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Islam: What Muslims teach children in Dutch schools

Choose the option(s) you agree with:

  • 1: No worries, it will blow over (This is Islamophobia)

  • 2: I do worry, "Muslims who teach killing is okay" won't just blow over

  • 3: Koran contains violent verses

  • 4: Violent verses in Koran are dangerous in the West

  • 5: Responsibility of highest Imam to do something now

  • 6: Act now or Islamophobia becomes reality

  • 7: I do not believe this happened; it's a hoax

  • 8: I believe Allah does want Muslims to teach this

  • 9: I believe Allah does NOT want Muslims to teach this

  • 10: I believe Muslims should be free to teach this


Results are only viewable after voting.

sooda

Veteran Member
From what I know, this is accurate:

According to Abdul Rashied Omar, the majority of modern Islamic jurists continue to regard apostasy as a crime deserving the death penalty.[12] Some regard apostasy in Islam as a form of religious crime, although others do not.[6][5][19] Others argue that the death penalty is an inappropriate punishment,[20][21][22][23] inconsistent with the Qur'anic injunctions such as Quran 88:21–22[24] or "no compulsion in religion";[25] and/or that it was a man-made rule enacted in the early Islamic community to prevent and punish the equivalent of desertion or treason,[26] and should be enforced only if apostasy becomes a mechanism of public disobedience and disorder (fitna).[27] According to Khaled Abou El Fadl, moderate Muslims do not believe that apostasy requires punishment.[24] Critics[28][29] argue that the death penalty or other punishment for apostasy in Islam is a violation of universal human rights, and an issue of freedom of faith and conscience.[20][30]

As of 2014, laws in various Muslim-majority countries prescribed for the apostate (Arabic: مرتد‎ murtadd) sentences ranging from execution to a prison term to no punishment.[31][32] Sharia courts in some countries use civil code to void the Muslim apostate's marriage and to deny child-custody rights as well as inheritance rights.[33] From 1985 to 2006, three governments executed four individuals for apostasy from Islam: "one in Sudan in 1985; two in Iran, in 1989 and 1998; and one in Saudi Arabia in 1992."[25] Twenty-three Muslim-majority countries, as of 2013, additionally covered apostasy from Islam through their criminal laws.[34] The Tunisian Constitution of 2014 stipulates protection from attacks based on accusations of apostasy.[35] In a Pew Research Center poll, public support for capital punishment for apostasy among Muslims ranged from 78% in Afghanistan to less than 1% in Kazakhstan.

This guy?

The Right to Religious Conversion: Between Apostasy and ...
https://s3.amazonaws.com/berkley-center/060801OmarRightReligiousConversionBetween...
Dr. A. Rashied Omar is an Imam from South Africa and Research Scholar of Islamic Studies and Peacebuilding at the University of Notre Dame. He serves as a faculty advisor to the Kroc Institute’s Program in Religion, Conflict and Peacebuilding and is an Associate of the Salam Institute for Peace and
 

Link

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Subjective question, but I would say they were nice and peaceful. Still believe in the death penalty for leaving Islam though.
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
I worked for Shell and rented a house in Scheveningen for three years. But I learned almost no Dutch........apart from words connected with food. The Hollandse blauwe was a very good chicken, I remember.
This one even I didn't know. I had to google it
I knew we had "Hollandse nieuwe", but that was a fish (herring)
 

exchemist

Veteran Member
Probably not.. Wahabis are non violent.
I meant the funding. Saudi Arabia is reported to have been funding mosques and schools in Europe, having plenty of money to do so, of course.

But is there, then, a sect of islam that IS violent? I had thought none of them were doctrinally and that it was the growth of "political islam", originating from Egypt and Pakistan, that was responsible for most muslim terrorism.
 

exchemist

Veteran Member
This one even I didn't know. I had to google it
I knew we had "Hollandse nieuwe", but that was a fish (herring)
Yes. Very tasty. I used to buy them from the poulier in Frederik Hendriklaan in Statenkwartier, along with kipworst for my infant son. I can get maatjes haring at my fishmonger here in London, from time to time, though they are a terrible price.
 

QuestioningMind

Well-Known Member
You are wrong !!! Here in Holland 96% of the Islamic schools are radical Islam. How large is the percentage KKK in your example of all the Christians?

The youtube said that 50 schools were checked. And found 50 of the 52 Islamic secondary schools to be fundamentalist Islam (96%)

The Netherlands currently has (2019) 52 Islamic primary schools and 3 Islamic secondary schools (Rotterdam, Amsterdam, Utrecht). For comparison: the Netherlands has 6268 primary and 652 secondary schools in total (StatLine, 2019).

