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The trinity debate - Is it monotheism?

firedragon

Veteran Member
The trinity is in the belief that the father, the son and the holy spirit are one person. God. Even if it was 10 different entities it is still the one God. Thus, does that mean it's monotheism? Lets not mix this up with idolatry as many Muslims would because this question is not from an Islamic perspective but purely from Aqal or reason where if you take the Quran, have you questioned if it actually makes the trinity polytheism?

Also if one believes that Paul was a believer in the trinity as we perceive now, he also made a distinction in his usage of idolatry. For him idolatry is another sin and depicts an image worship.

Others would argue that its not monotheism because there are several entities. Though it is one God there are actually three different entities thus it becomes polytheism.

What do you perceive?
 

Nimos

Well-Known Member
The trinity is in the belief that the father, the son and the holy spirit are one person. God. Even if it was 10 different entities it is still the one God. Thus, does that mean it's monotheism? Lets not mix this up with idolatry as many Muslims would because this question is not from an Islamic perspective but purely from Aqal or reason where if you take the Quran, have you questioned if it actually makes the trinity polytheism?

Also if one believes that Paul was a believer in the trinity as we perceive now, he also made a distinction in his usage of idolatry. For him idolatry is another sin and depicts an image worship.

Others would argue that its not monotheism because there are several entities. Though it is one God there are actually three different entities thus it becomes polytheism.

What do you perceive?
If one can get their head around the trinity and how exactly it is suppose to work. I guess one can argue that we are talking about monotheism.

Personally I do not buy the trinity and think Jesus or his followers saw him as the son of God, exactly as he also say in the bible. It doesn't mean that we are not talking about just one God, as Jesus never claimed, as far as I know, to be greater than or equal to that of God.
 

danieldemol

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
The trinity is in the belief that the father, the son and the holy spirit are one person. God. Even if it was 10 different entities it is still the one God. Thus, does that mean it's monotheism? Lets not mix this up with idolatry as many Muslims would because this question is not from an Islamic perspective but purely from Aqal or reason where if you take the Quran, have you questioned if it actually makes the trinity polytheism?

Also if one believes that Paul was a believer in the trinity as we perceive now, he also made a distinction in his usage of idolatry. For him idolatry is another sin and depicts an image worship.

Others would argue that its not monotheism because there are several entities. Though it is one God there are actually three different entities thus it becomes polytheism.

What do you perceive?
It seems to me that if many Muslims can believe that Allah has a face and a hand then they should for consistency also be comfortable with the Christians who also believe in Allah having a face, hands etc.

Of course I don’t believe Allah has a face and a hand so i’m possibly more monotheistic in that sense than many Muslims and Christians.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
It seems to me that if many Muslims can believe that Allah has a face and a hand then they should for consistency also be comfortable with the Christians who also believe in Allah having a face, hands etc.

Of course I don’t believe Allah has a face and a hand so i’m possibly more monotheistic in that sense than many Muslims and Christians.

Brother. Believing God has a hand or a leg doesnt make it polytheism. It could be monotheism with an anthromorphisation in their beliefs. Anyway there is a big difference in the concept of polytheism between Islam and what you have portrayed. Also a face of God is also misunderstood by you. It doesnt mean a physical face but a direction. Also, i am not addressing hypocrisy of Muslims or anyone but a discussion of reason to understand views as i have tried to explain in the OP.
 

