Abandon hope all Ye who enter here (attachment to a belief)

[Mock Turtle]

That is, religious texts will explain all, and any rational or reasonable explanation (most probably arising from science) is not required if an account exists in such texts to explain everything - even if it is just ludicrous.

How do people get to such a state? We seem to have more than enough on this forum - and I'm not referring to the majority having a religious belief and who sensibly don't take religious texts verbatim but do understand the times they were written in and the audience intended.

Where do these people get such allegiances?

 

[Rival]

Because people aren't looking for science or anything like scientific explanations for anything within these texts. That's just completely missing the point.

 

[Mock Turtle]

Because people aren't looking for science or anything like scientific explanations for anything within these texts. That's just completely missing the point.

The point being - they are willing to believe whatever they want over evidence?

 

[Desert Snake]

That is, religious texts will explain all, and any rational or reasonable explanation (most probably arising from science) is not required if an account exists in such texts to explain everything - even if it is just ludicrous.

How do people get to such a state? We seem to have more than enough on this forum - and I'm not referring to the majority having a religious belief and who sensibly don't take religious texts verbatim but do understand the times they were written in and the audience intended.

Where do these people get such allegiances?

What makes you think the 'majority' can tell what a good interpretation is? You think that religious organizations don't have agendas, could be wrong, ?

So, the differential there, doesn't infer anything. The texts straight are 'more correct' than the interpretations the majority are told, [they're different.

Better to read the text first

 

[Mock Turtle]

What makes you think the 'majority' can tell what is a good interpretation is? You think that religious organizations don't have agendas, could be wrong, ?

So, the differential there, doesn't infer anything. The texts straight are 'more correct' than than the interpretations the majority are told, [they're different.

Better to read the text first

What I meant was that many or most today do not believe the literal meanings in such texts and do realise when they were written. I was being kind to them. If, as you suggest, many more do believe in the literal accounts (or any subsequent variants) then so much the worse for them. Choosing between such and scientific evidence (as per NECs) is a losing rather than winning process.

 

[Rival]

The point being - they are willing to believe whatever they want over evidence?

Most people are.

And some people honestly couldn't give less of a damn what modern god capital S Science has to say.

Or some can fit in scientific theory with more mystical takes in a way you may find paradoxical, but that works perfectly in a religious worldview that doesn't assume everything has to make human sense.

Or maybe some just don't find the evidence compelling.

Some may be actual literalists who think that scientific theory, if accepted, would kill their faith. You're not going to change their minds without destroying their religious views in the process, so bon chance with that.

 

[Mock Turtle]

Most people are.

And some people honestly couldn't give less of a damn what modern god capital S Science has to say.

Or some can fit in scientific theory with more mystical takes in a way you may find paradoxical, but that works perfectly in a religious worldview that doesn't assume everything has to make human sense.

Or maybe some just don't find the evidence compelling.

Some may be actual literalists who think that scientific theory, if accepted, would kill their faith. You're not going to change their minds without destroying their religious views in the process, so bon chance with that.

And I think you summed it up in the last two sentences, which unfortunately makes them out to be dishonest. Which hardly surprise me - for those so gullible.

 

[Rival]

And I think you summed it up in the last two sentences, which unfortunately makes them out to be dishonest. Which hardly surprise me - for those so gullible.

I wouldn't say they are dishonest, only rejecting what they feel contradicts their worldview. We all do that.

 

[Desert Snake]

What I meant was that many or most today do not believe the literal meanings in such texts and do realise when they were written. I was being kind to them. If, as you suggest, many more do believe in the literal accounts (or any subsequent variants) then so much the worse for them. Choosing between such and scientific evidence (as per NECs) is a losing rather than winning process.

Too many variables here, too broad. Otherwise, happy to discuss something.

 

[Stevicus]

That is, religious texts will explain all, and any rational or reasonable explanation (most probably arising from science) is not required if an account exists in such texts to explain everything - even if it is just ludicrous.

How do people get to such a state? We seem to have more than enough on this forum - and I'm not referring to the majority having a religious belief and who sensibly don't take religious texts verbatim but do understand the times they were written in and the audience intended.

Where do these people get such allegiances?

Probably because their heads have been filled with this kind of talk since they've been old enough to walk. Their parents got it from their parents, and it's passed from generation to generation.

 

[Stevicus]

(as per NECs)

NEC?

NEC is a Japanese electronics manufacturer, formerly "Nippon Electric Company".

