Did Jesus die and rise from the dead?

[Subduction Zone]

In your dreams.

If and when your sources deny the resurrected Jesus Christ then they are Biblically and spiritually challenged charlatans.

You would have to prove that.claim with reliable sources. Once more I need to remind you that you are far from being a source. Sadly you don't seem to be able to tell the difference between a valid source and the worst of incompetent and idiotic apologists.

 

[Spartan]

So are you a biblical literalist?

That's an overdone expression often used to denigrate traditional Bible believers. As if I believe God is a giant bird with wings in the 91st Psalm.

There's a lot of imagery in the Bible but such imagery should be viewed in context and not used to the extreme.

 

[Spartan]

You would have to prove that.claim with reliable sources. Once more I need to remind you that you are far from being a source. Sadly you don't seem to be able to tell the difference between a valid source and the worst of incompetent and idiotic apologists.

Go tell that to someone who values your unscholarly and unbiblical views.

 

[Spartan]

Spartan: "I value any scholar who has traditional, BIBLICAL beliefs in the historical, risen Jesus Christ and values God's moral laws. Those who teach otherwise are false teachers and are in need of help with their theology."

That describes the refined essence of intellectual dishonesty.

Nonsense.

 

[Audie]

That's an overdone expression often used to denigrate traditional Bible believers. As if I believe God is a giant bird with wings in the 91st Psalm.

There's a lot of imagery in the Bible but such imagery should be viewed in context and not used to the extreme.

Oh, there is no need to denigrate fundies beyond what they
do for themselves.

Would you care to say if genesis is, in your opinion,
imagery or actual history?

 

[Spartan]

Oh, there is no need to denigrate fundies beyond what they
do for themselves.

Would you care to say if genesis is, in your opinion,
imagery or actual history?

Skeptics love to go to Genesis. Well, Jesus talked about Genesis so I value what he said on that.

Focus now on the Resurrection of Jesus Christ. Do you believe he was resurrected?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Go tell that to someone who values your unscholarly and unbiblical views.

You mean you?

You need to remember that just because you think that you are right does not make it a fact. You tend to believe the worst of idiots if they support your mythical beliefs. You won't win any debates with that approach.

Now, would you like to know how we know that a literal interpretation of Genesis is incorrect?

 

[Audie]

Spartan: "I value any scholar who has traditional, BIBLICAL beliefs in the historical, risen Jesus Christ and values God's moral laws. Those who teach otherwise are false teachers and are in need of help with their theology."



Nonsense.

Odd way of quoting you have.
I pointed out that your aporoach is intellectually
dishonest, which it is.

"Nonsense", with no explanation, no thought, no evident
comprehension of what intellectual honesty even is.


A BSc you say you earned? Nice, but you
like so many others may have actually
learned no science, at all.

See, in science objectivity is a highest ideal.
Has to be.
In Christianity, faith is a highest ideal. Behold Job;
hold fast the faith.

Religion is a culture of faith. Doubt is a fault. Behold
Thomas!

Science is a culture of doubt. A scientist must
understand the easiest person to fool is yourself.

To do conclusion before evidence, then consider no
contrary evidence invalid, accepting only those that
confirm-that is what you get from politicians, or from
in-house researchers for a tobacco company.

Your hasty denial ("nonsense!") of any possible error,
your rejection of all dissent, your reliance on only
that which agrees with your predetermined and
immutable conclusion!

What do you think intellectual dishonesty is, if your
behaviour does not exemplify it?

 

[Audie]

Skeptics love to go to Genesis. Well, Jesus talked about Genesis so I value what he said on that.

Focus now on the Resurrection of Jesus Christ. Do you believe he was resurrected?

Of course skeptics like Genesis. It is a target-rich envirnment
with BS in every line! They did not write it and try to fob
it off as "God's Word", and it quickly brings out the
irrational / intellectual dishonesty in those who calim
historical accuracy.

So why do you love to avoid dealing with it?

Evasiveness is not a virtue. Nor is shifting the burden
to others.

Super simple to just say if you think the events of
Genesis are historical. Yes, no?

I expect you are avoiding answering because if you
do say they are historical, the vast body of empirical
data showing they are not will cast an unfavourable
light on your rejection of same while bitterly clinging
to the sketchy anecdotal evidence for a miracle
inwhich you are emotionally invested.
(See "intellectual honesty")

You are of course invited to show me wrong
on my take here. Unlike how you present, I dont
mind being wrong, I value it.

Oh, and lest I be thought to be evasive
for not answering- of course I do not believe it.

(I bet I see your next move coming, and it wont
be to forthrightly meet the challenge to just
state your position on Genesis)

 

[Thief]

Facts not in evidence is stock in trade for theos.

no thanks.....

If He failed to continue.....we are all screwed

if He did continue.....we will all meet Him

 

[Audie]

no thanks.....