Soapy

Son of his Father: The Heir and Prince
Others would argue that its not monotheism because there are several entities. Though it is one God there are actually three different entities thus it becomes polytheism.
The argument that a trinity God is polytheism is perfectly right. It is impossible to claim that three PERSONS are ONE and the SAME God when it is then claimed that God is, himself (?), a PERSON.
This would be worse than having a schizophrenic personality.
It is claimed that the three persons each are in EQUALLY POWERSHIP and AUTHORSHIP because GOD is ESSENCE AND NATURE.
What do you see now? Absolutely, the trinity fraternity have realised that God cannot be a PERSON if there are three (or more than one) who are PERSONS IN GOD... so God now becomes an ENTITY and not a PERSON... isn’t that odd?
Moreover, if God, is ‘ESSENCE and NATURE of which the three share in’ then that makes God an ENVELOPING entity OVER AND AROUND the three persons!! Not possible!! The three are then ‘IN GOD’ and not ‘ARE GOD’.
Consider also that if the three are co-equal and co-everything-else as well, then WHY is there a need for THREE... All things any one of them can do (which is everything) each of the others can also do... there needs only be ONE! But yet we find Trinitarians claiming that the three are RANKED...(???!!) with the Father being the greater (YET EQUAL to the Son, and EQUAL to the Holy Spirit! And by the way, Trinitarians do not answer if you ask if the Father is equal to the Son, or equal to the Holy Spirit... can you see why??)
So, how can there be RANK ORDER in an absolutely CO-EQUAL system?
Trinity even DECLARES that the Father is the CREATOR of ALL THINGS yet turn later to say that the SON CREATED ALL THINGS... notice that they never claim that the Holy Spirit created all things... is that odd? Absolutely - odd, unbalanced, and destroys the ideology of a co-equal trinity belief system.
‘Father’ means, ‘he who creates’, ‘he who brings forth’, ‘he who is the head’... and scriptures tells us that the Father is God...
‘Son’ means ‘He who does exactly what the Father directs him to do’... Jesus QUALIFIES this by saying that the words they hear him speak are ‘Not his but those of him who sent him’ (aka: the Father... aka: GOD) So how can he be God if God sent him and TAUGHT him... does an emissary claim to be the king who told him what to say... no! He claims to be SENT BY THE KING and was TAUGHT by the King what it is he should do and say... ‘if I am not doing the works of my Father then do not believe me - but if I am...then believe he sent me’(paraphrased)
By the way, ‘SENT BY GOD’ (sent by the Father) has NOTHING to do with ‘From Heaven’. Jesus NEVER EVER claimed to be ‘FROM HEAVEN’... Being ‘Sent’ is a term used to show that Jesus was given the go-ahead to ‘Face the Evil of the World’. You will see that Jesus did not do anything before he was baptised WITH the Holy Spirit (note, not BY the Holy Spirit... understand the difference!!). At this, he acquired the PERMISSION and ABILITY to use the POWER and AUTHORITY of the OFFICE OF GOD... This does not make him God, but only to USE the power of God. Having this ability, he was sent into the wilderness to be TEMPTED as to whether he would misuse these powers for his own vanity or selfishness or desperation. He was starving and could have turned ‘dust’ into food. He could show off the world by jumping of the temple and land safely (notice that the angels are the ownership of FATHER - alone!). And... Satan tempted him to ::: acquire RULERSHIP OVER CREATION without going through the pain, anguish, suffering, trauma, humiliation, and DEATH of a wholly innocent and holy MAN. ‘It is MINE to give to whom I will... but you can have it if you (foolishly) bow down and worship me!’. What do you see here (for another discussion!) Satan is STEWARD over creation - he is a angel in charge OVER creation waiting to hand over RULERSHIP to one of HUMANITY. This qualifies Jesus as ‘one from humanity’, a MAN. Who can claim what trinity incredibly IMPLIES: that The Son (whom they claim is God... who is IN GOD.... oh, erm, EQUAL TO GOD... which is it!!?) is going to suffer and die in order to acquire rulership over what he, as God!, ALREADY is ruler over, yeah, is ruler over the GREATER KINGDOM OF HEAVEN. Is that strange? Absolutely!!
Go back to basics:
  • What was the purpose of Jesus’ quest?
  • What was the REWARD for accomplishing the quest?
  • Why was Adam said to be, ‘Son of God’ and then Jesus being called, ‘The Last Adam’?
  • Why did God (in whatever form!) create the world? Did he not seek to make a human Being Ruler over it... did not Adam fail by sinning so another ‘Adam’ was brought up to replace him... think about this and you should conclude why Jesus is MAN in the manner of Adam: created in the manner of Adam to replace the first Adam who sinned.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
I don’t think this is the belief of all Muslims.