NEC may refer to:

Companies and organizations[edit]

• National Economic Commission, a deficit reduction commission in the United States
• National Economic Council (United Kingdom)
• National Economic Council (Bangladesh) - the highest political authority in Bangladesh for consideration of development activities
• National Elections Commission, an autonomous government agency of Liberia
• National Electrostatics Corporation, a manufacturer of particle accelerators
• National Empowerment Center, a US mental health advocacy and recovery organization
• National Enterprise Corporation, a state corporation of Uganda
• National Executive Committee of the UK Labour Party
• Negro Ensemble Company, New York City theatre company
• National Electricity Company (NEK EAD), a Bulgarian electricity company
• New England Coalition, an anti-nuclear organization based in Brattleboro, VT
• Niagara Escarpment Commission, an agency of the Ontario government
• The ASX stock ticker for Nine Entertainment Co., an Australian media company
• North Eastern Council
• National Economic Council in the Executive Office of the US President

Exhibition centres[edit]

• National Exhibition Centre, a very large exhibition centre in the West Midlands, England
  • NEC Group, the British company operating the National Exhibition Centre and other venues

Educational institutions[edit]

• New England Conservatory, America's oldest independent music conservatory
• Narayana Engineering College in Andhra Pradesh, Nellore, India
• National Engineering College in Tamil Nadu, India
• National Extension College, a UK specialist in online and distance learning, based in Cambridge
• New England College, a private college in Henniker, New Hampshire
• Native Education Centre, a private college in Vancouver, Canada

Engineering[edit]

• National Electrical Code, a US design standard on electrical wiring and equipment in construction
• NEC Engineering and Construction Contract, a formalised system created by the UK Institution of Civil Engineers that guides the drafting of documents on civil engineering and construction projects

Sports[edit]

• Teams sponsored by NEC Corporation in Japan:
  • NEC Green Rockets, rugby union
  • NEC Red Rockets, women's volleyball
  • NEC Blue Rockets, men's volleyball
• N.E.C. (football club), a football club from Nijmegen, the Netherlands
• Northeast Conference, an NCAA athletics conference
• Northeastern Conference, a high school athletic conference in Massachusetts, United States
• North Egypt Conference, former Illinois, US high school athletic conference

Health[edit]

• No effect concentration in chemical hazards
• Necrotizing enterocolitis, a medical condition usually affecting premature infants
• National Emission Ceiling, part of EU Directive 2001/81/EC regarding air pollution

Science and mathematics[edit]

• Non-Euclidean crystallographic group, a group of symmetries in hyperbolic geometry
• Numerical Electromagnetics Code, a computer program used to simulate antennas

Military[edit]

• Navy Enlisted Classification, US Navy
• Network-enabled capability, a UK military doctrine for using information systems

Other[edit]

• Northeast Corridor, a rail line on the east coast of the United States

----

Well, I give up. I can't figure out from this list what you might be referring to.

DTOA! (Death to obscure acronyms!)

 

[BSM1]

The point being - they are willing to believe whatever they want over evidence?

It seems most people would rather be right than factually accurate.

 

[dybmh]

The point being - they are willing to believe whatever they want over evidence?

Generally speaking, I find it helpful to categorize evidence either as objective or subjective. I think what you'll find is that a rational religious person does have reasons for their beliefs. But because these reasons are purely subjective, then they are not valued or convincing to people who are looking for objective evidence.

So if the person is rational, they are not "believing whatever they want over evidence". It's just that their evidence is subjective and not convincing.

Edit to add: By the way, when a person denies objective evidence in favor of subjective evidence... they can sound delusional in an argument.

 

[Mock Turtle]

NEC?

NEC is a Japanese electronics manufacturer, formerly "Nippon Electric Company".

NEC may refer to:

Companies and organizations[edit]

• National Economic Commission, a deficit reduction commission in the United States
• National Economic Council (United Kingdom)
• National Economic Council (Bangladesh) - the highest political authority in Bangladesh for consideration of development activities
• National Elections Commission, an autonomous government agency of Liberia
• National Electrostatics Corporation, a manufacturer of particle accelerators
• National Empowerment Center, a US mental health advocacy and recovery organization
• National Enterprise Corporation, a state corporation of Uganda
• National Executive Committee of the UK Labour Party
• Negro Ensemble Company, New York City theatre company
• National Electricity Company (NEK EAD), a Bulgarian electricity company
• New England Coalition, an anti-nuclear organization based in Brattleboro, VT
• Niagara Escarpment Commission, an agency of the Ontario government
• The ASX stock ticker for Nine Entertainment Co., an Australian media company
• North Eastern Council
• National Economic Council in the Executive Office of the US President

