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What should the federal minimum wage rightfully be in 2019?

Rival

Si m'ait Dieus
Staff member
Premium Member
I don't know. But there are some certification programs like CompTIA A+ that are like an in-between.
What about apprenticeships? Just finding a job? Very few people went to Uni in the 50s and their wages were way, way better.
 

SalixIncendium

अग्निविलोवनन्दः
Staff member
Premium Member
Would FIFTEEN (as in FIGHT for FIFTEEN) cut it to meet the above requirements?

What many people fail to realize is if minimum wage goes to $15/hr, those who employ minimum wage workers will have no choice but to raise prices for their product or go under. Instead of paying $4.29 for a Whopper, you'll be paying nearly $7.
 

Jonathan Bailey

Well-Known Member
What about those people who don't want to go? University was never for me and I have never needed it.

What about the days when my father and grandfather earned good union-scale pay in California doing skilled trades with only a HS diploma? A college degree is not necessary to operate a bulldozer as a union Operating Engineer wire a new home as an electrician contractor.

We need to promote the traditional industrial arts in America and re-establish manufacturing, civil engineering and infrastructure.

GI Bills, federal loans and Pell Grants should be also available for trade schools, technical schools and apprenticeship programs

Our roads, dams, locks, levees, buildings, streets, tunnels, wharves, railroads, water mains, reservoirs, flood management infrastructure, public street lighting, power lines, sewage systems, water management systems, waste and pollution management systems, water reclamation systems and bridges are crumbling and the "service industry" is no cure for that.
 
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Brickjectivity

Turned to Stone. Now I stretch daily.
Staff member
Premium Member
I wonder....
Under what constitutional power could the fed require
every employer in every state to pay a minimum wage?
I would be similar to the power to tax income, probably. If it may tax income then surely it may regulate it. Instead it should not be messing with income at all. It uses the income tax as some kind of subsidy gimmick, too.
 

Rival

Si m'ait Dieus
Staff member
Premium Member
What about the days when my father and grandfather earned good union-scale pay in California doing skilled trades with only a HS diploma? A college degree is not necessary to operate a bulldozer as a union Operating Engineer wire a new home as an electrician contractor.

We need to promote the traditional industrial arts in America and re-establish manufacturing, civil engineering and infrastructure.

GI Bills, federal loans and Pell Grants should be also available for trade schools, technical schools and apprenticeship programs

Our roads, dams, locks, levees, buildings, streets, tunnels, wharves, railroads, water mains, reservoirs, flood management infrastructure, public street lighting, power lines, sewage systems, water management systems, waste and pollution management systems, water reclamation systems and bridges are crumbling and the "service industry" is no cure for that.
Yes, this is exactly what I'm saying.
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
I wonder....
Under what constitutional power could the fed require
every employer in every state to pay a minimum wage?

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
I would be similar to the power to tax income, probably.
The 16th Amendment authorized that.
(Interestingly, they placed no limit on the percentage taken.)
Sixteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution - Wikipedia
"The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes,
from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the
several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration."
If it may tax income then surely it may regulate it.
The 16th Amendment could be interpreted to regulate wages?
Dang....the Constitution seems to place no limits on government.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
That confers the right of the fed to regulate wages in all the states?
A mission statement like that, if treated broadly as law, could be used to
authorize anything which government believes serves those purposes.
It could essentially gut the rest of the Constitution.
Example:
Censoring political speech could be rationalized to ensure domestic tranquility.
Does the preamble take priority over the 1st Amendment?
Over the 10th?
Nah.
I don't think a preamble should be read to grant vague powers without limit.

Let's also consider the Enumerated Powers clause, & the 10th Amendment....
The 10th:
'The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited
by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
Enumerated powers:
Article One of the United States Constitution - Wikipedia

If the power to regulate wages isn't enumerated in the Constitution, this would mean
that the states have that authority.
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
That confers the right of the fed to regulate wages in all the states?
A mission statement like that, if treated broadly as law, could be used to
authorize anything which government believes serves those purposes.
It could essentially gut the rest of the Constitution.
Example:
Censoring political speech could be rationalized to ensure domestic tranquility.
Does the preamble take priority over the 1st Amendment?
Over the 10th?
Nah.
I don't think a preamble should be read to grant vague powers without limit.

