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Science is a false God

Maximilian

Energetic proclaimer of Jehovah God's Kingdom.
Where does Genesis say that?

"Jehovah God built the rib that he had taken from the man into a woman, and he brought her to the man. Then the man said:

“This is at last bone of my bones

And flesh of my flesh.

This one will be called Woman,

Because from man she was taken.”

That is why a man will leave his father and his mother and he will stick to his wife, and they will become one flesh." -Genesis 2:22-24 (Emphasis mine)
 

gnostic

The Lost One
Sorry all this about hygiene and hand-washing that religions - in this case, Judaism, Christianity and Islam - like to take credits for being the first seemed awfully trivial.

Sorry but all three lost the contest, to an even older culture and religion.

According to the Sumerian poem, titled today as the Death of Bilgames - which Bilgames or Gilgames being the Sumerian name for Gilgamesh.

Anyway, in this text, the ritual of hand washing was supposedly lost in Sumer, but after Bilgames met Ziusudra, the Sumerian hero of the Flood, Bilgames brought back the custom of hand washing to Uruk.

“Death of Gilgamesh ETCSL” said:
Having founded many temples of the gods, you reached Zi-ud-sura in his {dwelling place} {(1 ms. has instead: ) place}. Having brought down to the Land the divine powers of Sumer, which at that time were forgotten forever, the orders, and the rituals, he (?) carried out correctly the rites of hand washing and mouth washing .......

Source: Death of Gilgamesh, translation from Electronic Text Corpus of Sumerian Literature, Oxford University.

Later versions of the Gilgamesh myth, from the Akkadian, Babylonian and Assyrian of the Epic, don’t include this hand washing ritual, but the oldest Gilgamesh-Ziusudra myth do have it.

Sorry, but the whole hand washing custom is not original idea of the Abrahamic religions.
 
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Dell

Asteroid insurance?
Many who say there is no God because science can't prove it actually worship science.

"Let us notice this morning how modern man has made a god of science. It was quite easy for modern man to put his ultimate faith in science because science had brought about such remarkable advances, such tangible and amazing victories. He realized that man through his scientific genius had dwarfed distances and placed time in chains. He noticed the new comforts that had been brought about by science, from the vast improvements in communication to the elimination of many dread plagues and diseases. And so after noticing these astounding successes modern man ushered in a new god and a new religion. Individual scientist became the high priests, chemical and biological instrumants became sacramental agencies through which the invisible grace of the scientific god became visibly manifested, and scientific laboratories became the sanctuaries. And so modern man dutifully worshipped at the shrine of the god of science.

But today we are confronted with the tragic fact that the god of science which we so devoutly worshipped has brought about the possibility of universal annihilation, and so man today stands on the brink of atomic destruction aghast, panic-stricken and petrified. He realizes now that his greatest need is not science which is power, but wisdom which is control. Doubtless some one has been saying, but is it not right to devote ourselves to scientific adventure? Is not science important for the progress of civilization? To this I would answer yes. No person of sound intelligence could minimize science. It is not science in itself that I am condemning, {but it is the tendency of projecting it to the status of God that I am condemning.} We must come to see that science only furnishes us with the means by which we live, but never with the spiritual ends for which we live. And so we must turn back and give our ultimate devotion to the God who integrates the whole of life, to the God in whom we live and move and have our being, to the God who has been our help in ages past, our hope for years to come, our shelter from the stormy blast, and our eternal home.6 Preached July 5, 1953"

False Gods We Worship | The Martin Luther King, Jr., Research and Education Institute
Say for the sake of argument that the God of the Bible exists and billions of people have chosen not to believe in the existence of God because of science.

Who's at fault? God or science?

1. Science builds on results of observation.
2. So if God is observable science would agree God exist.
3. If the Bible was uncorrupted, historically and scientifically sound, science would agree God might exist and might have been observable in past history, but presently unobservable.
4. If God wanted his existence to be undisputed, he would be undeniably observable.

Any intelligence can see the fault would be on God. So if it were true Calvinism would be true. God is choosing to reveal himself to a chosen few and damn more than save by deception.
 
