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Discussing Genesis 1&2 - The Beginning

The Anointed

Well-Known Member
Continued from post #87.

The ancients believed in a series of worlds following one upon the other-- each world rising a step higher than the previous world, so that every later world brings to ripeness the seeds that were imbedded in the former, and itself then prepares the seed for the universe that will follow it.

The second DAY [Period of universal activity] begins by bringing to ripeness the seeds that were imbedded in the former, and itself then prepares the seed for the universe that will follow it.

This is one scientific theory as to the creation of our solar system some 9 billion years after the creation of those first massive stars that lit up the darkness of the expanding space. Whether or not a better theory than that which we have today will develop, time will tell.

This theory would appear to support the biblical statement, that the process of the division of the waters above from the waters below, [See Genesis 1: 6; KJV] or the division of the solar nebula cloud from the greater Galactic nebula cloud, began some five billion years ago, and that the whole process began with the division of the waters (cloud) above, from the waters (Cloud) below from which the entire Solar system was created. This took just a few hundred million years, about 400 million years in fact, and the creation of our entire solar system was completed by about 4.6 billion years ago.

It was from the galactic nebular cloud, which was the residue of the heaver elements that were exploded off with the great super nova, which was the death of one of those gigantic earlier generation Stars that our Milky-Way galaxy would be formed in the second creative period=day, as the active universal forces brought about a division of the Solar nebular cloud [The Waters Below] from the Galactic nebular cloud [The Waters Above].

The accretion of the galactic nebula disk, which was being attracted to the central Black Hole around which it had begun to orbit, transferred angular momentum outward as it transferred mass inward, it was this that caused our solar nebula to begin to rotate and condense inward, bringing a division of the solar cloud, from the galactic cloud, or the waters above from the waters below.

Within the greater galactic nebular cloud, which was slowly beginning to revolve around the Black Hole that anchored it in space, a piece of the larger cloud complex started to collapse about five billion years ago. The cloud complex had already been "polluted" with dust grains from previous generations of stars, so it was possible to form the rocky terrestrial planets as gravity pulled the gas and dust together, forming a solar nebula. As the cloud=waters of the solar nebula collapsed, its slight rotation increased. This is because of the conservation of angular momentum.

Just like a dancer who spins faster as she pulls in her arms, the cloud began to spin as it collapsed. Eventually, the cloud grew hotter and denser in the centre, with a disk of gas and dust surrounding it that was hot in the centre but cool at the edges. As the disk got thinner and thinner, particles began to stick together and form clumps. Some clumps got bigger, as particles and small clumps stuck to them, eventually forming planets or moons. Genesis 1: 6—9. As the heavenly cloud was gathered together in one place, dry land, or rather planets began to form. Near the centre of the condensing cloud, where planets like earth formed, only rocky material could stand the great heat. Icy matter settled in the outer regions of the disk along with rocky material, where the giant planets like Jupiter formed.

As the cloud continued to fall in, the centre would get so hot that it would eventually become a star and with a strong stellar wind, would blow away most of the gas and dust from which the planets of the solar system had been formed.

By studying meteorites, which are thought to be left over from this early phase of the solar system, scientists have found that the solar system is about 4.6 billion years old! As the solar nebula collapsed, the gas and dust heated up through collisions among the particles. The solar nebula heated up to around 3000 K so everything was in a gaseous form. The solar nebula's composition was similar to the present-day Sun's composition: about 93% hydrogen, 6% helium, and about 1% silicates and iron, and the density of the gas and dust increased toward the core where the proto-sun was: [PROTO SUN.]. The inner, denser regions collapsed more quickly than the outer regions.

Around Jupiter's distance from the proto-Sun the temperature was cool enough to freeze water (the so-called "snow line" or "frost line"). Further out from the proto-Sun, ammonia and methane were able to condense. There was a significant amount of water closer to the Proto-sun, but could not condense. When the solar nebula stopped collapsing it began cooling, though the core that would later form the Sun remained hot.

This meant that the outer parts of the solar nebula cooled off more than the inner parts closer to the hot proto-Sun. Only metal and rock materials could condense (solidify) at the high temperatures close to the proto-Sun. Therefore, the metal and rock materials could condense in all the places where the planets were forming. Volatile materials (like water, methane and ammonia) could only condense in the outer parts of the solar nebula.