If He failed to continue.....we are all screwed

if He did continue.....we will all meet Him

No thanks? Now you are backing off from
making statements with no known factual
basis?

As for the old "better not take chances",
what about me?

I have long hair and refuse to cover it in public!

Lookee what them islamers say is in store for
me for that sin!! (Hang by my hair in eternal fire)

islamic hell - Google Search:

But if I go with islam, what if jesus dont like it?

 

[Thief]

No thanks? Now you are backing off from
making statements with no known factual
basis?

As for the old "better not take chances",
what about me?

I have long hair and refuse to cover it in public!

Lookee what them islamers say is in store for
me for that sin!! (Hang by my hair in eternal fire)

islamic hell - Google Search:

But if I go with islam, what if jesus dont like it?

you cannot circumvent the title question
and the answer weighs to the left or the right

if He continued.....you will meet Him
if He not.....your grave awaits

 

[Audie]

you cannot circumvent the title question
and the answer weighs to the left or the right

if He continued.....you will meet Him
if He not.....your grave awaits

Well i must say pascals wager does nothing
but get better and better with age, like limburger
cheese.

 

[Thief]

Well i must say pascals wager does nothing
but get better and better with age, like limburger
cheese.

if Pascal continued.....you get to meet him too

 

[Spartan]

Of course skeptics like Genesis. It is a target-rich envirnment
with BS in every line! They did not write it and try to fob
it off as "God's Word", and it quickly brings out the
irrational / intellectual dishonesty in those who calim
historical accuracy.

So why do you love to avoid dealing with it?

Evasiveness is not a virtue. Nor is shifting the burden
to others.

Super simple to just say if you think the events of
Genesis are historical. Yes, no?

I expect you are avoiding answering because if you
do say they are historical, the vast body of empirical
data showing they are not will cast an unfavourable
light on your rejection of same while bitterly clinging
to the sketchy anecdotal evidence for a miracle
inwhich you are emotionally invested.
(See "intellectual honesty")

You are of course invited to show me wrong
on my take here. Unlike how you present, I dont
mind being wrong, I value it.

Oh, and lest I be thought to be evasive
for not answering- of course I do not believe it.

(I bet I see your next move coming, and it wont
be to forthrightly meet the challenge to just
state your position on Genesis)

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth - Genesis 1

That I firmly believe. So do many scientists. Like former NASA scientist Robert Jastrow ("God and the Astronomers“) wrote,

"For the scientist who has lived by his faith in the power of reason, the story ends like a bad dream. He has scaled the mountains of ignorance, he is about to conquer the highest peak; as he pulls himself over the final rock, he is greeted by a band of theologians who have been sitting there for centuries.”

Now, you want to talk Genesis? This is not the thread for it. This thread is titled, "Did Jesus die and rise from the dead?" Start your own thread on Genesis so you don't derail this one.

And you deny the resurrection of Jesus in spite of the multiple, independent, historical confirmations from the Gospels, etc., that he did. And that's fine - that's your belief. But I'd like to remind you that your belief is not based in science. Science has never proven that God and the supernatural do not and cannot exist.

Jesus is Lord!

 

[Spartan]

Odd way of quoting you have.
I pointed out that your aporoach is intellectually
dishonest, which it is.

"Nonsense", with no explanation, no thought, no evident
comprehension of what intellectual honesty even is.

A BSc you say you earned? Nice, but you
like so many others may have actually
learned no science, at all.

See, in science objectivity is a highest ideal.
Has to be.
In Christianity, faith is a highest ideal. Behold Job;
hold fast the faith.

Religion is a culture of faith. Doubt is a fault. Behold
Thomas!

Science is a culture of doubt. A scientist must
understand the easiest person to fool is yourself.

To do conclusion before evidence, then consider no
contrary evidence invalid, accepting only those that
confirm-that is what you get from politicians, or from
in-house researchers for a tobacco company.

Your hasty denial ("nonsense!") of any possible error,
your rejection of all dissent, your reliance on only
that which agrees with your predetermined and
immutable conclusion!

What do you think intellectual dishonesty is, if your
behaviour does not exemplify it?

Yeah, that post was nonsense and so is your rant above. You don't have a degree in science, do you? And you're going to tell me I have learned no science at all? According to the University system of the State of Georgia I know it quite well, having a 3.96 GPA in it my last two years.

I don't have to believe Genesis word-for-word to be a Christian who believes in the resurrection of the divine Jesus Christ, but the alternative for you is to wolf down the mathematically improbable miracle of abiogenesis, which science has never been able to document. You can't even tell me what came first in the first living cell - the cell walls or the protoplasm inside. Sir Fred Hoyle, the celebrated English physicist and cosmologist, thought that the sudden appearance of life on earth was all but impossible, from a statistical standpoint. In his 1981 book Evolution from Space (with Chandra Wickramasinghe), Hoyle calculated that the chance of obtaining the required set of enzymes for even the simplest living cell was one in 10 to the 40,000th power (one followed by 40,000 zeroes). But that's the miracle you have to wolf down for your world view to be viable. And that requires a much greater faith than a religious creationist could possibly muster.

