Does multiculturalism always lead to falsehoods, lies and deceit and is therefore always harmful?

[Nakosis]

There are sound reasons for this: if a person behaves in a particular way that does not adhere to the norms of society dependent on his irrational religious or cultural personal beliefs he or she will try and justify his or her actions through lies and deception to his fellow human beings (thereby causing problems in society at large) as well as to the State authorities even in a court of law where he takes an oath upon his or her Holy book. These are very harmful and insidious in their impact on the need for a harmonised State. When people do something that is not normal they will try their best to escape justice, including keeping silent.

We all impact each others in what could be see as harmful ways. No getting around that, however civic laws are enforced by governments so we can coexist as best we can. Civic laws should be as blind as possible when it comes to religious beliefs.

 

[Nakosis]

What I am describing is the gradual process of evolution that will inevitably take place within any given State for a natural replacement of several delusional multicultural faiths by a single true faith (yet undescribed) that will emerge as a result with the passage of time, once the legislative enactment of appropriate laws are passed and have been acted upon by law enforcement agencies.

I suspect new delusions will take the place of the old delusions. Perhaps in some far off future.

 

[Shantanu]

We all impact each others in what could be see as harmful ways. No getting around that, however civic laws are enforced by governments so we can coexist as best we can. Civic laws should be as blind as possible when it comes to religious beliefs.

At present, civic laws are insufficient to protect the innocent from the harmful impacts of religious practices including the proselytising of clearly false doctrines.

 

[Shantanu]

I suspect new delusions will take the place of the old delusions. Perhaps in some far off future.

So long as the Courts determine them not be delusions, society functions in a great way so that the State is harmonised.

 

[shunyadragon]

At present, civic laws are insufficient to protect the innocent from the harmful impacts of religious practices including the proselytising of clearly false doctrines.

What do you consider 'false doctrines'?

 

[icehorse]

You seem to be implying that folks use their religions as a cover for their dishonesty?

Let me give you a specific example. Many religions are very misogynistic by today's standards. In other words it's hard to find a popular religion whose scripture truly empowers women. So right away, the religious person is in a difficult situation. If they claim their religion is perfect, then that means their religion is probably misogynistic, and right off the bat there is a conflict with modern values.

 

[shunyadragon]

Let me give you a specific example. Many religions are very misogynistic by today's standards. In other words it's hard to find a popular religion whose scripture truly empowers women. So right away, the religious person is in a difficult situation. If they claim their religion is perfect, then that means their religion is probably misogynistic, and right off the bat there is a conflict with modern values.

The Baha'i Faith does not describe a static perfect religion, but a dynamic changing evolving religion that changes and advances over time, and endorses .a diverse society model of multiculturism.

 

[Nakosis]

So long as the Courts determine them not be delusions, society functions in a great way so that the State is harmonised.

Fine by me, but the courts are human beings too. Likely as any one else to be influenced by some delusion.

Is nationalism a delusion? Liberalism, conservatism, what -ism is not delusional in part? Hard to seperate mankind from their delusions. This is why I remain pessimistic.

 

[Nakosis]

The Baha'i Faith does not describe a static perfect religion, but a dynamic changing evolving religion that changes and advances over time, and endorses .a diverse society model of multiculturism.

So the Baha'i faith could become anything? Whatever cultural values society morphs into, the Baha'i faith is right there?

How about if prayer become immoral? Will the Baha'i faith adopt this view and stop prayers?

I suspect not, there is a core set of values I suspect even the Baha'i won't give up.

 

[Shantanu]

What do you consider 'false doctrines'?

How many examples do you wish to have?

 

[Shantanu]

Fine by me, but the courts are human beings too. Likely as any one else to be influenced by some delusion.

Is nationalism a delusion? Liberalism, conservatism, what -ism is not delusional in part? Hard to seperate mankind from their delusions. This is why I remain pessimistic.

The Courts have to do what the enacted statutory law says: the government has to be careful in the enactment of the laws.