Well, you can know today, that the belief of most Muslims, in any madhab or sect is that there is no anthropomorphic attribution to God. In the past there were official Fikh on this matter a few centuries after Muhammed. but not any more.

Anyway, that is irrelevant to the topic.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
The argument that a trinity God is polytheism is perfectly right. It is impossible to claim that three PERSONS are ONE and the SAME God when it is then claimed that God is, himself (?), a PERSON.
This would be worse than having a schizophrenic personality.
It is claimed that the three persons each are in EQUALLY POWERSHIP and AUTHORSHIP because GOD is ESSENCE AND NATURE.
What do you see now? Absolutely, the trinity fraternity have realised that God cannot be a PERSON if there are three (or more than one) who are PERSONS IN GOD... so God now becomes an ENTITY and not a PERSON... isn’t that odd?
Moreover, if God, is ‘ESSENCE and NATURE of which the three share in’ then that makes God an ENVELOPING entity OVER AND AROUND the three persons!! Not possible!! The three are then ‘IN GOD’ and not ‘ARE GOD’.
Consider also that if the three are co-equal and co-everything-else as well, then WHY is there a need for THREE... All things any one of them can do (which is everything) each of the others can also do... there needs only be ONE! But yet we find Trinitarians claiming that the three are RANKED...(???!!) with the Father being the greater (YET EQUAL to the Son, and EQUAL to the Holy Spirit! And by the way, Trinitarians do not answer if you ask if the Father is equal to the Son, or equal to the Holy Spirit... can you see why??)
So, how can there be RANK ORDER in an absolutely CO-EQUAL system?
Trinity even DECLARES that the Father is the CREATOR of ALL THINGS yet turn later to say that the SON CREATED ALL THINGS... notice that they never claim that the Holy Spirit created all things... is that odd? Absolutely - odd, unbalanced, and destroys the ideology of a co-equal trinity belief system.
‘Father’ means, ‘he who creates’, ‘he who brings forth’, ‘he who is the head’... and scriptures tells us that the Father is God...
‘Son’ means ‘He who does exactly what the Father directs him to do’... Jesus QUALIFIES this by saying that the words they hear him speak are ‘Not his but those of him who sent him’ (aka: the Father... aka: GOD) So how can he be God if God sent him and TAUGHT him... does an emissary claim to be the king who told him what to say... no! He claims to be SENT BY THE KING and was TAUGHT by the King what it is he should do and say... ‘if I am not doing the works of my Father then do not believe me - but if I am...then believe he sent me’(paraphrased)
By the way, ‘SENT BY GOD’ (sent by the Father) has NOTHING to do with ‘From Heaven’. Jesus NEVER EVER claimed to be ‘FROM HEAVEN’... Being ‘Sent’ is a term used to show that Jesus was given the go-ahead to ‘Face the Evil of the World’. You will see that Jesus did not do anything before he was baptised WITH the Holy Spirit (note, not BY the Holy Spirit... understand the difference!!). At this, he acquired the PERMISSION and ABILITY to use the POWER and AUTHORITY of the OFFICE OF GOD... This does not make him God, but only to USE the power of God. Having this ability, he was sent into the wilderness to be TEMPTED as to whether he would misuse these powers for his own vanity or selfishness or desperation. He was starving and could have turned ‘dust’ into food. He could show off the world by jumping of the temple and land safely (notice that the angels are the ownership of FATHER - alone!). And... Satan tempted him to ::: acquire RULERSHIP OVER CREATION without going through the pain, anguish, suffering, trauma, humiliation, and DEATH of a wholly innocent and holy MAN. ‘It is MINE to give to whom I will... but you can have it if you (foolishly) bow down and worship me!’. What do you see here (for another discussion!) Satan is STEWARD over creation - he is a angel in charge OVER creation waiting to hand over RULERSHIP to one of HUMANITY. This qualifies Jesus as ‘one from humanity’, a MAN. Who can claim what trinity incredibly IMPLIES: that The Son (whom they claim is God... who is IN GOD.... oh, erm, EQUAL TO GOD... which is it!!?) is going to suffer and die in order to acquire rulership over what he, as God!, ALREADY is ruler over, yeah, is ruler over the GREATER KINGDOM OF HEAVEN. Is that strange? Absolutely!!
Go back to basics:
  • What was the purpose of Jesus’ quest?
  • What was the REWARD for accomplishing the quest?
  • Why was Adam said to be, ‘Son of God’ and then Jesus being called, ‘The Last Adam’?
  • Why did God (in whatever form!) create the world? Did he not seek to make a human Being Ruler over it... did not Adam fail by sinning so another ‘Adam’ was brought up to replace him... think about this and you should conclude why Jesus is MAN in the manner of Adam: created in the manner of Adam to replace the first Adam who sinned.