Because the density of the solar nebula material increased inward, there was more water at Jupiter's distance than at the distances of Saturn, Uranus, or Neptune. The greater amount of water ice at Jupiter's distance from the proto-Sun helped it grow larger than the other planets. Although, there was more water closer to the proto-Sun than Jupiter, that water was too warm to condense. Material with the highest freezing temperatures condensed to form the chondrules that were then incorporated in lower freezing temperature material. Chondrules (from Ancient Greek chondros, meaning grain) are round grains found in chondrites. Chondrules form as molten or partially molten droplets in space before being accreted to their parent asteroids.

Any material that later became part of a planet underwent further heating and processing when the planet differentiated so the heavy metals sunk to the planet's core and lighter metals floated up to nearer the surface.

Because of its great compression, the core of the proto-Sun finally reached about 10 million Kelvin and after the planets of the solar system had been created, the hydrogen nuclei started fusing together to produce helium nuclei and a lot of energy. It was then that the proto-Sun "TURNED ON" and became our Sun, which produced the strong winds called T-Tauri winds named after the prototype star in the constellation Taurus.

These winds swept out the rest of the nebula that was not already incorporated into the planets. With most of the cocoon gas blown away, the new star itself becomes visible to the outside for the first time. This whole process took just a few hundred million years and was finished by about 4.6 billion years ago. At the distance of about one light year from the earth, is the great icy Dome, that is the boundary of the firmament of our heavens, in which the sun, moon, and planets of our solar system were created.

According to the Genesis narrative, it is on the second day that the Lord calls for a "firmament" to be in the "midst of the waters" to divide the waters:

"And God said, let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under (or within) the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so. And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day." (Genesis 1:6-8 KJV)

The term "firmament" according to the Creation account, is taken from the Hebrew: רָקִיעַ raqiya` raw-kee'-ah, which is defined by many scholars as an expanse, or the visible arch of the sky:—firmament, but a primitive root; “רָקַע raqa` raw-kah” means, to pound, hammer, to overlay (with thin sheets of metal):—beat, make broad, spread abroad (forth, over, out, into plates), stamp, stretch.

The creation of the firmament is associated with the placement of some sort of structure, and in some modern Bibles many modern scholars translate the Hebrew word raqia as a "dome" or "vault". The Hebrew language appears to imply that the firmament is a firm, fixed structure (FIRMament, which can now be seen as the spherical cloud of comets (Icy vault) in which our solar system was created from the solar nebula cloud that was divided from the greater galactic nebula cloud.

"And God said, “Let there be lights within the firmament or vault to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so. And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also."

(Genesis 1:14-16 KJV) This verse says that the Sun, Moon, and Stars=planets of our solar system, are "within" the firmament. Therefore, the waters that are "above the firmament=dome/vault" must be above the Sun, Moon and Stars=planets of our solar system, revealing that the waters which are referred to in Psalms 148:4; "Praise him, ye heavens of heavens, and ye waters that [be] above the heavens," belong to the greater galactic nebula cloud which has become our Milky Way Galaxy.

The Oort cloud, or the Opik-Oort cloud, which is named after Jan Oort, is a spherical cloud that surrounds our solar system, a cloud of predominantly icy objects such as comets that are comprised of mainly hydrogen, oxygen=water, ammonia and methane, and extends up to about a light year from the sun and defines the cosmographical boundary of our Solar System and the region of the suns gravitational dominance. Here is the Firmament, the great spherical vault within which is found the sun, moons and planets of our solar system, the dome of ice above us.

Knowing that the planets of our solar system were already created before the sun came into existence when the hydrogen nuclei within the condensing solar cloud started fusing together to produce helium nuclei and a lot of energy thereby creating our sun, we must now ask the question, “Did life on earth begin to evolve before the creation of the sun?” As is recorded in the Bible. And can life exist without sunlight? Proof of this is to be found in the darkest depths of our oceans, where life has evolved over six miles beneath the surface where sunlight does not and cannot penetrate. This subject will be discussed at a later stage.
 

sooda

Veteran Member
The Big Bang as it is called, was the beginning of time and space in this period of universal activity.

The biblical account of creation, as recorded by the chosen earthly scribes who were under the control of the ever-evolving spirit in man, [THE SON OF MAN] was recorded in such a way that it was acceptable to all the ages of man, and is capable of adapting with the changing=evolving concepts of man according to the ever-growing accumulation of incoming data.

