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Questions of religion

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member
1. What are the positives and pitfalls of Panentheism?

2. What are the positives and pitfalls of Atheism?

3. What are the positives and pitfalls of Spiritualism?
 

siti

Well-Known Member
1. What are the positives and pitfalls of Panentheism?
Panentheism has the part of "God" that is the 'pan' of reality firmly in the natural realm - that means it should be possible to investigate that part of "God" scientifically - or at least by natural means. The pitfall is that it still admits a (possibly infinite) level of supernaturalism rendering what can be learned naturally by natural organisms like ourselves almost irrelevant by comparison to the true extent of the 'supernature' of the deity. IMO - not much better than straight theism.

2. What are the positives and pitfalls of Atheism?
Atheism does away with any concept of deity at all - understanding reality is a completely natural process fully enclosed within the natural world that we really live in. Potential pitfall is that it can be too easy for an atheist to dismiss religion as irrelevant - in this case, the bath water needs to be retained even if the baby is thrown out - religion has been a very powerful force in the evolution of human cultures and societies even if God is not really there. That needs to be understood respectfully.

3. What are the positives and pitfalls of Spiritualism?
I can't think of any positives except that Robert Owen became one towards the end of his life. Owen was a radical socialist and a freethinking deist (before it was fashionable to be an atheist) - I hugely admire his radical (for the time) thinking on social and economic issues...his attempt to actually implement them were massive failures - I know that has nothing to o with your thread, but if I did ever become a spiritualist, he would definitely be one of the departed I would want to get in touch with. Pitfalls - well I have enough trouble communicating effectively with the living - I doubt I'd be terribly good at it.
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
1. What are the positives and pitfalls of Panentheism?

This is basically my belief so that's a positive ;)

The positive can be not being trapped by the vision of God as an old man on a cloud but being able to see the divine everywhere visible, in everything and beyond everything. So this frees people to seek the divine in whatever way is most helpful.

A pitfall could be lack of focus - to be too easily trapped by a superficial belief rather than choosing and following a helpful path to realizing the divine.

2. What are the positives and pitfalls of Atheism?

The positive part of atheism is to insist on proof rather than swallowing a belief unexamined.

The pitfall is to insist that the proof be comprehensible by the rational intellect rather than being able to see that the intellect is not the highest form of "intelligence".

3. What are the positives and pitfalls of Spiritualism?

By spiritualism, I assume you mean communication with bodyless spirits possibly including astral travel.

I don't actually see a positive to this outside of perhaps convincing someone that the gross physical plane is not the only one.

The pitfall is that the ones contacted might be mischievous or more negative and mislead people.
 

siti

Well-Known Member
They assert there is no god(s) or anything beyond the physical.
No they don't. They assert that there is no compelling reason to say that there are any deities...no reason to believe. I suppose if you turn that into a positive expression of belief, it might be that the existence of the world and all that is in it can (at least potentially) be explained without reference to a deity. But you certainly could be an atheist and not be a physicalist.
 

Road Warrior

Seeking the middle path..
No they don't. They assert that there is no compelling reason to say that there are any deities...no reason to believe. I suppose if you turn that into a positive expression of belief, it might be that the existence of the world and all that is in it can (at least potentially) be explained without reference to a deity. But you certainly could be an atheist and not be a physicalist.
You should read their posts. Of course, I'm only talking about online atheists since, like most theists, most atheists mind their own business. How many here know the religious beliefs of their fellow coworkers? I only know of a few out of hundreds.
 

David T

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
I am into the cult of breathing. We believe we breathe. Since we breathe, it proves that what we believe is fact!!!
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
I am into the cult of breathing. We believe we breathe. Since we breathe, it proves that what we believe is fact!!!
It seems that you stop short of being a breatharian aka a person who believes that it is possible, through meditation, to reach a level of consciousness where one can obtain all sustenance from the air or sunlight.
 

David T

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
It seems that you stop short of being a breatharian aka a person who believes that it is possible, through meditation, to reach a level of consciousness where one can obtain all sustenance from the air or sunlight.
Omg i am a breatharian!!! I didnt know that!!! My people! Well we believe that when you die you become the great air giver. Thus naturally plants are a part of that thus yes you are correct. once again very scientific.
In fact we are all about science actually... factually...we use the internet.....
 

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member
And this may be embarrassing to admit, but my issue with Panentheism is that I'd rather worship a deity of Yin & Yang or Yin, while the Philosophical concept of God has a whole lot of Yang (in my opinion).
 

siti

Well-Known Member
You should read their posts. Of course, I'm only talking about online atheists since, like most theists, most atheists mind their own business. How many here know the religious beliefs of their fellow coworkers? I only know of a few out of hundreds.
I do read their posts and more than a few get annoyed by the frequent attempts of people who have a belief in God to (apparently deliberately because the point has been explained many times) mischaracterize their lack of belief in deities as a positive statement about something they may not even have bothered to think deeply about let alone express an opinion on.
 

siti

Well-Known Member
Does anyone have any opinions on whether Panentheism and Spiritualism are compatible?
Not specifically, but I don't see how panentheism rules anything out - that's my main objection to it philosophically, it seems to me to be an attempt to put some of the transcendent supernatural stuff that is rejected in going from theism to pantheism back on the table, but in doing that, one ends up back to theism - God is 'out there' and nothing is fundamentally explicable in terms of nature but must have an ultimate transcendent, supernatural, immaterial, aphysical...etc. cause. And if that's true, who is to say we can't all join hands and commune with the dead? But it just seems like having one's cake and ha'penny to me.
 
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