I agree with you. I dont believe in the trinity of course, i am not debating the trinity here. Is it monotheism or is it polytheism? Thats the question. Thank you very much for your thoughts but i would like to hear your thoughts on this too. That is if you have time but no fuss. Thanks again.
 

Soapy

Son of his Father: The Heir and Prince
If one can get their head around the trinity and how exactly it is suppose to work. I guess one can argue that we are talking about monotheism.

Personally I do not buy the trinity and think Jesus or his followers saw him as the son of God, exactly as he also say in the bible. It doesn't mean that we are not talking about just one God, as Jesus never claimed, as far as I know, to be greater than or equal to that of God.
“the son of God”...
I rant and rage over the meaning of this term. I cannot believe that virtually the whole of Christendom cannot understand that it does not pertain to a procreated being... that God does not Procreate... he only Creates... hence his humanised title of ‘Father’, which means:
  • He who CREATES
  • He who BRINGS FORTH
  • He who is The Head
God CREATED the heavenly host of spiritual beings, messengers, workers... we call them ‘Angels’ (which is just the Greekish: ‘Angelos’) We should bare this in mind always and not think that ‘Angel’ is specific to the host alone: anyone sent by God to do good works is, in effect, an ‘Angelos’.

God, the Father (not ’God the Father’), used the Angelos’s during the creation of the world. You will read that this sounds heretical because it is claimed that God created the world and all in it by himself. Well, this IS TRUE. He DID. But remember that the ‘angels’ (I’ll use this version for simplicity) are effectively ‘Tools’ (immensely powerful and hugely intelligent) hence no matter how they appear to humanity, they MUST NOT BE BOWED DOWN TO!!! Hence, no reference is made as to their part in creation less anyone should seek to exalt them... which, strangely (and what we believe!!!) was the cause of the LEADING ANGEL, who came to be given the warning title of SATAN, thought to claim for himself: He desired worship from Man (first, from Adam, thence from all humanity!). Notice that it was SOLELY the INERT BODY of Adam that was created... it was not a LIVING SOUL. It was not until GOD put THE BREATH OF LIFE into the body that Adam became a LIVING SOUL. Creating a BODY is not a hard thing (for a Spiritual Being) - it is the ENLIVENING of that body that matters. Hence you see later that the set of rebellious angels ‘CREATED BODIES FOR THEMSELVES’ and put THEMSELVES as enlivening spirits into them, thus creating living humanised beings that were greater in certain ways than God made, powers more than God set for true humans. God later destroyed them by body and released the angel spirits to darkness and spiritual death after judgement at the end of time.
So, now you see what is meant by, ‘Let us make man in our image’... it means God was talking with the ANGELS. He conversed with then that, after creating the basic universe and non-Godly-spiritual creatures, that they should create a God-Spirit-based being WITH INTELLIGENCE AND POWER LIKE UNTO THEM. These creatures, mankind, were to be manage the world, manage the other creatures, to be SENTIENT above them (as we see we are!) BUT KEEP BEARING IN MIND that ultimately it is the IMAGE OF GOD that we conform to... AND that we are also ‘SERVANTS’ of God... which the Angels are, also! So do not seek to claim I am claiming we are ‘of the angels’ but merely stating that we have, like them, power and authority and intelligence greater than base animals.