Let's also consider the Enumerated Powers clause, & the 10th Amendment....
The 10th:
'The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited
by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
Enumerated powers:
Article One of the United States Constitution - Wikipedia

If the power to regulate wages isn't enumerated in the Constitution, this would mean
that the states have that authority.

The Federal minimum wage sets the national standard, but states are allowed to set a higher minimum wage.

Since the Federal minimum has existed for many decades and has not been declared unconstitutional, it would appear that there are those in high places who believe it is constitutional.

If it wasn't, then I would imagine somebody would have brought a lawsuit by now. (I'm sure there probably has already been, but I'm too lazy to look such things up on a Saturday morning.)
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
The Federal minimum wage sets the national standard, but states are allowed to set a higher minimum wage.

Since the Federal minimum has existed for many decades and has not been declared unconstitutional, it would appear that there are those in high places who believe it is constitutional.

If it wasn't, then I would imagine somebody would have brought a lawsuit by now. (I'm sure there probably has already been, but I'm too lazy to look such things up on a Saturday morning.)
I think we can all agree that laws aren't necessarily constitutional or
not just cuz the USSC majority says so. We little people are free to
disagree with them. Criminy, they disagree among themselves.

Remember, there are vaunted constitutional scholars who believe that
prohibiting gay marriage & abortion is constitutional.
 

shmogie

Well-Known Member
Congress has never let the federal minimum wage erode for this long

What is the minimum a single-person household adult American needs to truly earn a living income?
Minimum wages were designed for entry level jobs, and no one was expected to stay in one very long.

Flipping burgers at Mc Donalds was never meant to be a career.

Raising the minimum wage for know nothing jobs, means less of them, with employees expected to do more to get more as others are eliminated.

Further, employers are compelled to research mechanization, which eliminates more jobs.

The US offers free education to high school, and there are many virtually free vocational training programs.

The minimum wage earner who has no children is expected to put forth an effort to better themselves.

I, and millions of my generation worked to earn our degrees. I worked 6 hours a night, for the minimum wage, cleaning toilets at night as a school janitor. I went to school full time in the daytime.

As I said, millions of us did it.

I know that now college tuition is a whole different thing now. However, self improvement and a good paying job don´t require degrees. Skills can be learned with effort and determination.

If you don´t speak English and only had a third grade education in Guatemala, and here legally, get your *** out there and learn to survive in our society.

If you are here illegally, I have no sympathy for you and I hope ICE returns you to where you came from.



 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
It should be commensurate with the rate of inflation.

As an example, in 1971, my grandfather bought a house in Santa Ana, California for $28,000. That same house is worth $629,204 today (according to Zillow), 22.47 times its value from almost 50 years ago.

The minimum wage in 1971 was $1.60 per hour. $1.60 x 22.47 = $35.95 per hour = should be the minimum wage today.
That would be interesting. If the Coast got wages that high, would they apply to the whole state?
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
It depends on where you live. Where I life $15 x 40 hrs. per week would be survivable, but just barely. But in many locations it would not be enough.
It would be overkill in rural Indiana, where those wages will let you live like royalty.
 

Rival

Si m'ait Dieus
Staff member
Premium Member
IMO If your wage doesn't cover every single living expense you have to pay in order to live in the modern world, plus some small luxuries every once in a while, it's not worth being called a wage and should be illegal.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
IMO If your wage doesn't cover every single living expense you have to pay in order to live in the modern world, plus some small luxuries every once in a while, it's not worth being called a wage and should be illegal.
Yup. And far too many people just do not have the ability, option, or choice to get a better job. They shouldn't be punished for that.
 
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