Giving up on dating (why women are difficult to date today)

[Epic Beard Man]

I realize many of the people on these forums are a lot older than me and are married with grand children, but when I speak on my experiences I'm referencing what I've experienced and by no means what I say is universal to the experiences of others or women who've I never met. When I say dating sucks, it really does suck. In some small way I understand why some men create groups like MGTOW or create Incel groups. I think with the advent of technology such as social media, human beings are increasingly less inclined to mentally know their partner or value relationships. But I also think the standards in how we value each other have changed and have become unfair. Although celebrity relationships aren't necessarily reflective on everyday relationships, I do feel women like Miley Cyrus a self declared pan-sexual who married Liam Hemsworth, on social media kissing another woman and in response to her split have the audacity to have these care free quotes about being yourself. I see this everyday in the women I meet. It's like how do you get involved in a serious marriage, split, then take pictures as if you are living a care free life although knowing the other person you married is hurt? I heard some people say that women today are acting like men which is really not something I find even fair to us men because many of us don't behave like that.

I really feel like it really is unfair to some men when it comes to the dating pool because now the standards of courting has shifted. I'm always bombarded with women who feel the need to value my manhood based on their own unrealistic standards. For example, a woman doesn't have to have a car, but a man does. A woman can live at home with her parents, but a man shouldn't. A woman doesn't have to work and be on government assistance, but a man shouldn't. In my dating experience I've dated the car less, house less, job less, and even the immature. I think I've compromised certain values I hold dear all because I want to overlook my own values to get to know the person. But it not only has damaged my perspective of dating but I'm increasingly realizing that mentally there are a lot of women that don't have their s**** together mentally.

Now, I'm not making a universal judgment but simply based on what I've encountered, there are far too many women who are mentally damaged by their last relationship, and unfortunately tend to view men who they've encountered, and unconsciously judge the present man based on the last man. I was told by a friend of mine to "not look and let them come to you" but in those types of truisms I don't see how me intentionally not searching for something makes something come to me and even if that is true is it compatible? I swear nowadays women want a man that is 6'6 making six figures with a 12 inch member. These unrealistic standards women have, and women not being honest with themselves is really making the dating pool hard

 

[bobhikes]

As a man I'd like to go on record saying I disagree. Perhaps it is in the way you go about dating. Bashing women is not going to help you. Try understanding them. There are many differences between men and women always have been and always will be, one must see more than the differences to have a successful relationship, whether it be with another man or a woman.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Sounds tough. I’m not one of the grand dads here yet so may not qualify to give advice. Ive been married nearly 20 years and have a couple of teenage kids though.

Good character in a partner is essential. For me getting married and having children was non negotiable so that eliminated many women who were not at that stage. Having a conscious spiritual outlook too, so the field was narrowed further.

At some stage I turned my focus from finding the right women to being the right man. There are certain lifestyles and attitudes that are incompatible with long term relationships.

All the best.

 

[HonestJoe]

When I say dating sucks, it really does suck.

Has it ever not? Note that actively “dating” is a specific subset of interactions between men and women and creates some unique circumstances that don’t necessarily reflect the whole.

Although celebrity relationships aren't necessarily reflective on everyday relationships…

And doubly so for the publicly presented version. I would call this entirely irrelevant to reality.

I really feel like it really is unfair to some men when it comes to the dating pool because now the standards of courting has shifted.

What makes you imagine there has been any shift. There has always been a social expectation for the man in a relationship to be the strong, stable provider. If anything, the shift over the years has been away from that presumption. Maybe you’re seeing a reaction to that shift.

Now, I'm not making a universal judgment but simply based on what I've encountered, there are far too many women who are mentally damaged by their last relationship

So you want to date women who have never suffered a bad relationship in the past? Are you expectations of them any worse than their expectations of you?

Also, if a woman have bad relationships with men and then dates other men who go on to blame her for the impact those relationships had on her, is it fair to say women are the only ones being difficult?

I swear nowadays women want a man that is 6'6 making six figures with a 12 inch member. These unrealistic standards women have, and women not being honest with themselves is really making the dating pool hard

And you have absolutely no physical or social conditions on the women you choose to date? If you didn’t, you wouldn’t still need to do it.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

At some stage I turned my focus from finding the right women to being the right man. There are certain lifestyles and attitudes that are incompatible with long term relationships.

I second this. I have been with the same woman for 15 years (married 5) and I've found relationships aren't so much about the perfect woman, but a compatible one who is worth the hard work that goes into molding a life around another person with separate wants and needs.

 

[Revoltingest]

When there's a problem between a man & every woman,
one should consider that the problem might be with the man.