For the Word of God can be likened to a star that’s being ever brightened
By the mind of man reaching ever higher, but those who deviate they’re liars
In God’s words man’s mind can grow, but those outside are like the snow
That settles on the desert sand and will melt away before “I AM.” …..The Anointed.

This is the condensed account of creation as recorded in Genesis’.....…”In the beginning God created the universe, and the (heavens, and the earth) were formless and void and darkness was upon the face of the deep and God’s active force was moving on the face of the waters. Then God said let there be light.”

Here is the scientific theory of creation........In the beginning, there was the “BIG BANG” which is said to have spatially separated the supposed infinitely dense, infinitely hot, infinitesimally small singularity, which in my opinion was the White Hole at the end of the Great Abyss or Black Hole, into which the previous universe had descended, this event spewed out a liquid like plasma soup of electromagnetic energy in the trillions and trillions of degrees.

It was from the quantum of that plasma liquid-like electromagnetic energy that the earth and all the heavenly bodies would be created, and although, all that the earth was created from, was already there in the beginning, the earth at that time had neither shape or mass, which meant it was formless and void, and no suns had yet come into existence to light up the darkness of the expanding space. But there was momentum within that ever-cooling cosmic cloud of wave particles, which wave particles are the quantum of that liquid like electromagnetic energy, and are not really particles at all as they have zero mass and no electric charge, yet they carry angular and linear momentum.

One would expect, that those wave particles which are the quantum of the liquid like electromagnetic energy, would have continued to expand further and further away from each other in the expansion of the universal building material.

But with the angular momentum of those waves, they collided with each other in nuclear fusion in the creation of the first basic sub-atomic particles. As the universal temperature dropped to some billions of degrees, the dark energy which was the expansion’s acceleration force, began to form into dark matter, hydrogen and helium, with trace quantities of lithium, beryllium, and boron.

As the universe expanded and cooled, more hydrogen molecules were formed, and from these, after some thirty million years of attraction, came the formation of the first gigantic stars, [Massive atomic reactors} from which the galaxies would later be created.

And God said, “Let there be light.” Which was not the light from the sun of this minor solar system within our Milky Way galaxy, which solar system would not be created for some nine billion years after those first-generation massive stars that lit up the darkness of the bottomless pit.

Bursting into life and light throughout the primitive universe over an unknown period of time, those first generation stars would have been thousands upon thousands of times as massive as our Sun and millions of times as bright, but each one burned for only a few million years before meeting a violent end, when they exploded out in a brilliant flash before collapsing in upon themselves creating the massive centrally condensed systems called ‘Black Holes,’ in which the greater percentage of their mass was trapped.

The first creative day ended as all those gigantic stars collapsed Those first gigantic stars, from which the galaxies would later be created and which would have been collapsing in upon themselves, and evening descended as the lights of the universe went out, and the black holes devoured each other, and darkness covered the contracting space.

Although the ancients knew that there have been many universes before this one, science is just beginning to realise this fact.

Another universe may have preceded ours, study finds. May 14th, 2006. Courtesy Penn State University and World Science staff.

Three physicists say they have done calculations suggesting that before the birth of our universe, which is expanding, there was an earlier universe that was shrinking. To arrive at their pre-existing universe finding, Ashtekar’s group used loop quantum gravity, a theory that seeks to reconcile General relativity with quantum physics. ETC, ETC.

Do you have a source link for this? I have seen it on several websites.
 

The Anointed

Well-Known Member
Do you have a source link for this? I have seen it on several websites.

I have posted the same on different forums that I have visited. The post concerning the Big Bang comes from an excerpt out of my Book, which was inspired by a TV program which I think was called the 'Awesome Universe.'

The creation of our solar system is one of many theories, which I have added to my book, but the one that I see as being the closest to the truth as revealed in scripture.

Theories on the creation of our solar system and Cosmological theories are formulated by scientists, and theories by definition, are the unproven hypothesis, suppositions, and opinions of those scientists.

There are as many, if not more scientific theories as to the origin of our universe, as there are differing religious bodies, such as Christianity, Hindu, Abrahamic, Muslim, Buddhism, etc.

Here is but one of many theories as to the creation of our three-dimensional universe. This one is by Niayesh Afshordi, an astrophysicist with Perimeter Institute for Theoretical Physics in Canada, who proposes that our three-dimensional universe floats as a membrane in a “bulk universe” that has four dimensions and that the “Bulk Universe” has four dimensional stars, which go through the same life cycles as our three-dimensional stars.

