Why Abraham?

[Epic Beard Man]

I spoke at a funeral yesterday and I mentioned that I worshipped the God of Abraham. I was wrong. I worship the God of Satanist, the God of Hindus, the God of Sikhs, the God of atheists. But I’m curious what made Abraham so important? Of course, in your opinion.

 

[Terry Sampson]

what made Abraham so important?

The encounter between him and Yhwh and his response to that encounter followed by other similar encounters: by him and his descendants.

Unless, of course, one thinks it was all fantasy, delusion, bogus AND disapproves of the consequences of believing that there ever was and have been such encounters. In that case, one will either tell me that the consequences aren't important or, more likely, that the harm caused by believing in the first and subsequent encounters far outweigh the positive consequences.

Cool! I say. So show me how your life serves as a better template for human behavior.

 

[Cooky]

I spoke at a funeral yesterday and I mentioned that I worshipped the God of Abraham. I was wrong. I worship the God of Satanist, the God of Hindus, the God of Sikhs, the God of atheists. But I’m curious what made Abraham so important? Of course, in your opinion.

I hate Abraham. He is a disgrace to all parents and nothing more than a consciousless, overly-obedient, puppet-man.

St. Joseph was a real father.

 

[Cooky]

I’m curious what made Abraham so important? Of course, in your opinion.

He's not important. But he might be important to fools who say "Abrahamic religions" as if that means something.

If people were smarter, they would call them the Mosaic religions. We worship the God of Moses. Screw Abraham.

 

[pearl]

If people were smarter, they would call them the Mosaic religions. We worship the God of Moses. Screw Abraham.

I do not know what Protestant Christians believe concerning Abraham, but, as for Catholic Christians;


This story begins with the faith of Abraham, the father of those who believe, and also the father of our faith as Christians, one who, through faith, is also our father. The story continues with the blessings granted to the patriarchs, the revelation to Moses and Israel quotes exodus toward the Promised Land. A new stage opens up with the promise of an unending kingship the promise made to David and his descendants. The prophets in turn interpret this history, calling people to repentance and conversion, thus preparing the human hearts to receive the ultimate gift.

Abraham, father of the people of Israel, father of faith, thus becomes the source of blessing, for in him "all the families of the earth shall call themselves blessed " (Genesis 12:3). The task of the Chosen People is, therefore, to make a gift of their God-- the one true God-- to every other people; in reality, as Christians we are the inheritors of their faith in the one God. Our gratitude, therefore, must be extended to our Jewish brothers and sisters who, despite the hardships of their own history, have held on to faith in this God right up to the present, and who witness to it in the sight of those peoples who, lacking knowledge of the one God, "dwell in darkness and in the shadow of death" (Luke 1:79).

When the Church refers to the Jewish covenant with God as irrevocable and eternal it is to the covenant with Abraham.

 

[Cooky]

I do not know what Protestant Christians believe concerning Abraham, but, as for Catholic Christians;


This story begins with the faith of Abraham, the father of those who believe, and also the father of our faith as Christians, one who, through faith, is also our father. The story continues with the blessings granted to the patriarchs, the revelation to Moses and Israel quotes exodus toward the Promised Land. A new stage opens up with the promise of an unending kingship the promise made to David and his descendants. The prophets in turn interpret this history, calling people to repentance and conversion, thus preparing the human hearts to receive the ultimate gift.

Abraham, father of the people of Israel, father of faith, thus becomes the source of blessing, for in him "all the families of the earth shall call themselves blessed " (Genesis 12:3). The task of the Chosen People is, therefore, to make a gift of their God-- the one true God-- to every other people; in reality, as Christians we are the inheritors of their faith in the one God. Our gratitude, therefore, must be extended to our Jewish brothers and sisters who, despite the hardships of their own history, have held on to faith in this God right up to the present, and who witness to it in the sight of those peoples who, lacking knowledge of the one God, "dwell in darkness and in the shadow of death" (Luke 1:79).

When the Church refers to the Jewish covenant with God as irrevocable and eternal it is to the covenant with Abraham.

I think Abraham represents the father of radical extremism. I would argue "faith" existed before Abraham.

 

[pearl]

. I would argue "faith" existed before Abraham.

I'm sure it did, just look at other creation stories. But these do not represent our faith heritage.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I hate Abraham.

That speaks volumes.

