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Humans and tails

We Never Know

No Slack
I was on another site this week in a discussion about tails. Tail uses include but are not limited to brushing away insects, balance, grasping, like a rudder(helping with running, balance), etc.
The argument is if a tail works for all the above, why did humans evolve to lose the tail. It would have been more helpful than harmful if humans had kept the tail, of course up until we started wearing clothes. I thought it was a descent question but couldn't quite form a suitable answer. It was asked how long was it, what was it's uses, why it was lost, etc.
Anyone here have a answer that would fit into our evolution, ape evolution of losing the tail?
Most appreciated.
 
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Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Isn't it obvious?
Anyone with a tail would be seen as very
weird....except perhaps at a furvert convention.
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
Human embryos develop and lose tails during gestation. I've read that sometimes a baby is born with a partial tail that is surgically removed.

Also chimps and gorillas don't have tails so it's not unique to humans.

Why Did Humans Lose Their Tails? gives more information
 

whirlingmerc

Well-Known Member
I was on another site this week in a discussion about tails. Tail uses include but are not limited to brushing away insects, balance, grasping, like a rudder(helping with running, balance), etc.
The argument is if a tail works for all the above, why did humans evolve to lose the tail. It would have been more helpful than harmful if humans had kept the tail, of course up until we started wearing clothes. I thought it was a descent question but couldn't quite form a suitable answer. It was asked how long was it, what was it's uses, why it was lost, etc.
Anyone here have a answer that would fit into our evolution of losing the tail?
Most appreciated.

Humans never had tales.

The 'tail bone' is necessary as many muscles are tied to it and your innards would not be well supported without it

Perhaps it should be called 'the tale bone'?
 

We Never Know

No Slack
Human embryos develop and lose tails during gestation. I've read that sometimes a baby is born with a partial tail that is surgically removed.


Also chimps and gorillas don't have tails so it's not unique to humans.

Why Did Humans Lose Their Tails? gives more information

Read that before. Disagreed with this part.
"Not growing a tail became more favorable for survival because it would not disrupt our balance. Most tailed animals are tetrapods – they have four limbs. The tail can be moved by an animal to manipulate its center of gravity and therefore maintain balance."

Feline and many other four limb species species greatly depend on their tail for balance.
 

We Never Know

No Slack
Humans never had tales.

The 'tail bone' is necessary as many muscles are tied to it and your innards would not be well supported without it

Perhaps it should be called 'the tale bone'?

Human ancestors had tails. It was in the ape or before line or maybe we don't know. If it wasn't, we wouldn't have remnence of a tail, the coccyx.
 

whirlingmerc

Well-Known Member
Human ancestors had tails. It was in the ape or before line or maybe we don't know. If it wasn't, we wouldn't have remnence of a tail, the coccyx.

Many times useless vestigial organs have been claimed but the list of vestigial organs had gone down and down and is arguably none

Same with Junk DNA there are many uses discovered for much of so called Junk DNA such as error checking and correction. There appears complex functions done in so called junk DNA. A more reasonable statement is 'we don't know yet what some is for'
 

Willamena

Just me
Premium Member
I was on another site this week in a discussion about tails. Tail uses include but are not limited to brushing away insects, balance, grasping, like a rudder(helping with running, balance), etc.
The argument is if a tail works for all the above, why did humans evolve to lose the tail. It would have been more helpful than harmful if humans had kept the tail, of course up until we started wearing clothes. I thought it was a descent question but couldn't quite form a suitable answer. It was asked how long was it, what was it's uses, why it was lost, etc.
Anyone here have a answer that would fit into our evolution, ape evolution of losing the tail?
Most appreciated.
One theory is that humans didn't descend from the trees, but ascended from the ocean.

 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
I was on another site this week in a discussion about tails. Tail uses include but are not limited to brushing away insects, balance, grasping, like a rudder(helping with running, balance), etc.
The argument is if a tail works for all the above, why did humans evolve to lose the tail. It would have been more helpful than harmful if humans had kept the tail, of course up until we started wearing clothes. I thought it was a descent question but couldn't quite form a suitable answer. It was asked how long was it, what was it's uses, why it was lost, etc.
Anyone here have a answer that would fit into our evolution, ape evolution of losing the tail?
Most appreciated.
I think part of it is due to genetics.