Exhibition centres[edit]

• National Exhibition Centre, a very large exhibition centre in the West Midlands, England
  • NEC Group, the British company operating the National Exhibition Centre and other venues

Educational institutions[edit]

• New England Conservatory, America's oldest independent music conservatory
• Narayana Engineering College in Andhra Pradesh, Nellore, India
• National Engineering College in Tamil Nadu, India
• National Extension College, a UK specialist in online and distance learning, based in Cambridge
• New England College, a private college in Henniker, New Hampshire
• Native Education Centre, a private college in Vancouver, Canada

Engineering[edit]

• National Electrical Code, a US design standard on electrical wiring and equipment in construction
• NEC Engineering and Construction Contract, a formalised system created by the UK Institution of Civil Engineers that guides the drafting of documents on civil engineering and construction projects

Sports[edit]

• Teams sponsored by NEC Corporation in Japan:
  • NEC Green Rockets, rugby union
  • NEC Red Rockets, women's volleyball
  • NEC Blue Rockets, men's volleyball
• N.E.C. (football club), a football club from Nijmegen, the Netherlands
• Northeast Conference, an NCAA athletics conference
• Northeastern Conference, a high school athletic conference in Massachusetts, United States
• North Egypt Conference, former Illinois, US high school athletic conference

Health[edit]

• No effect concentration in chemical hazards
• Necrotizing enterocolitis, a medical condition usually affecting premature infants
• National Emission Ceiling, part of EU Directive 2001/81/EC regarding air pollution

Science and mathematics[edit]

• Non-Euclidean crystallographic group, a group of symmetries in hyperbolic geometry
• Numerical Electromagnetics Code, a computer program used to simulate antennas

Military[edit]

• Navy Enlisted Classification, US Navy
• Network-enabled capability, a UK military doctrine for using information systems

Other[edit]

• Northeast Corridor, a rail line on the east coast of the United States

----

Well, I give up. I can't figure out from this list what you might be referring to.

DTOA! (Death to obscure acronyms!)

Perhaps YECs might be better.

 

[Mock Turtle]

I wouldn't say they are dishonest, only rejecting what they feel contradicts their worldview. We all do that.

I think we owe it to ourselves to be honest, that is, impartial and accepting, even if we don't like the answers we get. Which is not what I tend to see with many having religious views who then seem to have to distort their reasoning to ensure their beliefs line up with some particular doctrine.

 

[Stevicus]

Perhaps YECs might be better.

Yukon Energy Corporation?

YEC may refer to:

• Year-End Championships, former and unofficial designation of season-ending tennis tournaments
  • ATP World Tour Finals
  • WTA Championships
• Ying e Chi, a non-profit organization of independent filmmakers in Hong Kong
• Yorkshire Engine Company, a former locomotive manufacturer in Sheffield, England
• Young Earth creationism, a religious belief of a young creation of life and earth
• Yukon Energy Corporation, a Canadian Crown corporation in the Yukon

yec may refer to:

• Yeniche language (ISO 629-3 code), a variety of German spoken in Europe

 

[Nakosis]

That is, religious texts will explain all, and any rational or reasonable explanation (most probably arising from science) is not required if an account exists in such texts to explain everything - even if it is just ludicrous.

How do people get to such a state? We seem to have more than enough on this forum - and I'm not referring to the majority having a religious belief and who sensibly don't take religious texts verbatim but do understand the times they were written in and the audience intended.

Where do these people get such allegiances?

The uncontested unconscious mind.

 

[Terry Sampson]

Or maybe some just don't find the evidence compelling.
Some may be actual literalists who think that scientific theory, if accepted, would kill their faith. You're not going to change their minds without destroying their religious views in the process, so bon chance with that.

And I think you summed it up in the last two sentences, which unfortunately makes them out to be dishonest. Which hardly surprise me - for those so gullible.

??? The gullible are dishonest ???

 

[Guitar's Cry]

I think humanity likes having a hard footing to stand on--a base from which they can operate. Religion is often that base: knowing something greater than themselves is looking over them is helpful to some people, so any source that can provide that and work with that person's particular worldview is likely very tempting even with contrary evidence. That is also assuming they have the understanding or even the desire to understand contrary evidence.

 

[Mock Turtle]

Yukon Energy Corporation?

That will do.