That's what I thought. NONE of the mainline churches taught rapture until the late 1970s. No one taught that all Jews had to return to Palestine to bring on the second coming either.
Not in my neck of the woods, for sure.
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That's what I thought. NONE of the mainline churches taught rapture until the late 1970s. No one taught that all Jews had to return to Palestine to bring on the second coming either.
That's what I thought. NONE of the mainline churches taught rapture until the late 1970s. No one taught that all Jews had to return to Palestine to bring on the second coming either.
Having said that, I recall - unless it's a false memory - some folk saying that the State of Israel was itself the Messiah, and that in restoring Palestine to the Jews it had brought about - or was bringing about - the fulfilment of biblical promises. There was a Pentecostal meeting place near my home. I might have heard such talk from these folk. Might be getting my wires crossed, though!
That sounds about right.....
What.......getting my wires crossed?
I just study the Bible seriously. Nicene creed covers it. The Bible is very flawed.. full of contradictions, anachronisms and errors of geography. The writers were focused on telling a compelling morality tale and NOT on history. The Book of Daniel had many authors and none of them are "Daniel". Daniel is a literary device.
The book of Daniel is replete with historical inaccuracies regarding the Babylonian and Persian periods, indicating it was written quite some time after those eras.
Between this point, and the independent nature of the court tales, the person of 'Daniel' appears to be a literary fabrication, not a historical figure (and hence, not the author of the book).
Davies suggests this 'Daniel' character may not have been a well-known figure in Jewish culture before the book was completed,4 and Collins is one scholar to suggest the very name 'Daniel' was chosen for the anonymous Jewish sage of the folklore out of inspiration from the ancient sage 'Danel', mentioned by Ezekiel and Ugaritic texts.5
The apocalyptic visions offer more details to us as to who the author(s) might have been.
Chapters 7-12 are almost exclusively focused on Antiochus Epiphanes and the ensuing Maccabean Revolt.
(See my answers to two other questions here and here for a fuller exposition on these details.)
The concern here is the resolution of the Revolt, the cleansing of the temple in Jerusalem, and the reinstitution of the sacrifices, offerings, and Torah observance.
Critical scholars have long noticed that the apocalyptic section's grasp on history during the Maccabean Revolt appears to suddenly disappear a year or two before its conclusion.
Some scholars also go a little further than simply identifying the time period of the author, by also trying to deduce his specific theological or ethical identity. Hill notes:6
Who wrote the Book of Daniel
Pentecostals would have been in the fringe group that adopted the Scofield heresy.
The Bible displays the character of man and certain events that lead us to the final days ...
all seem to be on the table at this time ... keepn watch and anticipating ultimate glory <><
Are you familiar with fulfilment of prophecies symbolically?Which also makes them failed prophecies.
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I wouldn't say any event can be reinterpreted as fulfilling a prophecy.Any event can be reinterpreted as fulfilling a prophecy.
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I suppose you mean, if a prophecy can always be reinterpreted in a way to match with anything, it proves nothing. Agree. But the prophecies of Bible cannot be match with just anything, other than its true fulfilment. What if there is a great number of prophecies which all of them consistently match with the set of events related to the subject of prophecy?If a prophecy will be fulfilled no matter what it is of no value.
Are you familiar with fulfilment of prophecies symbolically?
The best example in Bible IMO are given. For example, the man who had a dream of seven fat cows eaten by seven thin cows. When it was fulfilled, it happened as seven years of prosperity followed by seven years of poverty.
So, the symbols have very specific meanings! Not just any meaning. In this example seven fat cows are symbols of seven years of prosperity.
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I don't see how any invent can be reinterpreted as fulfilling a prophecy.
Tell me how else the seven cows can be reinterpreted to be considered fulfilled other than 7 years..
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I suppose you mean, if a prophecy can always be reinterpreted in a way to match with anything, it proves nothing. What if there is a great number of prophecies which all of them consistently match with the set of events related to the subject of prophecy?
Yes. Because I believe Scriptures are divinely inspired.Do you think about the dream that story is real?
This is just merely an opinion. Since they cannot believe Scriptures are divinely inspired, and cannot believe prophecies are actually fulfilled, they say, the prophecy then must have been written after the event!Most prophecy is written Vaticinium ex eventu… its hindsite bias. That's why scripture was constantly redacted and amended.
Yes. Because I believe Scriptures are divinely inspired.
This is just merely an opinion. Since they cannot believe Scriptures are divinely inspired, and cannot believe prophecies are actually fulfilled, they say, the prophecy then must have been written after the event!
Are you familiar with fulfilment of prophecies symbolically?
The best example in Bible IMO are given. For example, the man who had a dream of seven fat cows eaten by seven thin cows. When it was fulfilled, it happened as seven years of prosperity followed by seven years of poverty.
So, the symbols have very specific meanings! Not just any meaning. In this example seven fat cows are symbols of seven years of prosperity.
.
I wouldn't say any event can be reinterpreted as fulfilling a prophecy.
Tell me how else the seven cows can be reinterpreted to be considered fulfilled other than 7 years..
.
I suppose you mean, if a prophecy can always be reinterpreted in a way to match with anything, it proves nothing. Agree. But the prophecies of Bible cannot be match with just anything, other than its true fulfilment. What if there is a great number of prophecies which all of them consistently match with the set of events related to the subject of prophecy?
No.. The tribulation was over in 70 AD with the destruction of the Temple.. That world ended.. and a new age began
Yeah, well, we'll have to agree to dis-agree on that one ...
Satan and his minions don't look to bound to me ...
and try throwing a lamb in w/ a lion, let me know what happens .... later <3
Zechariah ( 520-470 BC ) says the following in this regards:
"I ( God ) am going to make Jerusalem a cup that sends all the surrounding peoples REELING.
Judah will be besieged as well as Jerusalem. On that day, when all the nations of the earth are gathered against her,
I (God) will make Jerusalem an immovable rock for all the nations. All who try to move it will injure themselves"
. . . Zechariah 12 < I think this is happening as we speak
Not the whole earth.. just around their land.
Which part of - when all the nations of the earth - do you not understand ??