If I understand it correctly , the loss of the tail benefits by way of development of a larger brain. Sort of a genetic trade off whereas one part of the body benefits from the loss of another.

Basically the energy that would have been used in a tail went towards the energy required to develop a more efficient brain.

It's basically called a fitness trade-off because an organism has a limited energy capacity for which one trait diminishes for the benefit of another trait.

Fitness Trade-offs
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Human embryos develop and lose tails during gestation. I've read that sometimes a baby is born with a partial tail that is surgically removed.

Also chimps and gorillas don't have tails so it's not unique to humans.

Why Did Humans Lose Their Tails? gives more information
I would love to have my my feet go back to being a second pair of hands like some primates still have.
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
I was on another site this week in a discussion about tails. Tail uses include but are not limited to brushing away insects, balance, grasping, like a rudder(helping with running, balance), etc.
The argument is if a tail works for all the above, why did humans evolve to lose the tail. It would have been more helpful than harmful if humans had kept the tail, of course up until we started wearing clothes. I thought it was a descent question but couldn't quite form a suitable answer. It was asked how long was it, what was it's uses, why it was lost, etc.
Anyone here have a answer that would fit into our evolution, ape evolution of losing the tail?
Most appreciated.


Walking on 2 legs rather than 4 shifts the center of balance, also a counter balance for the weight if the head is not needed, we dont swing in trees. The energy needed to control what would be a useless appendage is better off used elsewhere. So evolution did its bit

But there are exceptions.

 

Audie

Veteran Member
Many times useless vestigial organs have been claimed but the list of vestigial organs had gone down and down and is arguably none

Same with Junk DNA there are many uses discovered for much of so called Junk DNA such as error checking and correction. There appears complex functions done in so called junk DNA. A more reasonable statement is 'we don't know yet what some is for'

Some of us here actually have a strong
background in biology, and have spent time
thinking about such things, rather than
memorizing just enough creosite ideology
to convince "believers" of some bit of facile
nonsense.

From your first sentence we see you do
not even know what "vestigial" actually
means in this context.

Bringing up irrelevancies from
creosites does not help, nor does
conflating "arguable" with legitimate.
Elvis is arguably alive.

All this effort put into displaying ideologically-
inspired ignorance might be better used on
self education.
 
Last edited:

Audie

Veteran Member
I was on another site this week in a discussion about tails. Tail uses include but are not limited to brushing away insects, balance, grasping, like a rudder(helping with running, balance), etc.
The argument is if a tail works for all the above, why did humans evolve to lose the tail. It would have been more helpful than harmful if humans had kept the tail, of course up until we started wearing clothes. I thought it was a descent question but couldn't quite form a suitable answer. It was asked how long was it, what was it's uses, why it was lost, etc.
Anyone here have a answer that would fit into our evolution, ape evolution of losing the tail?
Most appreciated.

Think of selective pressure to eliminate
a non functional but easily injured appendage.
 

whirlingmerc

Well-Known Member
Some of us here actually have a strong
background in biology, and have spent time
thinking about such things, rather than
memorizing just enough creosite ideology
to convince "believers" of some bit of facile
nonsense.

From your first sentence we see you do
not even know what "vestigial" actually
means in this context.

Bringing up irrelevancies from
creosites does not help, nor does
conflating "arguable" with legitimate.
Elvis is arguably alive.

All this effort put into displaying ideologically-
inspired ignorance might be better used on
self education.

Actually, I have 4 degrees in engineering and worked in major research centers
having been an practicing engineer for 40 years with over 25 patents. Junk DNA claims are more akin do information science and not knowing what its for is not cause to say it has no purpose.

I understand people in biology often have an ax to grind while engineers tend to have no prior investment and look at the data
 
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