The most massive ones explode as supernovae, and their central core collapses into a black hole, like in our universe---only in four-dimension. The four-dimensional black hole has its own four dimensional “Event Horizon,” the boundary between the inside and the outside of a black hole.

In a three-dimensional universe, the event horizon appears to be two dimensional. In a four-dimensional universe, it appears to be three dimensional. The four-dimensional black hole, then blows apart, with the leftover material forming a three-dimensional membrane surrounding a three dimensional event horizon, which expands---and is essentially our universe.

So, according to the theory proposed by Niayesh Afshordi, our universe is the vomited-up guts of a fourth dimensional black hole. The expansion of the event horizon explains our universe's expansion; the fact that its creation stems from another 4D universe explains the weird temperature uniformity.

But it is up to the individual, which theory they choose to accept.
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
Correct, Adam' God is no other than YHWH himself, the Son of Almighty God Father - who is an invisible Spirit that no man hath seen at anytime... NOR His name has been revealed to anyone at this time...,

I find at Genesis 22:14 that Abraham knew and used God's name, on the other hand, God's Son's name on Earth was Not given until angel Gabriel revealed it.
So, at Exodus 3:15 God's name (Tetragrammaton) would take on revealed additional meaning, Not just the name itself.
Thus, at the time of Moses, God's name would become knownor revealed to them in a way that was Not known to their forefathers Abraham, Isaac and Jacob - Exodus 6:3.
So, Pharaoh knew the name in the sense of the Tetragrammaton, but he did Not know Moses' God as in meaning a 'God of Action'. That is why Pharaoh did Not acknowledge YHWH as a force to be reckoned with.

Yes, as John 1:17-18 says that No man has seen God at any time. People saw Jesus.
1 John 4:12 repeats that No mas has seen God at any time which is in harmony with John 6:46.
John 6:46 says No man has seen the Father.... (People saw Jesus ) No man can see God and live - Exodus 33:20.
God sent the pre-human heavenly Jesus to Earth, and Jesus says he came down to do 'Not his will' but to do the will of his Father according to John 6:38-40.
Also, at John 5:30 there are two (2) 'wills' mentioned:
Jesus came to seek Not his will, but the will of the Father who sent Jesus. Jesus did Not send himself.
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
But no one seems to know quite how that was done. How is energy created from literally nothing?

I find to say 'energy is created from nothing' is wrong because Isaiah 40:26 informs us that God used His mighty "Power and Strength" to create the material visible realm of existence - Psalms 104:30.
Thus, God used His "Might" His abundant "Power" (dynamic energy) to make the Earth as per Jeremiah 10:12; Jeremiah 32:17.
 

blü 2

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I find to say 'energy is created from nothing' is wrong because Isaiah 40:26 informs us that God used His mighty "Power and Strength" to create the material visible realm of existence - Psalms 104:30.
Thus, God used His "Might" His abundant "Power" (dynamic energy) to make the Earth as per Jeremiah 10:12; Jeremiah 32:17.
Then if we could agree that God is energy (albeit energy is not sentient) we could agree on quite a lot.
 

Seve

Member
Seve said:
NO PLANET EXISTED ON GENESIS 1:1 - INCLUDING THE MATHEMATICAL RELATIVITY OF OUR "SPACETIME" on the 1st & 2nd Day of Genesis. The BB happened on the 3rd Day of Genesis.

Adam's Earth was made on the THIRD Day. Gen 1:10, Trying to force the words to mean that God made the first Earth in Gen 1:1 is refuted by Gen 1:10 and Gen 2:4 which BOTH show the formation of the first Earth on the THIRD Day.

What existed was earth/ground without form and void (dust), which was used to make Adam's firmament on the 2nd Day Gen 1:6-8 and Adam's Earth on the 3rd Day.
\
I find Genesis 2:4 sums up all of the 6 creative days as a ' day ' or period of time.
Kind of like we might speak of Grandfather's day and know that is Not a 24-hr. day.
Please notice there is a difference between the words: create, formed and made.
For example: God 'made' the 'already created' sun and moon do something.
Kind of like parents pro-create a child, and then they can 'make' the child be 'made' to sit in a chair.
At Genesis 1:16 God 'made' the existing sun and moon rule the day, rule the night. Made a job for them to do.
So, the created Earth of Genesis 1:1 was existing, and on the 3rd day God made the firmament do something.
As I have posted before...