 

[Cooky]

I'm sure it did, just look at other creation stories. But these do not represent our faith heritage.

For us Catholics, Moses represents a better "faith".

(Pistis, fides). In the Old Testament, the Hebrew means essentially steadfastness, cf. Exodus 17:12, where it is used to describe the strengthening of Moses' hands; hence it comes to mean faithfulness, whether of God towards man (Deuteronomy 32:4) or of man towards God (Psalm 118:30).

CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Faith

...I think Abraham represents the old way... the Radical, fundamentalist, triumphalist Catholics of old, i.e., Extremism.

 

[Cooky]

That speaks volumes.

Yes, I hate radical fundamentalists who reject their own conscience. To hell with them, IMO.

Catechism of the Catholic Church - Moral conscience

 

[danieldemol]

Abraham if He was real was said to be the father of monotheism.
Thus it is from Him we have our shared cultural identity of believing in one God.

 

[shmogie]

I spoke at a funeral yesterday and I mentioned that I worshipped the God of Abraham. I was wrong. I worship the God of Satanist, the God of Hindus, the God of Sikhs, the God of atheists. But I’m curious what made Abraham so important? Of course, in your opinion.

He was selected by God, as a righteous man, to father a nation, whose responsibility was to enlighten the world about God and His ways and how to live in harmony with Him.

They failed, and the responsibility was given to others.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

That speaks volumes.

As always I’m glad you’re speaking

 

[Good-Ole-Rebel]

But I’m curious what made Abraham so important? Of course, in your opinion.

Because in Abraham are all the promises and covenants of God to man, concerning redemption, inheritance of the earth, the nation Israel, and the blessing from God, given

Good-Ole-Rebel

 

[wizanda]

But I’m curious what made Abraham so important?

Abram and Melchizedek (King of Righteousness) had a sacred ceremony of Bread and Wine, as they both had the same belief structuring (Genesis 14:17-24).

The God Most High (El Elyon = Ala Ilah) - the Source of reality, and Yahavah Elohim - the Creator Being from the Divine Council.

Abram was then promised he would be bless to be the Exalted Father of many nations by Yahavah Elohim (Genesis 15-16).

AB (H1) = Father.
AB+RM (H1+H7311) = Exalted + Father.
AB+H+RM (H85) = The added H implies the breath of Source put into Abraham's seed, which was specifically given leading to Israel (Genesis 17), and then the same wording is later used for the birth of the Messiah by a virgin.

Abraham was important as the Source knew he would birth Ishmael who would create Islam, and Isaac who would lead to Israel leading many to God.

In my opinion.

 

[pearl]

(Pistis, fides). In the Old Testament, the Hebrew means essentially steadfastness, cf. Exodus 17:12, where it is used to describe the strengthening of Moses' hands; hence it comes to mean faithfulness, whether of God towards man (Deuteronomy 32:4) or of man towards God (Psalm 118:30).

But the Covenant through Moses was conditional as Hebrew Scripture states the need of a 'renewed' covenant'.

...I think Abraham represents the old way... the Radical, fundamentalist, triumphalist Catholics of old, i.e., Extremism.

I think you have it backwards.

 

[Cooky]

@pcarl, @Epic Beard Man, @Jayhawker Soule, who here would kill their child for God?

...I, for one, would not kill either my 7 or 9 year old daughters. Not for God, not for anyone... Because I know it is evil.

 

[Cooky]

The fact that Abraham would have killed his child, makes him an EVIL man.

<EDIT> wait, wait, wait...... hold on, so it was Ishmael, that Abraham was going to kill...?

Nevermind. Abraham was a holy man.

I take back all that I said.

 

[Cooky]

Abraham was important as the Source knew he would birth Ishmael who would create Islam, and Isaac who would lead to Israel leading many to God.

I can only wonder what the middle East and Arabia would look like today if Ishmael were killed and Mohammad were never born. Zoroastrianism would have probably remained the dominant religion and way of life with pockets of Christianity, Buudhism, Hinduism and Judaism... Much progress could have been gained.

 

[wizanda]

Much progress could have been gained.

Early Islam adopted knowledge from everywhere, where it advanced known medicine, created universities, algebra, 0 etc...

It is once it became Tribalism, that it lost connection to studying all knowledge available, and then fought to maintain that exclusivity.

In my opinion.