OH YE OF GREAT FAITH!!

 

[Audie]

Yeah, that post was nonsense and so is your rant above. You don't have a degree in science, do you? And you're going to tell me I have learned no science at all? According to the University system of the State of Georgia I know it quite well, having a 3.96 GPA in it my two years.

I don't have to believe Genesis word-for-word to be a Christian who believes in the resurrection of the divine Jesus Christ, but the alternative for you is to wolf down the mathematically improbable miracle of abiogenesis, which science has never been able to document. You can't even tell me what came first in the first living cell - the cell walls or the protoplasm inside. Sir Fred Hoyle, the celebrated English physicist and cosmologist, thought that the sudden appearance of life on earth was all but impossible, from a statistical standpoint. In his 1981 book Evolution from Space (with Chandra Wickramasinghe), Hoyle calculated that the chance of obtaining the required set of enzymes for even the simplest living cell was one in 10 to the 40,000th power (one followed by 40,000 zeroes). But that's the miracle you have to wolf down for your world view to be viable. And that requires a much greater faith than a religious creationist could possibly believe.

OH YE OF GREAT FAITH!!

Goodness.
Sure riled you up.

Anyway, no further emotive display
of bold font, creo-pratts etc is called
for, you've more than demonstrated exactly
what I said

And it is such an unseemly display.
Spare us a repeat.

 

[Audie]

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth - Genesis 1

That I firmly believe. So do many scientists. Like former NASA scientist Robert Jastrow ("God and the Astronomers“) wrote,

"For the scientist who has lived by his faith in the power of reason, the story ends like a bad dream. He has scaled the mountains of ignorance, he is about to conquer the highest peak; as he pulls himself over the final rock, he is greeted by a band of theologians who have been sitting there for centuries.”

Now, you want to talk Genesis? This is not the thread for it. This thread is titled, "Did Jesus die and rise from the dead?" Start your own thread on Genesis so you don't derail this one.

And you deny the resurrection of Jesus in spite of the multiple, independent, historical confirmations from the Gospels, etc., that he did. And that's fine - that's your belief. But I'd like to remind you that your belief is not based in science. Science has never proven that God and the supernatural do not and cannot exist.

Jesus is Lord!

Oh well, I cant resist. You really got me with
that knock down killer argument, even if not
underlined.

And it made me so aware of bow puny science
is, for lo! Science has not and cannot prove that
Batboy does not have a secret underground
laboratory on the moon!

 

[Spartan]

Oh well, I cant resist. You really got me with
that knock down killer argument, even if not
underlined.

And it made me so aware of bow puny science
is, for lo! Science has not and cannot prove that
Batboy does not have a secret underground
laboratory on the moon!

Here's some recommended reading for you so you can enlarge your knowledge base and won't feel neglected:

 

[Subduction Zone]

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth - Genesis 1

That I firmly believe. So do many scientists. Like former NASA scientist Robert Jastrow ("God and the Astronomers“) wrote,

"For the scientist who has lived by his faith in the power of reason, the story ends like a bad dream. He has scaled the mountains of ignorance, he is about to conquer the highest peak; as he pulls himself over the final rock, he is greeted by a band of theologians who have been sitting there for centuries.”

Now, you want to talk Genesis? This is not the thread for it. This thread is titled, "Did Jesus die and rise from the dead?" Start your own thread on Genesis so you don't derail this one.

And you deny the resurrection of Jesus in spite of the multiple, independent, historical confirmations from the Gospels, etc., that he did. And that's fine - that's your belief. But I'd like to remind you that your belief is not based in science. Science has never proven that God and the supernatural do not and cannot exist.

Jesus is Lord!

Jastrow agrees far more with us than he does with you. He knows that Genesis is myth. So do we. Why do you try to use him as a source? He also does not believe in your mythical Jesus. That makes him even more on our side than yours. You should look into what the people you refer to actually believe.

Robert Jastrow - Wikipedia

"His expressed views on creation were that although he was an "agnostic, and not a believer",[1] it seems to him that "the curtain drawn over the mystery of creation will never be raised by human efforts, at least in the foreseeable future"[1] due to "the circumstances of the big bang-the fiery holocaust that destroyed the record of the past".[1] With the discovery of the Big Bang, Jastrow began to hold a belief that, if there was a beginning to the universe, there was also a Creator."

He is all but an atheist. He is most definitely not a Christian. He only believes in a god because he does not know how the universe began.