How to experience Bliss

[atanu]

By not seeing thoughts as the adversary.

Often, in yoga or meditation classes, I have heard the instruction “observe the space between thoughts, try to remain in that space”.

My experience tells me that a better instruction is - take as your object of meditation the space-like mind in which thoughts arise and pass away.

This dissolves the duality of thought and non-thought, and trains the mind to be in meditative detachment even as thinking is occurring.

Yes. Both approaches are prescribed in Hindu methods too.

Mahamudra teaches the coemergence of nirvana and samsara.

I think Ramana’s ‘sahaja samadhi’ is similar. However, Ramana would not allow any doubt as to what supervenes on what.

 

[Howard Is]

Yes. Both approaches are prescribed in Hindu methods too.

I think Ramana’s ‘sahaja samadhi’ is similar. However, Ramana would not allow any doubt as to what supervenes8) on what.

Mahamudra as I was taught originates with the mahasiddhas. The progenitor of Kagyu buddhism is usually considered to be Milarepa, but the roots go back to India and the mahasiddha Tilopa.

 

[stvdv]

My experience tells me that a better instruction is - take as your object of meditation the space-like mind in which thoughts arise and pass away.

The definition of mind:"bundle of thoughts"

Object of meditation actually is a thought

So that seems contradictory to me. But all exercises are kind of tricks in duality to gradually grow to non-duality; as they say "words are used to describe the indescribable"

So if this works for you, I would say use it. The other one you mentioned did work for me when I tried it in the past.

And I think your idea will also work for me. No I know, while typing I already checked it out (I just used "space in my head" instead, as mind equals bundle of thoughts in my vocabulary (Ramana and Sai Baba define it this way)

 

[stvdv]

I agree. Shri Ramana's highest teaching is "Just Be". That is one level, which however is only for a select few. How can you "Just be", without getting entangled in thoughts? Only a very high level of sadhaka-s are able to follow this prescription.

He also taught the enquiry 'Whence this I?' That is another level but again not suitable for most. The method involves constant vigilance over any and all thought and enquire "To whom the thought arose?" and follow up the process of discriminative enquiry of 'seer versus seen' or 'neti-neti', till only pure awareness remains.

He taught: mantra japa, especially the silent-internal-continous ajapa japa. This is another level and probably more suitable for more people and yet it may not be suitable for all. For example, we may not be able to carry out 'ajapa japa' unceasingly while we are busy in worldly duties.

He alternatively teaches us to carry on our duties, dedicating them to Ishwara. This seems simple yet it is not. Total unconditional submission of ego-will to God is not simple.

So, Shri Ramana also does encourage ritualistic puja for anyone who ae so inclined. But surely ritualistic puja is culture and sampradaya (school) specific. The same mode of puja cannot be universally applicable to all.

...
I follow the last three methods. But the point is that whatever method one may follow, Ramana's teaching, which is the Advaita Vedantic teaching, is about the Atman -- sat-chit-ananda.

...

That is why I appreciate Ramana Maharshi and Sai Baba so much. They teach very similar:

1) Do not dismiss other's Religion/Path
2) Good to dismiss your thoughts ***

***: Of course don't become too enthusiastical in the practices (keep common sense): When on the road, in the driver seat, it's best to have "eyes on the road (not on Krishna)" and "focus on driving (not on third eye)"

 

[atanu]

That is why I appreciate Ramana Maharshi and Sai Baba so much. They teach very similar:

1) Do not dismiss other's Religion/Path

I wholeheartedly agree.

As Gaudapada explained, advaita has no conflict with any variety of dvaita since dvaita is product of advaita. Also, I will like to cite my most favourable verse from upanishads.

When to a man who understands,
the Self has become all things,
what sorrow, what trouble can there be,
to him who beholds that unity.
— Isha Upanishad, Hymn 7
​

So, rejoice in your path, till the following:

पुरुषः सोऽहमस्मि
(O Sun the Nourisher, O sole Seer, O controller of all, O Soorya, the son of Prajapati!
Disperse thy rays
and gather up thy fiery Light...
O That! What an auspicious Form is Thine – O That most glorious Form do I behold!
That is This...It is This Supreme Self within me, He, indeed, am I!)
— Isha Upanishad, Hymn 16​

...

 

[atanu]

1) Do not dismiss other's Religion/Path

I wholeheartedly agree.
As Gaudapada explained, advaita has no conflict with any variety of dvaita since dvaita is product of advaita. Also, I will like to cite my most favourable verse from upanishads.

When to a man who understands,
the Self has become all things,
what sorrow, what trouble can there be,
to him who beholds that unity.
— Isha Upanishad, Hymn 7
​

So, rejoice in your path, till the following:

पुरुषः सोऽहमस्मि
(O Sun the Nourisher, O sole Seer, O controller of all, O Soorya, the son of Prajapati!
Disperse thy rays
and gather up thy fiery Light...
O That! What an auspicious Form is Thine – O That most glorious Form do I behold!
That is This...It is This Supreme Self within me, He, indeed, am I!)
— Isha Upanishad, Hymn 16​

...

Meditators may understand the profoundness of the above. There is no space-time before the Self-Consciousness. Once one realises that one is not the body and not the mind, there remains no difference between the Heart of Sun and Heart of Me. What profound auspicious teaching.
..