Genesis 1:1 Is just a Preface or Introduction - The Story of the Beginning of the Physical World
Genesis 1:2 Tells us the condition of the deep - empty / void - before the making of the physical world.
Genesis 1:3 The bringing forth of the LIGHT before anything is made that was made.... before the world was.
Genesis 1:4 The division of light from darkness - the first work of old.
Genesis 1:5 The evening and the morning the first day of creation.

Jesus was before all things as the following verses below confirms. These verses are speaking of Jesus

Jesus IS the Light that was brought forth into this physical world in the Beginning of creation - when God spoke His 1st Word in the Scripture and said.... LET THERE BE LIGHT; and there was light. Gen 1:3

Col 1:16 For by Him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by Him, and for Him: Col 1:17 And He is before all things, and by Him all things consist.

Therefore, without the Son, was not anything made that was made - like a potter would mold a clay - including the forming/making of our earth.


Jnh 1:3 All things were MADE by him; and without him was NOT any thing MADE that was MADE.

Is your idea of the Son is different than this? Unless Jesus is FIRST in your view, it doesn't fit the above description… so the notions that our earth already existed and formed on Gen 1:1 - BEFORE the bringing forth of the Son into our physical world Gen 1:3- is refuted by the Scriptural texts above.
 
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Seve

Member
I find at Genesis 22:14 that Abraham knew and used God's name, on the other hand, God's Son's name on Earth was Not given until angel Gabriel revealed it.
So, at Exodus 3:15 God's name (Tetragrammaton) would take on revealed additional meaning, Not just the name itself.
Thus, at the time of Moses, God's name would become knownor revealed to them in a way that was Not known to their forefathers Abraham, Isaac and Jacob - Exodus 6:3.
So, Pharaoh knew the name in the sense of the Tetragrammaton, but he did Not know Moses' God as in meaning a 'God of Action'. That is why Pharaoh did Not acknowledge YHWH as a force to be reckoned with.

Yes, as John 1:17-18 says that No man has seen God at any time. People saw Jesus.
1 John 4:12 repeats that No mas has seen God at any time which is in harmony with John 6:46.
John 6:46 says No man has seen the Father.... (People saw Jesus ) No man can see God and live - Exodus 33:20.
God sent the pre-human heavenly Jesus to Earth, and Jesus says he came down to do 'Not his will' but to do the will of his Father according to John 6:38-40.
Also, at John 5:30 there are two (2) 'wills' mentioned:
Jesus came to seek Not his will, but the will of the Father who sent Jesus. Jesus did Not send himself.

So, are you saying that our Lord YHWH is the Christ himself - the Son of the invisible God - whose name is NOT yet revealed to any man at this time? Just clarifying your Biblical Stand..
 
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metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Dear shunyadragon,

Scripture says that those who have not been born again have eyes which CANNOT see, and ears which CANNOT hear. Tell us of your mysterious ability to see into the mind of another.
It is this kind if condescending judgmentalism that undermines your posts and will continue to do so if you keep it up.
 

Seve

Member
It is this kind if condescending judgmentalism that undermines your posts and will continue to do so if you keep it up.

Your unwanted bias opinion and false accusations about me are surpassed only by your ability to ambush someone you know nothing about.

Do you have anything to say about the subject topic or do you just wish to post ad hominems?

Have a good day.
 

Seve

Member
Humans could NOT have evolved from a common ancestor of Apes because there were NO humans on this Planet until some 11k years ago, when Noah arrived form another world, as I have illustrated in my previous posts.. The reason we have the ERVs of the common ancestor of the sons of God (Prehistoric people) and Apes is because we inherited them from the people Noah's grandsons married to, since, there were NO other Humans for them to marry.

Inside every Human today is the DNA and ERVS of the common ancestor of the sons of God or prehistoric people but this does NOT show that Humans evolved from the same common ancestor. Adam was made on the SAME Day as the Big Bang and was with Jesus on another world .... which was at least 9 Billion years BEFORE our Solar System was complete. Genesis 2:4-7 And that's God's Truth not mine.

