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Bible & Critical Thinking

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member
I laughed because Audie's claim is funny. It certainly is false if taken literally.

Really i think she is only talking about a subset of fundementalists. Look at her example. Young Earth Creationists are a dogmatic subset of fundamentalists.

Alright. So you think some Christian Fundamentalists are Critical Thinkers?
 

Audie

Veteran Member
I laughed because Audie's claim is funny. It certainly is false if taken literally.

Really i think she is only talking about a subset of fundementalists. Look at her example. Young Earth Creationists are a dogmatic subset of fundamentalists.

Prease exprain what kinda fundy can hold
views that allow for intellectual integrity.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
Alright. So you think some Christian Fundamentalists are Critical Thinkers?

Why not? Among engineers, creationists are thick
as hairs on a dog's back.

The prob they have is with bible-stories. Then
the wall goes up, sealing that off from thought.
 

dianaiad

Well-Known Member
Alright. So you think some Christian Fundamentalists are Critical Thinkers?

Are you claiming that none are?

I'm not a "Christian Fundamentalist.' Far from it. In fact, most "Christian fundamentalists' wouldn't even acknowledge that I'm a Christian, since I'm not A; trinitarian, B; Calvinist or C; whatever is next on their list of things one must be in order to be Christian. That list changes. I never know quite what someone is going to put on it.

That aside, I HAVE met quite a few who ARE critical thinkers. It's just a matter of what they decide to think critically about. I have never met anybody who is a critical thinker about everything.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
There is 1 difference ... the Divine paycheck you get once when you die, so until then no "factual experiences" ... unless being enlightened before
(or of course the Divine grants you the experience while being alive ... but that does not happen on daily basis is my experience)
But it is true ... we know nothing for sure, we expect to wake up next morning... but???. Hence the advice to say "Deo Volente" when planning ahead

So, you are saying that "belief" in a paycheck is exactly the same but the difference is in timing.

And yet in my belief, I do get factual experiences in smaller measures, in particular manifestations as I "believed". But, as you said, the actual "paycheck" or "no paycheck" will happen when I cease breathing on this earth.
 

dianaiad

Well-Known Member
Keep in mind that it is impossible to be a well
informed and intellectually honest fundy.

Actually, it is possible.

As long as the topic isn't religion.

Just as I can, with good reason, say that it is impossible to be a well informed and intellectually honest partisan, either Democrat or Republican. Not about politics.

But pick some other topic?

Sure.
 

Road Warrior

Seeking the middle path..
Why not? Among engineers, creationists are thick
as hairs on a dog's back.

The prob they have is with bible-stories. Then
the wall goes up, sealing that off from thought.
I think being a "creationist" and not taking Genesis literally are incompatible. A person who believes God created the Big Bang and gave the spark of life to creation isn't, IMO, the same as a person who believes God created the Universe in 7 days, Adam wholly formed and Eve from his rib. The latter would be a fundamentalist Christian not seeing the situation using critical thinking. The former would be someone who is using critical thinking but with a belief in the supernatural.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
Why not? Among engineers, creationists are thick
as hairs on a dog's back.

The prob they have is with bible-stories. Then
the wall goes up, sealing that off from thought.
Which, of course, may be what they say about your thinking process. Isn't that a subjective position?
 

Road Warrior

Seeking the middle path..
Alright. So you think some Christian Fundamentalists are Critical Thinkers?
I do not see how any Fundamentalist, being rigid in their beliefs be they communists, political or religious fundamentalists, is using Critical Thinking.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
I think being a "creationist" and not taking Genesis literally are incompatible. A person who believes God created the Big Bang and gave the spark of life to creation isn't, IMO, the same as a person who believes God created the Universe in 7 days, Adam wholly formed and Eve from his rib. The latter would be a fundamentalist Christian not seeing the situation using critical thinking. The former would be someone who is using critical thinking but with a belief in the supernatural.

I potentially could accept that there is a "creator"
but such has not been detected as yet.

Belief that there is, is entirely a matter of faith.

Critical thinking exists in a climate of doubt, not
faith in a foregone conclusion that lacks all
supporting evidence.

Our "believer" may well, probably does use CTS
in other realms of life, but has to wall "god" off
from it.
 

Road Warrior

Seeking the middle path..
Actually, it is possible.

As long as the topic isn't religion.

Just as I can, with good reason, say that it is impossible to be a well informed and intellectually honest partisan, either Democrat or Republican. Not about politics.

But pick some other topic?

Sure.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that's the question. Thanks for admitting a person who is a creationist isn't using Critical Thinking.
 

Road Warrior

Seeking the middle path..
I potentially could accept that there is a "creator"
but such has not been detected as yet.

Belief that there is, is entirely a matter of faith.

Critical thinking exists in a climate of doubt, not
faith in a foregone conclusion that lacks all
supporting evidence.

Our "believer" may well, probably does use CTS
in other realms of life, but has to wall "god" off
from it.
Agreed. In short, if it exists within the Universe, Critical Thinking can be applied. If external, then it's a matter of faith. The Fundie Christians who believe the Earth is only 6000 years old are not using Critical Thinking.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
Agreed. In short, if it exists within the Universe, Critical Thinking can be applied. If external, then it's a matter of faith. The Fundie Christians who believe the Earth is only 6000 years old are not using Critical Thinking.

I guess that is in agreement with what I said
about the impossibility of a fundy being
intellectually honest re his beliefs.
 

dybmh

דניאל יוסף בן מאיר הירש
Prease exprain what kinda fundy can hold
views that allow for intellectual integrity.
2 examples:

1) Belief in an omniscient omnipotent diety combined with the concept of God-time creates the possibilty, arguably, for a fundamentalist understanding of the bible while at the same time does not negate intellectual integrity.

2) an Atheist fundamentalist maintains their intellectual integrity.
 

Road Warrior

Seeking the middle path..
I guess that is in agreement with what I said
about the impossibility of a fundy being
intellectually honest re his beliefs.
What do you mean by "intellectually honest"? That they are lying? Can a true believer be lying about their beliefs? Not just doubt, but actual lying. I know some Televangelists are obvious liars, but I know several people who strongly believe the Bible is the direct word of God. I doubt they are being intellectually dishonest.
 

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member
I honestly feel this may be one of my best threads yet even if not everyone may agree. I feel happy, but also more than thank the involvement of this wonderful community.
 

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member
2 examples:

1) Belief in an omniscient omnipotent diety combined with the concept of God-time creates the possibilty, arguably, for a fundamentalist understanding of the bible while at the same time does not negate intellectual integrity.

2) an Atheist fundamentalist maintains their intellectual integrity.

1. I don't understand what God-time is.

2. That doesn't matter. The definitions of Atheist fundamentalist and Christian Fundamentalist are not similar.
 
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