About what?

I stated that radical Muslims are no different from radical Christians:

That's true.

I stated that there are plenty of radical Christians who are members of the KKK who teach their children that white people are superior and that people of other races or religions should be persecuted. Religious sects teaching hate and fear is nothing new.

That's true as well. So what I'm I so wrong about?

I didn't say it before, but I'll say so now: 100% of KKK parents teach their children such radical Christian garbage.

What exactly is your point?
 

sooda

Veteran Member
I meant the funding. Saudi Arabia is reported to have been funding mosques and schools in Europe, having plenty of money to do so, of course.

But is there, then, a sect of islam that IS violent? I had thought none of them were doctrinally and that it was the growth of "political islam", originating from Egypt and Pakistan, that was responsible for most muslim terrorism.

King Fahd's legacy was to build mosques all over the world for existing congregations NOT to teach violence or radical Islam. The Wahhabis weren't
ever subject to colonialism... Sayeed Qutb and Hassan Al Banna both came out of Egypt. Pakistan is very poor and has terrible memories of British rule.

I have sort of a half-baked theory.. That the gangster leadership of ISIS, Boko Haram, etc are rich as Midas and kill the moderates who might make some righteous compromise towards peace and progress.
 

InChrist

Free4ever
Radical Muslims are no different than radical Christians. There are plenty of radical Christians who are members of the KKK who teach their children that white people are superior and that people of other races or religions should be persecuted. Religious sects teaching hate and fear is nothing new.
There is a difference, though.

Radical Muslims who teach their children slay non-Muslim idolaters and infidels are teaching...
according to their scriptures.

KKK members who claim to be "Christians" but believe other races are inferior and should be persecuted are teaching...
against the message and instruction of the biblical scriptures.
 

QuestioningMind

Well-Known Member
There is a difference, though.

Radical Muslims who teach their children slay non-Muslim idolaters and infidels are teaching...
according to their scriptures.

KKK members who claim to be "Christians" but believe other races are inferior and should be persecuted are teaching...
against the message and instruction of the biblical scriptures.

That's according to YOU. However, if you ask any of these white supremacist morons they would have plenty of quotes from the bible that they claim backs up their moronic position. Slave owners in America constantly quoted the bible in order to justify owning other people as property. In fact, THEY would claim that it is YOU who are teaching against the message and instruction of the biblical scriptures.

Of course, that's the problem with the bible and all other religious texts I'm ever read... people can interpret then in any way they choose.
 

InChrist

Free4ever
That's according to YOU. However, if you ask any of these white supremacist morons they would have plenty of quotes from the bible that they claim backs up their moronic position. Slave owners in America constantly quoted the bible in order to justify owning other people as property. In fact, THEY would claim that it is YOU who are teaching against the message and instruction of the biblical scriptures.

Of course, that's the problem with the bible and all other religious texts I'm ever read... people can interpret then in any way they choose.
Sure people can manipulate quotes from the Bible to fit their agendas.
Yet, I think the problem is for those who misinterpret the Bible and they will be held accountable to the Author. The Bible says what it says, that there is only one race, the human race and all humans are on the same level...sinners who need a Savior.
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
What exactly is your point?
You totally ignored the OP for starters

If there is a terrorist attack by KKK and the police knows about it. 10 minutes to go.
Or if in court the KKK is about to be sentenced

And then comes @QuestioningMind along "Wait, wait .... why focus on KKK, the Muslims are as radical as well"
 

Baroodi

Active Member
Research by NRC handelsblad and Nieuwsuur:

Thousands of children in the Netherlands go to a Salafi school in addition to their regular school. At different mosque schools, teachers teach that Muslim youth should not become friends with Jews or Christians. This is the conclusion of a study by Nieuwsuur and NRC Handelsblad. They also learn that people with a different religion or belief deserve the death penalty.

Thousands of children in the Netherlands follow Islamic lessons outside of regular education. In this informal Islam education, Salafism, a fundamentalist movement, is becoming increasingly dominant.

Nieuwsuur and NRC discovered that there are already at least 50 schools with strong Salafi influences. They investigated what children are taught at those schools. In various textbooks, the punishment of non-believers or other believers is promoted. In a book that the mosque recommends for 15 year olds there is a question about the assessment of someone who denies 1 of the mentioned Islamic columns. The book's answer is "he must be killed because he is an unbeliever."

Children learn to dislike people with a different belief or belief. An important starting lesson is that their clothing may not resemble the clothing of non-Muslims. In this exercise, children must write "who imitates a people belongs to them".

