycowboy

Witness for Jehovah
Premium Member
Perhaps you better had. I live near one of the big proponents of that claim. Million dollar homes, luxury cars and private jets.

The claim of prosperity has as much evidence as being from God as an interpretation does.
Man, I’m so poor, I can’t even pay attention! I must be a heathen.
 

Dawnofhope

Non-Proselytizing Baha'i
Staff member
Premium Member
...And God’s help. Luke 10:21.

Since He provides enlightenment....do you think obedience would be a factor?

Why would you presume peoples of other faiths neither believe in the same God you do or would be inclined to lawlessness?
 
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