 

[PoetPhilosopher]

When there's a problem between a man & every woman,
one should consider that the problem might be with the man.

Not necessarily. For example, I fathom the OP might be talking about online dating. In online dating, the woman gets about 80 messages a day in her inbox, so she can afford to be much more picky than say, that lovely woman at the bar.

 

[Revoltingest]

Not necessarily. For example, I fathom the OP might be talking about online dating. In online dating, the woman gets about 80 messages a day in her inbox, so she can afford to be much more picky than say, that lovely woman at the bar.

I said only to consider one's own role in the problem.
But as every man knows, all women are crazy.

 

[Brickjectivity]

No idea, but there are some very good books about the differences between male and female psychology. One that is very easy to find at any library is Men Are From Mars Women Are From Venus In Love. I haven't read the whole thing, but I have skimmed some of it. Its good and probably right up your alley. You may also want to get your date to read it.

 

[Augustus]

One that is very easy to find at any library is Men Are From Mars Women Are From Venus In Love. I haven't read the whole thing, but I have skimmed some of it. Its good and probably right up your alley. You may also want to get your date to read it.*

* If you think it preferable that she never even considers contacting you again

 

[Brickjectivity]

* If you think it preferable that she never even considers contacting you again

That is a good point.

 

[Sunstone]

"Blame the women" is the oldest, most screwed up game on earth.

In my admittedly limited experience, if you think you can't find a damn good woman because too many women are messed up, you are doing it wrong. You. Not them. You. And the sooner you quit babying your tender ego like an Incel, and take some responsibility for changing yourself, the better.

Maybe I'm wrong about all of that -- but that is how I see it.

I am voluntarily celibate and I'm nothing special to look at, but I have women hit on me right and left. Either at the coffee shop I frequent or from discovering me through my blog. If I like them, I turn them into platonic friends. Currently, I am in daily or weekly contact with over a dozen women from around the world -- and in nearly daily offline contact with four women from the coffee shop. All of those women -- every last one of them -- at one time hit on me. And those are just the ones I decided to befriend. I'm not even counting the women I myself was not interested in having as a friend.

If women aren't falling over themselves to date you dude, don't blame the women. It's you, not them. If a relatively unattractive dude like me can have my pick, a potentially attractive guy like you has absolutely no excuse -- none.

Of course, I'm probably wrong about all of that. I'm wrong about everything. Move along now. Nothing to see here. That old Sunstone, he sure as hell doesn't know what he's talking about. Can't be us dudes. It's the women. They're the ones who are messed up. Yup, it's always the women. Doesn't that dumb old Sunstone know it's always the women?

 

[sealchan]

I realize many of the people on these forums are a lot older than me and are married with grand children, but when I speak on my experiences I'm referencing what I've experienced and by no means what I say is universal to the experiences of others or women who've I never met. When I say dating sucks, it really does suck. In some small way I understand why some men create groups like MGTOW or create Incel groups. I think with the advent of technology such as social media, human beings are increasingly less inclined to mentally know their partner or value relationships. But I also think the standards in how we value each other have changed and have become unfair. Although celebrity relationships aren't necessarily reflective on everyday relationships, I do feel women like Miley Cyrus a self declared pan-sexual who married Liam Hemsworth, on social media kissing another woman and in response to her split have the audacity to have these care free quotes about being yourself. I see this everyday in the women I meet. It's like how do you get involved in a serious marriage, split, then take pictures as if you are living a care free life although knowing the other person you married is hurt? I heard some people say that women today are acting like men which is really not something I find even fair to us men because many of us don't behave like that.

I really feel like it really is unfair to some men when it comes to the dating pool because now the standards of courting has shifted. I'm always bombarded with women who feel the need to value my manhood based on their own unrealistic standards. For example, a woman doesn't have to have a car, but a man does. A woman can live at home with her parents, but a man shouldn't. A woman doesn't have to work and be on government assistance, but a man shouldn't. In my dating experience I've dated the car less, house less, job less, and even the immature. I think I've compromised certain values I hold dear all because I want to overlook my own values to get to know the person. But it not only has damaged my perspective of dating but I'm increasingly realizing that mentally there are a lot of women that don't have their s**** together mentally.

Now, I'm not making a universal judgment but simply based on what I've encountered, there are far too many women who are mentally damaged by their last relationship, and unfortunately tend to view men who they've encountered, and unconsciously judge the present man based on the last man. I was told by a friend of mine to "not look and let them come to you" but in those types of truisms I don't see how me intentionally not searching for something makes something come to me and even if that is true is it compatible? I swear nowadays women want a man that is 6'6 making six figures with a 12 inch member. These unrealistic standards women have, and women not being honest with themselves is really making the dating pool hard

The problem with relationships is to turn the difficulties into opportunities...no one is perfect and intimate relationshipping merely brings that out into the open. Half of what one person is is what the partner projects onto them. Relationship is all about getting at the objectivity of self and other and thereby getting at who you are more fully than living in relative isolation and independence can do.