 

[QuestioningMind]

What I am proposing is that when there is discord in society caused by religious beliefs, howsoever minor, each person has to justify his or her actions in a court of law and it will not be sufficient for that person to say I am a Christian or a Muslim or a Buddhist or Hindu or whatever that is why I did these things. The judge will have to sentence the person on the basis of what evidence is provided by the adherent to the judge that he or she was justified in carrying out the misdemeanour because it was the true way of handling a particular problem. The judge will take evidence from reputable sources to assess whether what the person did was justified as moral based on all the evidence that the State has at its disposal. The adherent will face punishment if the judgment goes against him or her, so will be forced to modify his or her beliefs. Over time the State's religious authorities will have to take account of the judgment and modify their holy books to ensure that they are giving the State-approved teachings on religious beliefs that are permissible, or the official religions would be banned for not taking account of the State's judgements as given in a Court of law.

I'm confused. If the 'discord' is someone 'carrying out a misdemeanor' that means that they have broken the rules. If they have legitimately broken the rules then a persons' particular religious beliefs aren't a factor as to whether or not they are guilty of breaking the rules. Thus their religion shouldn't even be factor in the decision.

 

[LuisDantas]

Does multiculturalism always lead to falsehoods, lies and deceit and is therefore always harmful?

Why, of course not. How could anyone think such a thing, anyway?

 

[Shantanu]

Let me give you a specific example. Many religions are very misogynistic by today's standards. In other words it's hard to find a popular religion whose scripture truly empowers women. So right away, the religious person is in a difficult situation. If they claim their religion is perfect, then that means their religion is probably misogynistic, and right off the bat there is a conflict with modern values.

By modern values you have to say you mean the present understanding of humanity in terms of the abilities of men and women to carry out different tasks in society: these show that women are just as capable as men to be Prime Ministers of countries while still maintaining a family life so that their traditional roles in delusional faiths have been rejected by progressive forces in society.

 

[Shantanu]

I'm confused. If the 'discord' is someone 'carrying out a misdemeanor' that means that they have broken the rules. If they have legitimately broken the rules then a persons' particular religious beliefs aren't a factor as to whether or not they are guilty of breaking the rules. Thus their religion shouldn't even be factor in the decision.

They can cite mitigating circumstances to the judge such as religious upbringing and beliefs before sentencing is announced, so the punishment is influenced by the upbringing and present beliefs.

 

[QuestioningMind]

This is incorrect. In society each person has responsibility to conduct himself or herself in accordance with the laws and norms of that society. The onus is on the individual who will have to account for his or her beliefs to a court of law when he or she is charged with conducting fraudulent activities such as proselytizing delusional religious scriptures.

What a minute... earlier you were discussing judging people who have committed misdemeanors... now you mention charging people with fraudulent activities such a proselytizing delusional religious beliefs'. So you are suggesting that we criminalize proselytizing delusional religious belief? If so, WHO gets to decide what is fraudulent proselytizing and what is not?

 

[icehorse]

By modern values you have to say you mean the present understanding of humanity in terms of the abilities of men and women to carry out different tasks in society: these show that women are just as capable as men to be Prime Ministers of countries while still maintaining a family life so that their traditional roles in delusional faiths have been rejected by progressive forces in society.

Kind of. But not only women's abilities, but also their desires. By modern standards a woman should be able to pursue whatever life they want to. They can be engineers, or mothers, or both.

 

[Shantanu]

What a minute... earlier you were discussing judging people who have committed misdemeanors... now you mention charging people with fraudulent activities such a proselytizing delusional religious beliefs'. So you are suggesting that we criminalize proselytizing delusional religious belief? If so, WHO gets to decide what is fraudulent proselytizing and what is not?

Parliament (House of Commons) and the Lords (House of Lords) in the United Kingdom for example decide what is fraudulent proselytising and what is not.

 

[LuisDantas]

The Baha'i Faith does not describe a static perfect religion, but a dynamic changing evolving religion that changes and advances over time, and endorses .a diverse society model of multiculturism.

Do you see any significant boundaries within which that change is allowed to occur?

Would there be a point at which the Bahai Faith just would not approve of some specific change to itself? Do you have any specific perceptions of which those would be?

 

[QuestioningMind]

They can cite mitigating circumstances to the judge such as religious upbringing and beliefs before sentencing is announced, so the punishment is influenced by the upbringing and present beliefs.

Did you read what I wrote? I SPECIFICALLY stated that RELIGION SHOULD NOT BE A FACTOR in the suspects guilt or innocence. IF a law was broken the persons' religion doesn't matter.