And so, God put the Spirit of life into the body of the first man, Adam. Adam is ‘Image of God’. He is a ruler, Judge, Father of all who comes after him, he ‘husbands’ the animals, and manages his environment by the power of God’s Holy Spirit. He does exactly as God tells him, asks him, demands of him, shows him... he is the PERFECT physical earthly IMAGE of HIS CREATOR, his Father: God... he is, ‘SON OF GOD’ (Luke 3:38).
We read that this same Adam was deceived by ... Satan ... and stepped away from following what God told him to do (and what NOT TO DO!!) This is Sin, and unforgivable sin. Thus Adam became NOLONGER. a full follower of the Father, he became no longer: ‘Son of God’.
Jump forward... God desired salvation from Adam’s sin by the death of ANOTHER ADAM... that is to say, another human being MADE IN THE SAME MANNER AS THE FIRST ADAM.
No angels are directly involved here because the BODY of this ‘Last Adam’ is the Egg of the Virgin girl, Mary. The egg, discharged on a monthly basis in a woman, is the base BODY of a baby... but it is INERT (remember???) In human PROCREATION it is the SPERM from a man that ENLIVENS the egg to start the foetal process. Spiritually, the SIN is in the Sperm, so impregnating by a man could not produce a sinless and Holy child as all of humanity is in sin. Thus, God ENLIVENED the egg in Mary by means of his Holy Spirit... ‘The Power of the almighty (Holy Spirit!!) will overshadow you AND THEREFORE the child to be born to you will be HOLY and called, THE SON OF GOD’...
Please, can you see this... Jesus is made in the same manner as the first Adam... hence Jesus is also the LAST ADAM... no other ADAM will be created.
So here we have a second go at a pure, holy, and sinless MAN. This one, God said:
  • “Behold my servant, whom I uphold, my chosen, in whom my soul delights; I have put my Spirit upon him; he will bring forth justice to the nations.“ Isaiah 42:1
In case you don’t know it, the word, ‘Servant’ in Hebrew, also means ‘SON’!!!
So Jesus is NOT GOD but THE SON OF GOD: he will (and does) EXACTLY what God taught him and showed him to do... he is THE ONLY HUMAN BEING to do so eternally and therefore is THE ONLY SON OF GOD... the Son in place of the first Son, Adam!
And see that this theme of ‘The First Son sins’ and another is ‘brought up to REPLACE HIM’ is repeated as testament in scriptures:
  • Cain sinned, Seth was brought up in position as ‘Most Beloved of the Father (‘Firstborn’)
  • Ishmael sinned, Isaac was made firstborn
  • Esau sinned, Jacob was made firstborn
  • ... Joseph
  • ... David
  • ... Solomon
  • ADAM, JESUS
This revelation of the ‘firstborn’ (most beloved of the Father) must not be seen as being in any way a diminishing of Jesus’ accomplishment. Those that came before are prophesying the future. Scriptures validates itself and so these examples stand as testament when naysayers try to destroy the word of God. One verse or so may be changed and modified here and there but check diligently and you will qualify from elsewhere the truth. For instance, Jesus NEVER claimed to be God. He stated emphatically:
  • ‘I did not call myself God’
  • ‘I said only that I was the Son of God’
  • ‘My Father taught me what to say and do’
  • ‘I can ONLY do what I see my Father doing’
  • ‘Of the day and hour only the Father knows, not even the SON!’
  • ‘My Father is greater than I’
  • ‘I am going to MY GOD...’ (notice he did not say he was ‘going BACK to his Father’)
  • (Elsewhere by the Apostles: ‘The time that the Father has set aside for himself’
These are but a few that shows that Jesus was not God and always put GOD, his Father, FIRST... Can ‘God’ put himself SECOND to anyone?