From the age of 15/16 young people learn in different places in the Netherlands that they should not become friends with others. Like with Jews or with Christians. They are not even allowed to let non-Muslims eat their food. And they shouldn't congratulate them on Christmas, that's how we hear in this lesson. This is even a greater sin with Allah, and heavier than congratulating someone who drinks alcohol, commits murder ... this is even worse.

NRC=Dutch Most trusted newspaper & NOS.nl=Dutch best news site ( I trust not much, I do trust these)
'NOS en NRC zijn betrouwbaar, Geenstijl en Telegraaf niet' - Joop


Disclaimer:
1) Below is not my opinion. Just Islamic Dutch facts. If you don't like real facts on Islam then stop reading
2) This is not to bash Islam. It is to point out what certain Muslims teach in name of Islam in the Netherlands
3) This is in General Debate and not in Islam Debate, because it's about Islam in Western World
4) Was on the Dutch news 4 days ago. I think this is just what it is, sadly (I double checked on hoax)

Fact: In Dutch Muslim schools they have been teaching Muslim children below things about Islam:
1) People with a different religion or belief deserve the death penalty.
2) Someone who denies 1 of the mentioned Islamic Pillars ... "he must be killed because he is an unbeliever."

This is not incidental. Over 50 schools, thousands of Muslim children were exposed to this Jihad like teaching

Those were just 2 of the many things that were taught. But they did worry me quite a bit
Holland nowadays has ca. 10% Muslims. If they teach Muslim kids this, there will be many soon
I am curious what experiences other countries have with what Muslims teach their children in schools
(Recently it hit the national news that fundamentalist Islam was funding mosques in the Netherlands)
(A few years ago I saw articles about this in Scandinavia too, but I didn't know if it was trustworthy)

Problems will not be solved unless we face the dark reality within religions (now Islam):
Unless people finally realize and understand and admit the problems of Islam and Koran
Unless people finally realize and understand and admit that Islamophobia is a reality, not just a fear

About the poll:
In the poll you can check any/all of the 10 options (you can change anytime)
Because many people easily scream Islamophobia, I am curious what they scream now
If you think this is part of Islamophobia you can select 1: (the whole world can see your vote;))

Note:
I googled a little more and found some additional links

First link is the original Dutch link AND Second link(GoogleEnglishTranslated.....)
Last link is an Imam who admits it's all true about Salafist Islam terrorizing Mosques and Holland
(Muslims are threatened if they don't teach what Salafist Islamists want them to teach)
Grote zorgen Tweede Kamer na onderzoek salafistische moskeescholen
Google Translate Major concerns Parliament after investigation Salafist mosque schools

Tumult in de moslimgemeenschap na onderzoek salafistische scholen
Google Translate Tumult in the Muslim community after research Salafist schools

Salafistische scholen leren kinderen zich af te keren van Nederland
Google Translate Salafist schools teach children to turn away from the Netherlands

Imams: ‘Zo onderwijs je de islam niet’
Google Translate Imams: "This is not how you teach Islam"


slanders only propagate Islam rather than hindering it. Please stop fabricating such things. I cant believe such schools exist in Europe any where without necessary actions from local authorities being taken against them!
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
This guy?

The Right to Religious Conversion: Between Apostasy and ...
https://s3.amazonaws.com/berkley-center/060801OmarRightReligiousConversionBetween...
Dr. A. Rashied Omar is an Imam from South Africa and Research Scholar of Islamic Studies and Peacebuilding at the University of Notre Dame. He serves as a faculty advisor to the Kroc Institute’s Program in Religion, Conflict and Peacebuilding and is an Associate of the Salam Institute for Peace and
That sounds like him.
 

danieldemol

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
slanders only propagate Islam rather than hindering it. Please stop fabricating such things. I cant believe such schools exist in Europe any where without necessary actions from local authorities being taken against them!
Shame on you for slandering stvdv when he quoted news sources.
And who said no action was being taken?
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
slanders only propagate Islam rather than hindering it. Please stop fabricating such things. I cant believe such schools exist in Europe any where without necessary actions from local authorities being taken against them!

Shame on you for slandering stvdv when he quoted news sources.
And who said no action was being taken?
:) thank you
 

QuestioningMind

Well-Known Member
Sure people can manipulate quotes from the Bible to fit their agendas.
Yet, I think the problem is for those who misinterpret the Bible and they will be held accountable to the Author. The Bible says what it says, that there is only one race, the human race and all humans are on the same level...sinners who need a Savior.

And I'm sure that plenty of Muslims will tell you that fundamentalists can misinterpret the Koran and will be held accountable to the author.
 
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