Genesis 1:1 begins by telling us the 3 elements created before the first Day. It was air, dust, and water. Jesus took some of the air, dust, and water, and changed it into energy by causing a Singularity. Exactly as Jesus knew it would, matter inflated from the Black hole made by the first of the first Huge Stars to implode and become a Singularity which produced other Universes.

Can you tell us HOW ancient man Moses knew this? It's proof of God, for ONLY God could know this scientific Truth thousands of years ago, and leave the story in His Holy Word for a man to read and understand. The story has been there for thousands of years but we are just now beginning to understand that it was written by the Supreme intelligence of creation. His name is YHWH or Jesus, the Son of the invisible God.

Millions of years later, the Universe had cooled enough to become visible. Genesis 2:4 gives us the Day this Big Bang happened. It was the 3rd Day the SAME Day the first Earth was made, which was the 3rd Day according to Genesis 1:9-10. God also got the FACT that Stars didn't shine until the 4th Day, which was millions of years AFTER the Big Bang. This is a recent scientific discovery. There is NO way any ancient man Moses could have possibly known this.

Again, it's proof of our awesome God.
 
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The Anointed

Well-Known Member
Good heavens, where did you come from? Some Universe far, far away, and when your body was converted into its quantum of wave particles to allow you to cross over through the connecting worm hole, I think that there was a mix up in the reconstruction of that body and your mouth was replaced by another orifice of that body.

I have never heard such rubbish in all my life.
 

Seve

Member
As I have posted before:

Quote : >>>>I
n order to understand the Noah's Great Flood, one must understand the following:

Adam's world was FLAT and much smaller than our present world. It's highest point is only about 22 1/2 feet above sea level, Gen 7:20 while our earth’ highest elevation is some 29k ft. above sea level in comparison. Their entire Earth had only 4 Rivers while the present World has thousands of Rivers all over the face of the earth, indicating it was much much smaller than our Earth.

Adam’s firmament of heaven or world was placed in the vicinity beneath the body of waters in Lake Van, Turkey. It was in a completely enclosed Biosphere - protecting Adam's world from waters below and above it - like an incubator of Humanity.

Here are some model images of Ancient Hebrew Perspective of Flat Earth - simili- for reference only - Adam's firmament of heaven with their own sun and moon - surrounded by waters below and above it - see link below....

Ancient Hebrew Cosmology

Adam’s world was contained beneath the surface of Lake Van, Turkey were it was placed in the beginning during the making and incorporating of our worlds.

During the great flood, Noah’ Ark was above the highest mountains of Adam's world (22 1/2 ft.). The firmament, in which Adam's Earth was contained -- end up floating in Lake Van, Turkey, the largest Lake in Turkey. It's in the mountains of Ararat and is some 75 miles wide.

We know this because In the New Testament, we were told that their heaven and earth.... “ Whereby that the world THEN WAS -- standing out of the water and in the water -- being overflowed with water, perished” (Greek- totally destroyed) 2Pet 3:5-6

The Ark which was covered, floated out the top of Adam's firmament into the largest Lake in the area... when the windows of their heaven opened and the flood gates of waters rushes in the firmament,.... as the firmament sank and released the Ark into our world , thus, Adam’s world was totally destroyed / dissolved in their own Global Flood.

If it sounds like Atlantis, so be it.


This explains a way for a 450 foot Ark to be above the highest mountains of Adam's world (22 1/2 ft) ref. Gen 7:20 ...AND....in the mountains of Ararat on the SAME 150th day after the flood began (Gen 8:4). <<<<<< End of Quote

***************************************************************************************************
Dear Readers,

See, Noah's Ark did NOT need a Space Ship to land into our present world, since, it did not come from far way in our universe or from other galaxy...as other willingly ignorant oppositions here will let you believe - but from beneath the surface of body of water in Lake Van, Turkey... and landed in the vicinity of Mt. Ararat.

And here is what the story of the Tower of Babel actually teaches:


When the rains came to the world of Adam, the firmament, which protected the first world from the water that surrounded it…. it started to brake down and began to sink. The Ark, which was already upon the waters began to rise as the firmament sank. This released the Ark into ANOTHER world, to the present world of ours.

Noah's descendants thought they could build a tower to Heaven and escape the present Earth, just like Noah had escaped from the first Earth. They didn't want to be scattered over the face of the whole face of the Earth, into the lands of the Savages (prehistoric people), so they tried to escape our world, but the LORD had other plans.