 

[stvdv]

As Gaudapada explained, advaita has no conflict with any variety of dvaita since dvaita is product of advaita.

Good reminder to keep Advaitists humble; major lesson I learned. I don't read that often though. Good to repeat often.

Also, I will like to cite my most favourable verse from upanishads.

When to a man who understands,
the Self has become all things,
what sorrow, what trouble can there be,
to him who beholds that unity.
— Isha Upanishad, Hymn 7

Beautiful verse. The moment my eyes see this, joy arises. Key word "beholds"

So, rejoice in your path, till the following:

पुरुषः सोऽहमस्मि
(O Sun the Nourisher, O sole Seer, O controller of all, O Soorya, the son of Prajapati!
Disperse thy rays
and gather up thy fiery Light...
O That! What an auspicious Form is Thine – O That most glorious Form do I behold!
That is This...It is This Supreme Self within me, He, indeed, am I!)
— Isha Upanishad, Hymn 16

Thanks for reminding me
This is the Truth

 

[stvdv]

Meditators may understand the profoundness of the above.

When Granted a Glimpse of THAT

Once one realises that one is not the body and not the mind, there remains no difference between the Heart of Sun and Heart of Me.

And worldly happiness loses it's charm

What profound auspicious teaching.

I agree.

 

[stvdv]

My Guru is Bodhinatha Veylanswami, His Guru was Sivaya Subramuniyswami (also my Guru until he passed) and His Guru was Siva Yogaswami of Jaffna Sri Lanka. (He's the one that sat with Sage Ramana) His Guru was Chellappaswami and before that was Kadaitswami. It's a lineage.

Thank you for sharing.
The first 2 looked western and friendly. Then 2 very "Guru like" looking (what I expect them to look like). And the last one looked very strange (but long time ago, just picture drawing it seems). Naturally I am most drawn to the ones really looking like an Indian Guru. They really looked nice, those 2 from Sri Lanka. I visited Sri Lanka 5 times (around 1990-1995), probably I saw their pictures, because now, when I look at them, they feel kind of familiar to me.

When I first came to India (never read anything about Gurus except that I heard about Osho; my uncle went and was enthusiastic about Osho, so I thought let's go to India and experience myself; was in 1990 I think) and saw a foto of Shirdi Sai Baba, I "fell in love" with Him. Such a saintly person. I was really sad He was not alive anymore.

So we're like the aadheenams and mutts, a lineage that keeps a living Guru. There is always another to carry it on, and each is appointed by the previous one. It solves a lot of potential problems.

I guess that it does solve potential problems. Humans with too much ego tend to fall in to that trap. Guru is He who overcame that trap.
The Guru concept is really very special. Some people mock this "Guru concept", but that usually are the people who never lived/experienced a Guru.

Brunton searched out quite a few Gurus, but kept going back to Sri Ramana.

I can imagine he kept going back to Sri Ramana. Sri Ramana was the real deal (I stayed for a while with Poonjaji in Lucknow; disciple of Sri Ramana). Why search any further if you found "your Master". I did visit a few Masters when I started out in India; just to get a good impression. But after being with Sai Baba for a few years, and having my personal experiences, I never feel like searching for other Masters anymore.

 

[Vinayaka]

Thank you for sharing.
The first 2 looked western and friendly. Then 2 very "Guru like" looking (what I expect them to look like). And the last one looked very strange (but long time ago, just picture drawing it seems). Naturally I am most drawn to the ones really looking like an Indian Guru. They really looked nice, those 2 from Sri Lanka. I visited Sri Lanka 5 times (around 1990-1995), probably I saw their pictures, because now, when I look at them, they feel kind of familiar to me.

When I first came to India (never read anything about Gurus except that I heard about Osho; my uncle went and was enthusiastic about Osho, so I thought let's go to India and experience myself; was in 1990 I think) and saw a foto of Shirdi Sai Baba, I "fell in love" with Him. Such a saintly person. I was really sad He was not alive anymore.


I guess that it does solve potential problems. Humans with too much ego tend to fall in to that trap. Guru is He who overcame that trap.
The Guru concept is really very special. Some people mock this "Guru concept", but that usually are the people who never lived/experienced a Guru.


I can imagine he kept going back to Sri Ramana. Sri Ramana was the real deal (I stayed for a while with Poonjaji in Lucknow; disciple of Sri Ramana). Why search any further if you found "your Master". I did visit a few Masters when I started out in India; just to get a good impression. But after being with Sai Baba for a few years, and having my personal experiences, I never feel like searching for other Masters anymore.

Now I'm curious. Are you Indian, or a westerner who moved, or an NRI who moved back?

Color is irrelevant to me, but what they teach would count.

 

[stvdv]

Now I'm curious. Are you Indian, or a westerner who moved, or an NRI who moved back?

Color is irrelevant to me, but what they teach would count.

I am born in Holland, so I am westerner. But I feel very "home" when being in India. When I was in Rishikesh it was a "magical mystery tour"
And I love the Indian culture. Beautiful and rich in life lessons. Riksha driver first praying before starting to drive ... I liked that

I have been many years in India, but now I stay in Holland again.
I found my "home" in India, and took it home to Holland
Now I feel at "home" wherever my home is