And for those who wrongfully claim that Jesus had two personalities... I feel sorry that you say this! You are frivolously claiming that the greatest man on earth is... schizophrenic!!!
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
What do you perceive?
IMO:
It is an attempt to show the unity in diversity. To not see many Gods. Father, Son and Holy Spirit is actually just 1; God.

Maybe a visionair got this image, or, like with many parables a higher truth was given, veiled by a story. And that's how parables work, all take from it at their own level at the time . And that seems good to me. Spirituality is all about growing and learning.

So, people drowned in duality naturally won't be able to see, let alone accept, such non dual view. That makes sense to me.

Koran is very clear about this non dual view. Christians are more in dualistic thinking I think. Otherwise they would at least accept that part from Koran.

In India all these views live together. As a child you learn lots about duality, not much about Advaita. Later on some read about Advaita and accept this, others don't accept. Some never read about it, so never know there could be something different.

Like exams. Some are easy, some are tough. Non dual view is known to be more difficult. Understandable as the world is flooded with duality this feels naturally more close. And flooded with duality it's easy to drown and never get out of it. All God's Grace and Self Effort.

Like in class room, it's not about good or bad. It's about which subjects you studied and for which subjects you past the exam.
 
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1213

Well-Known Member
The trinity...
What do you perceive?

I think it is not Biblical. If person is a disciple of Jesus (“Christian”), I recommend to remain in the teachings Bible has. Bible tells clearly that there is only one true God that is greater than Jesus.

This is eternal life, that they should know you, the only true God, and him whom you sent, Jesus Christ.
John 17:3

the Father is greater than I.
John 14:28

For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
1 Timothy 2:5

Much easier to remain in that and not invent own doctrines that can’t be supported with the Bible.
 

Soapy

Son of his Father: The Heir and Prince
I think it is not Biblical. If person is a disciple of Jesus (“Christian”), I recommend to remain in the teachings Bible has. Bible tells clearly that there is only one true God that is greater than Jesus.

This is eternal life, that they should know you, the only true God, and him whom you sent, Jesus Christ.
John 17:3

the Father is greater than I.
John 14:28

For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
1 Timothy 2:5

Much easier to remain in that and not invent own doctrines that can’t be supported with the Bible.
What you wrote is perfectly correct. Well done. Not many people understand these simple statements.
 

Soapy

Son of his Father: The Heir and Prince
It’s an extremely important topic. Allow it to be perused as often as it surfaces in the maelstrom of false ideology.
I came across it and was glad to see it and be able to respond to state that trinity is false and seeks to place Jesus on the throne of God just as Satan sought to do god himself. Satan seeks for us to put Jesus there so we can profane the integrity of the true scriptures:
  • Jesus is a man, the last Adam, born in holiness and sinlessness just as the first Adam was born in holiness and sinlessness
  • Adam was Son of God (Luke 3:38)in the days before he sinned (Son of God does not mean a procreation of God but rather someone who wholly and fully does the works of his Father)
  • Jesus took over from Adam and remained sinless and Holy and was empowered with the Holy Spirit of God - this he was able to do things said only to be able to be done BY God. This does not MAKE him God (Joseph in Egypt during the famine was given the power to act AS PHAROAH to oversee the famine. Jesus is given power to ACT AS GOD until the world is set to rights. Once achieved BOTH ‘HAND BACK POWER TO HIM WHO GAVE IT TO HIM’
  • Jesus, died to save us from the sin of Adam and was resurrected and taken up to heaven to, among other things, and after the last, RULE OVER CREATION ... why would [a] God who rules a greater unlimited spiritual kingdom of Heaven desire to degrade himself to BECOME RULER over a limited physical flesh world?
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
It’s an extremely important topic. Allow it to be perused as often as it surfaces in the maelstrom of false ideology.
I came across it and was glad to see it and be able to respond to state that trinity is false and seeks to place Jesus on the throne of God just as Satan sought to do god himself. Satan seeks for us to put Jesus there so we can profane the integrity of the true scriptures:
  • Jesus is a man, the last Adam, born in holiness and sinlessness just as the first Adam was born in holiness and sinlessness
  • Adam was Son of God (Luke 3:38)in the days before he sinned (Son of God does not mean a procreation of God but rather someone who wholly and fully does the works of his Father)
  • Jesus took over from Adam and remained sinless and Holy and was empowered with the Holy Spirit of God - this he was able to do things said only to be able to be done BY God. This does not MAKE him God (Joseph in Egypt during the famine was given the power to act AS PHAROAH to oversee the famine. Jesus is given power to ACT AS GOD until the world is set to rights. Once achieved BOTH ‘HAND BACK POWER TO HIM WHO GAVE IT TO HIM’
  • Jesus, died to save us from the sin of Adam and was resurrected and taken up to heaven to, among other things, and after the last, RULE OVER CREATION ... why would [a] God who rules a greater unlimited spiritual kingdom of Heaven desire to degrade himself to BECOME RULER over a limited physical flesh world?