Thus, Humanity scattered over the face of the present Earth and the prehistoric people on this planet changed from innocent animal to Human intelligence. This shows that Humans did NOT evolve from Apes but from Noah's descendants.

Remember, the 1st heaven or universe was Adam's world (Gen 1:6-8 KJV), which was "clean dissolved" in the Flood. The present Universe is the 2nd Heaven, our world, made Billions of years AFTER Adam's world was made, and is also doomed for destruction and will be dissolved too. The 3rd Heaven or world is where Christians will go AFTER our world is burned Rev 21.

[Rev 21:1 KJV] And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

God Bless
 
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URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
\
Genesis 1:1 Is just a Preface or Introduction - The Story of the Beginning of the Physical World
Genesis 1:2 Tells us the condition of the deep - empty / void - before the making of the physical world.
Genesis 1:3 The bringing forth of the LIGHT before anything is made that was made.... before the world was.
Genesis 1:4 The division of light from darkness - the first work of old.
Genesis 1:5 The evening and the morning the first day of creation.
Jesus was before all things as the following verses below confirms. These verses are speaking of Jesus
Jesus IS the Light that was brought forth into this physical world in the Beginning of creation - when
God spoke His 1st Word in the Scripture and said.... LET THERE BE LIGHT; and there was light. Gen 1:3
Col 1:16 For by Him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by Him, and for Him: Col 1:17 And He is before all things, and by Him all things consist.
Therefore, without the Son, was not anything made that was made - like a potter would mold a clay - including the forming/making of our earth.

John 1:3 All things were MADE by him; and without him was NOT any thing MADE that was MADE.
Is your idea of the Son is different than this? Unless Jesus is FIRST in your view, it doesn't fit the above description… so the notions that our earth already existed and formed on Gen 1:1 - BEFORE the bringing forth of the Son into our physical world Gen 1:3- is refuted by the Scriptural texts above.

I can see the 'pre-human heavenly' Jesus of John 1:3 is the ' agent ' God used of 1 Corinthians 8:6.
After all, the pre-human Jesus is the 'beginning of the creation by God' as per Revelation 3:14; 1:5.
Psalms 90:2 informs us that God had No beginning, whereas pre-human Jesus had a beginning - Colossians 1:15.
So, pre-human Jesus was Not before the beginning as his God was before the beginning.
After all, as John 1:18 says 'No man has seen God at any time'. People saw Jesus.- 1 John 4:12; Exodus 33:20.
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
So, are you saying that our Lord YHWH is the Christ himself - the Son of the invisible God - whose name is NOT yet revealed to any man at this time? Just clarifying your Biblical Stand..
No, the Tetragrammaton is never in connection to Jesus.
Jesus is the ' Lord ' (in some lower-case letters) of KJV Psalms 110, whereas the 'LORD' (in all Upper-Case letters) is where the Tetragrammaton YHWH stands.

Sure, the name of the pre-human heavenly Jesus is revealed at this time as found at 1 Thessalonians 4:16 because Jesus has the voice of the ' archangel ', and the archangel's name is Michael.- Daniel 12; Revelation 12:7-9,12
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
We know this because In the New Testament, we were told that their heaven and earth.... “ Whereby that the world THEN WAS -- standing out of the water and in the water -- being overflowed with water, perished” (Greek- totally destroyed) 2Pet 3:5-6
Remember, the 1st heaven or universe was Adam's world (Gen 1:6-8 KJV), which was "clean dissolved" in the Flood. The present Universe is the 2nd Heaven, our world, made Billions of years AFTER Adam's world was made, and is also doomed for destruction and will be dissolved too. The 3rd Heaven or world is where Christians will go AFTER our world is burned Rev 21.
[Rev 21:1 KJV] And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. God Bless

