Re: What use does an atheist have for deities?

[LuisDantas]

How so? you're speaking of deities as psychological symbols in Atheism, which is hardly relevant at all to our beliefs.

How does this thread's subject matter relate to idolatry as you understand it?

 

[syo]

You stop when the placebo's effect begins to wear off. Symbols are both objective and subjective. Like real medicines they are meant to adjust the body/the mind, not be used in perpetuity. When one no longer feels the "numinous power" of the symbol then one naturally abandons it. Great spiritual literature, however, contains enough wealth that one can "mine" it for gold one's whole life. That is why I see spiritual truth as a life long journey rather than an acquisition of one moment of revelation or transformation which dissolves into a mere dogma gradually afterwards.

We are complex, adaptive body-minds which develop creative orientations to our natural and social environment and which suffer from physical and mental malfunctions which can and should be treated. Spiritual advisors are at best "medicine men/women" and at worst bureaucrats of a dogmatic order...they prescribe what you need not teach you rote lessons (well with exceptions for the meditative disciplines).

I don't know actually. Maybe you are right.

 

[Father Heathen]

How can belief in a supernatural anti-god be atheistic? I don't know any atheists who believe in Satan.

FFS...did you not even read the post you replied to?

 

[sealchan]

I don't dream of religion or its myths.

I would welcome, as a challenge, for anyone to share a dream report, either their own or one offerred publicly by others that you think has no relationship to the symbolism found in religion or myths and I will be glad to see if I cannot demonstrate otherwise.

I know a couple of website if you want to take me up on this challenge that I can refer you to for dream content.

 

[Father Heathen]

A ''God'' is a term we use about entities that exist, and these entities hold universal truths. Loki is the God mischief. Mischief is a universal truth. But Loki cannot work alone. He is part of a pantheon. The pantheon all together is complete universal truths.
@Father Heathen did not create a god. he didn't mention any attributes that are true. His god was just imagination. And I think he was inspired by the christian God. Now, is the Christian God real? Unfortunately, yes.

First you say "The Gods are real, they are not symbols." but then "His god was just imagination.", so which is it?

BTW, Lord Xargoltus is the god of false gods.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Deities, for this atheist at least, really enhance my ability to swear!

 

[PureX]

I can't pray to the unknown.

Why not?

I am NOT a christian that's why.

What does that have to do with anything? You don't have to be a Christian to pray. You don't even have to know what you're praying to: God, the universe, whatever. You could pray to the unknown just because it helps you to feel better. Lots of people do.

 

[Revoltingest]

I find deities quite useful for exclamations....
- "Mein Gott!"
- "Bozhe moi! (sucky phonetic spelling, eh)"
- "Jump'n Jesus!"
- "Christ on a cracker! (the snack, not the southerner)"
- "Jesus ******* Christ!"
- "You blew it up! Ah, damn you! God damn you all to Hell !!!" (useful for time travel)

 

[LuisDantas]

I don't dream of religion or its myths.

That may well be, but generally speaking I feel that @sealchan is probably quite correct.

Atheists have dreams that are as symbolic and as meaningful as anyone else's. We are just not quite as likely to interpret them in certain ways that are encouraged by some stances and doctrines.

 

[ChristineM]

That may well be, but generally speaking I feel that @sealchan is probably quite correct.

Atheists have dreams that are as symbolic and as meaningful as anyone else's. We are just not quite as likely to interpret them in certain ways that are encouraged by some stances and doctrines.

One has dreams based based on physical and/or mental experience. On the case of deities i dont see how someone who doesn't think in terms of supernatural would dream supernatural.

 

[The Hammer]

Can you define "real" in this context?

So, for me reality is the totality of experience, emotional, logical, and physical. The Gods exist both within and outside of physical reality (midgard/ our universe), but they act (if at all) only indirectly with us and what we percieve (emotion/logic).

 

[LuisDantas]

One has dreams based based on physical and/or mental experience. On the case of deities i dont see how someone who doesn't think in terms of supernatural would dream supernatural.

I am not sure about how the neurological trends distribute, nor on how well they correlate with the situation regarding god-beliefs or even supernaturalism proper, but it is quite possible for someone who does not believe in supernatural entities to nevertheless dream of those.

 

[PureX]

One has dreams based based on physical and/or mental experience. On the case of deities i dont see how someone who doesn't think in terms of supernatural would dream supernatural.

On the other hand, fantasy and faith are not that far apart. As both are products of imagination and desire. And I trust that atheists are just as disposed to imagination and desire as anyone else, is.

 

[paarsurrey]

From another thread, where I unfortunately can not post:


Deities (in this case, the Hindu Devas) are powerful symbols of certain ideals or doctrines.

It is not only possible for an atheist to make constructive use of them (at least if the misconception that we actually believe in their literal existence as deities proper can be avoided), it is in my opinion the proper way of using deity-concepts, even for theists.

I truly wonder if early theists ever expected people to go to the lengths that some modern theists go.

Sorry, from my perspective, the deities are not real so belief in them is neither useful nor is of any use to anybody, be that person an Atheist or a Non-Atheist, please. Right, please?

Regards

 

[ChristineM]

I am not sure about how the neurological trends distribute, nor on how well they correlate with the situation regarding god-beliefs or even supernaturalism proper, but it is quite possible for someone who does not believe in supernatural entities to nevertheless dream of those.

Not the way i was taught psychology. A dream was considered the brain attempting to analyse, rationalise and compartmentalise recent experiences. One who does not consider deities would not have the mental impression of deities to dream about.

Of course if that experience included interacting with a person who spoke about gods that could trigger such a dream

 

[ChristineM]

On the other hand, fantasy and faith are not that far apart. As both are products of imagination and desire. And I trust that atheists are just as disposed to imagination and desire as anyone else, is.

Dreams dont work that way, they need a grounding in reality or experience

 

[LuisDantas]

Sorry, from my perspective, the deities are not real so belief in them is neither useful nor is of any use to anybody, be that person an Atheist or a Non-Atheist, please. Right, please?

Regards

I don't think that I agree.

Belief in deities can be a powerful motivator, at the very least. And since that is true for several competing, mutually exclusive conceptions of gods, it should be clear that this is true of unreal deities as well.

 

[ecco]

Some forms of Satanism are atheistic, in such Satan is a symbolic rather than literal figure.

How can belief in a supernatural anti-god be atheistic? I don't know any atheists who believe in Satan.

FFS...did you not even read the post you replied to?

Yes I did read your post. You stated that "Some forms of Satanism are atheistic".

I questioned how a belief in a supernatural anti-god could be atheistic. I still question why you think a belief in a supernatural anti-god could be atheistic.

Do you think that it matters that "Satan is a symbolic rather than literal figure"?

 

[ecco]

On the other hand, fantasy and faith are not that far apart.

I beg to differ. I'm a big fan of fantasy science fiction. I have read and enjoyed many books from great writers like Heinlein. I have enjoyed movies like Avatar and Star Trek.

In contrast, the Bible, other than being a source of information with which to confront Christians, is quite boring. Christian movies, like Mel Gibson's Passion of the Christ, are nothing more than Christian propaganda.

 

[ecco]

Atheists have dreams that are as symbolic and as meaningful as anyone else's.

I agree. The dreams of atheists are just as useless as the dreams of the religious.