The topic is not about the validity or invalidity of the trinity.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
The trinity is in the belief that the father, the son and the holy spirit are one person. God. Even if it was 10 different entities it is still the one God. Thus, does that mean it's monotheism? Lets not mix this up with idolatry as many Muslims would because this question is not from an Islamic perspective but purely from Aqal or reason where if you take the Quran, have you questioned if it actually makes the trinity polytheism?

Also if one believes that Paul was a believer in the trinity as we perceive now, he also made a distinction in his usage of idolatry. For him idolatry is another sin and depicts an image worship.

Others would argue that its not monotheism because there are several entities. Though it is one God there are actually three different entities thus it becomes polytheism.

What do you perceive?

It's monotheism. It was put to me like this with an egg. You have the white, yolk, and shell. Each are divided but together, they make "one" egg not three.

If the christian viewed jesus, spirit, and creator differently, than yes, it wouldn't be monotheism since polytheism gods tend to have their own unique "personality." But in this case, no. I guess you can say it's a funky kinda monotheism from christia perspective. Biblically, it's pure god-only. Mediums/messengers aren't the source but I can see how they are related.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
It's monotheism. It was put to me like this with an egg. You have the white, yolk, and shell. Each are divided but together, they make "one" egg not three.

If the christian viewed jesus, spirit, and creator differently, than yes, it wouldn't be monotheism since polytheism gods tend to have their own unique "personality." But in this case, no. I guess you can say it's a funky kinda monotheism from christia perspective. Biblically, it's pure god-only. Mediums/messengers aren't the source but I can see how they are related.

Hmm. Well, I must agree. That's a sount thought I think. Thanks.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
It’s an extremely important topic. Allow it to be perused as often as it surfaces in the maelstrom of false ideology.
I came across it and was glad to see it and be able to respond to state that trinity is false and seeks to place Jesus on the throne of God just as Satan sought to do god himself. Satan seeks for us to put Jesus there so we can profane the integrity of the true scriptures:
  • Jesus is a man, the last Adam, born in holiness and sinlessness just as the first Adam was born in holiness and sinlessness
  • Adam was Son of God (Luke 3:38)in the days before he sinned (Son of God does not mean a procreation of God but rather someone who wholly and fully does the works of his Father)
  • Jesus took over from Adam and remained sinless and Holy and was empowered with the Holy Spirit of God - this he was able to do things said only to be able to be done BY God. This does not MAKE him God (Joseph in Egypt during the famine was given the power to act AS PHAROAH to oversee the famine. Jesus is given power to ACT AS GOD until the world is set to rights. Once achieved BOTH ‘HAND BACK POWER TO HIM WHO GAVE IT TO HIM’
  • Jesus, died to save us from the sin of Adam and was resurrected and taken up to heaven to, among other things, and after the last, RULE OVER CREATION ... why would [a] God who rules a greater unlimited spiritual kingdom of Heaven desire to degrade himself to BECOME RULER over a limited physical flesh world?

Satan, really?

Why can it just be false without the works of satan?

When we correct someone's math, we just show them the right answer without directing unnecessary blame.
 
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