I found your post # 98 to be very interesting, and yes the 'world then perished'. The world of mankind, Not the Earth.
After all, the 'Earth abides forever' as per Ecclesiastes 1:4 B; Psalms 119:90; Psalms 104:5,30; Psalms 93.
Yes, there was the 'governing heavens' of Adam's day, but to me the ' 1st ' heavens as mentioned at 2 Peter 3:5 is the heavens and earth as it was at the time of Noah's day. That would be the heavens of OLD.
The 2nd heavens and earth is then starting from Noah's day to our day is the heavens of NOW - 2 Peter 3:7
The 3rd heavens and earth will be when Jesus begins his 1,000-year rule over Earth, the NEW heavens.... 2 Peter 3:13
NEW in the sense that which passes away is the 'wicked world of mankind' because the 'executional words from Jesus' mouth' will rid the Earth of the wicked, Not get rid of the Earth which abides forever.
- Psalms 104:35; Isaiah 11:3-4; Revelation 19:14-16.
The ' sea that is No more ' then is the restless ' sea ' of wicked mankind - Isaiah 57:20; Proverbs 2:21-22.
Jesus will bring, so to speak ' an overnight change ' Isaiah 17:11-13 because Jesus will then have dominion from 'sea to sea' according to Psalms 72:8.
So, 'wheat' Christians (and All those counted as the humble figurative ' sheep ' of Matthew 25:31-33,37,40) will go through the coming great tribulation of Revelation 7:14,9 to be the foundation of righteous mankind right here on Earth starting with calendar Day One of Jesus' coming millennium-long day of governing over the NEW cleansed earth.
 

Seve

Member
No, the Tetragrammaton is never in connection to Jesus.
Jesus is the ' Lord ' (in some lower-case letters) of KJV Psalms 110, whereas the 'LORD' (in all Upper-Case letters) is where the Tetragrammaton YHWH stands.

Sure, the name of the pre-human heavenly Jesus is revealed at this time as found at 1 Thessalonians 4:16 because Jesus has the voice of the ' archangel ', and the archangel's name is Michael.- Daniel 12; Revelation 12:7-9,12

Okay... Correct me, my friend, if my understanding of your Biblical Stand is wrong, since I am a little bit confuse.

IOW, what you are saying is.....

LORD = YHWH or Jehovah - The Almighty God Father
Lord = the Son - Pre-human - Archangel Michael - OT .... or Jesus Christ - NT

Would this be the case of your Biblical Stand?

Thanks
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Do you have anything to say about the subject topic or do you just wish to post ad hominems?
Now your hypocrisy is showing as this is what you posted in response to @shunyadragon : "Scripture says that those who have not been born again have eyes which CANNOT see, and ears which CANNOT hear. Tell us of your mysterious ability to see into the mind of another."

Your unwanted bias opinion and false accusations about me are surpassed only by your ability to ambush someone you know nothing about.
This is not a closed forum so I have as much right to post my opinions here as you do, plus I didn't really "ambush" you as that's not even logical.

Anyhow, I will be dealing with this forum in more substance tomorrow as today I have too little time.


 

Seve

Member
Science is studying the evolution of the sons of God (prehistoric people) INSTEAD of Humans, who are the descendants of Adam, the common ancestor of ALL Humans. Only Humans have the knowledge of "good and evil". That's why you will not find any human litigating our Dogs directly when they bite you.

Man was physically formed of the dust on the 3rd Day - the SAME Day as the Big Bang of our Cosmos, or some 13.7 Billion years ago. Adam lived with Jesus - surrounded with shekinah glory - and was made with a higher intelligence level than ANY creature whose origin was in the water on the 5th Day, because Adam had an intelligence like God's. Gen 3:22

It is IMPOSSIBLE for Adam, the first Human, to have evolved from the common ancestor of Apes since our Earth is only 4.53 Billion years old, and Adam had been around for Billions of years before then - living on the 1st heaven (at the garden of Eden) as our Lord's meet.

There is no interpretation needed since Science has measured the time since the Big Bang at 13.7 Billion years ago, and God shows it was the 3rd Days or Ages ago, which means that EACH of God's Days is some 4.5 Billion years in length, in man's time. God's Truth is the Truth Scientifically, Historically, and in EVERY other way, IF we can understand God's Holy Word.

Today's ToE's and some Religionist are totally ignorant that Human blood was contaminated by the blood of the common ancestor of Apes because Noah's grandsons had NO other humans to marry on this planet when they arrived. They married the descendants of the sons of God (prehistoric people) who were ALREADY here, when they arrived.

Adam's direct descendant, Noah and his family, arrived on our present Earth, some 11k years ago and Human civilization on this Planet, can be traced to them. History agrees and odd men out are the False ToE and some Religionist who are "willingly ignorant" 2Pe 3:5 of our true Human origins.

You can read of the sexual compatibility of the sons of God (prehistoric people) and Adam's descendants in Gen 6:1-4. That's the Biblical Truth not Mine.

OUR GOD IS AN AWESOME GOD!
 
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