The sexual instinct is essential in establishing the momentum of "good will" in this process. The initial attraction moderated by experience gives a couple what they need to establish what will turn out to be a shared story of infinite satisfaction with the flame of attraction nurtured throughout.

 

[Left Coast]

I realize many of the people on these forums are a lot older than me and are married with grand children, but when I speak on my experiences I'm referencing what I've experienced and by no means what I say is universal to the experiences of others or women who've I never met. When I say dating sucks, it really does suck. In some small way I understand why some men create groups like MGTOW or create Incel groups. I think with the advent of technology such as social media, human beings are increasingly less inclined to mentally know their partner or value relationships. But I also think the standards in how we value each other have changed and have become unfair. Although celebrity relationships aren't necessarily reflective on everyday relationships, I do feel women like Miley Cyrus a self declared pan-sexual who married Liam Hemsworth, on social media kissing another woman and in response to her split have the audacity to have these care free quotes about being yourself. I see this everyday in the women I meet. It's like how do you get involved in a serious marriage, split, then take pictures as if you are living a care free life although knowing the other person you married is hurt? I heard some people say that women today are acting like men which is really not something I find even fair to us men because many of us don't behave like that.

I really feel like it really is unfair to some men when it comes to the dating pool because now the standards of courting has shifted. I'm always bombarded with women who feel the need to value my manhood based on their own unrealistic standards. For example, a woman doesn't have to have a car, but a man does. A woman can live at home with her parents, but a man shouldn't. A woman doesn't have to work and be on government assistance, but a man shouldn't. In my dating experience I've dated the car less, house less, job less, and even the immature. I think I've compromised certain values I hold dear all because I want to overlook my own values to get to know the person. But it not only has damaged my perspective of dating but I'm increasingly realizing that mentally there are a lot of women that don't have their s**** together mentally.

Now, I'm not making a universal judgment but simply based on what I've encountered, there are far too many women who are mentally damaged by their last relationship, and unfortunately tend to view men who they've encountered, and unconsciously judge the present man based on the last man. I was told by a friend of mine to "not look and let them come to you" but in those types of truisms I don't see how me intentionally not searching for something makes something come to me and even if that is true is it compatible? I swear nowadays women want a man that is 6'6 making six figures with a 12 inch member. These unrealistic standards women have, and women not being honest with themselves is really making the dating pool hard

Ok so plenty of guys are being critical of your post here, and I don't want to dogpile.

The truth is, you're right, dating does suck. The patriarchy and Puritanical gender norms with which our society has gifted us create unrealistic expectations for both men and women in romantic relationships. Men are supposed to be breadwinners, women are supposed to be beautiful homemakers. Although we're moving away from those "norms," they still linger in the dating scene, no question.

That said, I think you're reacting emotionally out of frustration. Which is understandable, because dating is almost inherently frustrating (and a relatively new way for humans to get together, historically). But I would try to put myself in the other person's shoes. As a gay dude with plenty of female friends let me tell you - the dating scene is not any kinder to them. Men have our own ridiculous vices and expectations.

Also remember that single life most likely won't last forever. Most of us find partners and eventually spouses. Stay positive and remember that a good match is out there for you. Maybe just not today.

 

[Rival]

Somehow, I'm a girl, so I'll give some thoughts. I tend to prefer women but I like men too and when I fall, I fall hard and fast. That said, here goes:

In my experience I need (or in some cases don't) these things to fall for a bloke:

• To feel vulnerable. I need him to make me feel in a way less than him because when I feel I'm his match, so to speak, I am made to think I may as well go forward in life on my own because I don't need him. What can he do that I can't do myself? How can he protect me if a murderous rapist breaks into our house? I'm not saying this in terms of physical requirements at all, but in terms of mental ones. How mature and mentally prepared is he to deal with difficult, stressful situations with which I can't? So is he naturally confident and does he make me want to submit to his natural authority?
• Is he a go getter? Or does he just talk about video games and imaginary politics all day? If his main interest is the next comic-con and he's 21+ but knows next to nothing about real world issues then I don't even give him a chance. He doesn't need to be working, but showing that he's not content not to work either.
• Are we sexually compatible? Is he a dom who is going to be in charge in bed, with a playfully sadistic bent, who makes me want to sexually submit to him? If not, he can have everything else on this list and still be crossed-off. Sexual attraction and compatibility is always a priority for anyone, male or female.
• Is he trying too hard to pursue me? This always comes off as desperate and needy before he even knows me, and it's just cringeworthy. In fact, every man I've ever fallen for has had near to no sexual or romantic interest in me whatsoever and I find that much easier to deal with and it makes me feel less uncomfortable. If he's constantly trying to impress me by talking about all his accomplishments and buying me stuff, I will quickly turn away. If he shows me his accomplishments and asks me if I want things, I'll draw closer.
• Has he opinions? Or is it, 'whatever makes you happy'? If he's not prepared to discuss his real opinions with me, or anyone, and instead defaults to trying to keep things palatable I'll walk away. Similarly, if his opinions are basically non-existent by way of having little to no interest in religion or politics, he also gets ****ed off. I need him to show that he's alright having a debate with me and doesn't need us to agree on everything all the time, because that's setting up the relationship to fail with unreasonable expectations as well as setting a precedent never to share anything serious with me.
• Does he let me do all the talking while he sits there smitten? Please, blokes, do you realise how terrible this looks and how awkward it makes things? This goes back to point 1, essentially - take some control and have a real conversation about actual things that aren't how pretty I am and what your favourite car is.
• Don't touch me. I mean it. No arms around shoulders, no hugs, no kisses. Do. Not. Touch. Me. Until. We. Are. In. A. Relationship.

 

[Earthtank]

Somehow, I'm a girl, so I'll give some thoughts. I tend to prefer women but I like men too and when I fall, I fall hard and fast. That said, here goes:

In my experience I need (or in some cases don't) these things to fall for a bloke:

• To feel vulnerable. I need him to make me feel in a way less than him because when I feel I'm his match, so to speak, I am made to think I may as well go forward in life on my own because I don't need him. What can he do that I can't do myself? How can he protect me if a murderous rapist breaks into our house? I'm not saying this in terms of physical requirements at all, but in terms of mental ones. How mature and mentally prepared is he to deal with difficult, stressful situations with which I can't? So is he naturally confident and does he make me want to submit to his natural authority?
• Is he a go getter? Or does he just talk about video games and imaginary politics all day? If his main interest is the next comic-con and he's 21+ but knows next to nothing about real world issues then I don't even give him a chance. He doesn't need to be working, but showing that he's not content not to work either.
• Are we sexually compatible? Is he a dom who is going to be in charge in bed, with a playfully sadistic bent, who makes me want to sexually submit to him? If not, he can have everything else on this list and still be crossed-off. Sexual attraction and compatibility is always a priority for anyone, male or female.
• Is he trying too hard to pursue me? This always comes off as desperate and needy before he even knows me, and it's just cringeworthy. In fact, every man I've ever fallen for has had near to no sexual or romantic interest in me whatsoever and I find that much easier to deal with and it makes me feel less uncomfortable. If he's constantly trying to impress me by talking about all his accomplishments and buying me stuff, I will quickly turn away. If he shows me his accomplishments and asks me if I want things, I'll draw closer.
• Has he opinions? Or is it, 'whatever makes you happy'? If he's not prepared to discuss his real opinions with me, or anyone, and instead defaults to trying to keep things palatable I'll walk away. Similarly, if his opinions are basically non-existent by way of having little to no interest in religion or politics, he also gets ****ed off. I need him to show that he's alright having a debate with me and doesn't need us to agree on everything all the time, because that's setting up the relationship to fail with unreasonable expectations as well as setting a precedent never to share anything serious with me.
• Does he let me do all the talking while he sits there smitten? Please, blokes, do you realise how terrible this looks and how awkward it makes things? This goes back to point 1, essentially - take some control and have a real conversation about actual things that aren't how pretty I am and what your favourite car is.
• Don't touch me. I mean it. No arms around shoulders, no hugs, no kisses. Do. Not. Touch. Me. Until. We. Are. In. A. Relationship.

Yeah i am going to go ahead and assume you are single. You will say you are not just to try and prove me wrong but, if you are not then its either your partner is desperate or a murderer

 

[Rival]

Yeah i am going to go ahead and assume you are single. You will say you are not just to try and prove me wrong but, if you are not then its either your partner is desperate or a murderer

I am single. Had plenty of chances. Not sure what your problem is, really.

 

[Stanyon]

You live in or around L.A. right?

 

[columbus]

Why bother with women anyways?
Unless you feel the need to continue overpopulation of the planet, which I consider an immoral choice.

Tom

So, how're ya doin

 

[Rival]

Why bother with women anyways?
Unless you feel the need to continue overpopulation of the planet, which I consider an immoral choice.

Tom

So, how're ya doin

You have the men, I'll have the women.

Or rather, they'll have me.