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Maximilian

Energetic proclaimer of Jehovah God's Kingdom.
Why? Consenting adults, informed consent, contraception (or agreed conception), relationship conducted honestly and openly ─ what exactly is the problem?

It doesn't work. If it did millions of children would not be murdered by their mothers who don't want them or children wouldn't suffer growing up without their mother or father in a dysfunctional single-parent home.
 

ecco

Veteran Member
In like manner, the fact that there are dozens upon dozens of fulfilled Bible prophecies constitutes probative evidence of the existence of its author, Jehovah God.
Please list one clear concise indisputable prophecy that has come to pass.

Anything as vague and ambiguous as the following will not be counted.

NOSTRADAMUS QUATRAIN #1-1
Being seated at night in my secret study,
Alone, sitting upon a stool of brass;
A revealing flame shall leap forth from the solitude,
Granting that which is not to be believed in vain.












along the lines
 

Maximilian

Energetic proclaimer of Jehovah God's Kingdom.
Jeremiah 4:10 ... “Ah, Lord GOD! surely thou hast utterly deceived this people and Jerusalem ...”

Your eisegesis is fallacious. In Jeremiah’s period, there were prophets ‘prophesying in falsehood.’ (Jeremiah 5:31; 20:6 ;23:16, 17, 25-28, 32) Jehovah did not stop these from declaring their deceptive messages but he was not the reason for their lies.
 

blü 2

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Again, how does this answer my pointed query?
I didn't notice any pointed queries. I won't mention the obtuse ones.

But you really need to have that dyslexia seen to.

One reply. Get all your questions into one reply. Don't make multiple posts when responding, make only one reply. Stop the scattershot, order your thoughts and procedures and put your entire response into one reply.

One reply.

Or did I mention that already?

And I take it , in the absence of that reasoned response I mentioned, that you accept that "murder" is a hopelessly vague notion.
 

ecco

Veteran Member
Examine Numbers 19. A variety of lye-soap formulas demonstrate that, to get lye, water was poured through cinders. The reclaimed water incorporated a dilution of lye. Lye, in higher strengths, is extremely caustic as well as irritating to the epidermis. In more watered down levels, however, it is actually utilized as a superb scrub and cleaning agent. Many manufacturers nowadays still make lye cleansers. Astoundingly, via God’s inspiration, Moses directed the Israelites to make a combination which would have contained lye combined in a diluted emulsion.


On top of that, take into account that hyssop was also included in the “water of purification.” Hyssop consist of the antibacterial and antiviral thymol. The essential oil from the cedar timber in the concoction also furnished a small skin irritant which would have encouraged scrubbing. While the scarlet wool added in wool strands thus rendering it soap. (cf. Hebrews 9 :19)
The Bible is a fount of knowledge.
Leviticus
11:9

“These you may eat, of all that are in the waters. Everything in the waters that has fins and scales, whether in the seas or in the rivers, you may eat.

11:10
But anything in the seas or the rivers that has not fins and scales, of the swarming creatures in the waters and of the living creatures that are in the waters, is detestable to you.

Leviticus 11:7
And the pig, because it parts the hoof and is cloven-footed but does not chew the cud, is unclean to you. You shall not eat any of their flesh, and you shall not touch their carcasses; they are unclean to you.


No Bacon. No Baby Back Ribs. No Lobster. It's no wonder they were all grouchy all the time.
 

Timothy Spurlin

Active Member
You're not making any sense.

For legitimate ‘right’ and ‘wrong’ to exist morality simply cannot be relative for this makes ‘right’ and ‘wrong’ vulnerable to mere caprice. Under such an ambivalent standard absolutely nothing is actually ‘right’ or ‘wrong’ rendering these terms utterly otiose; conveying a distinction without a difference.

Accordingly:

(1) If God does not exist, objective moral values and duties don't exist.

(2) If evil exists, objective moral values and duties exist.

(3) Evil exists.

(4) Therefore, objective moral values and duties do exist.

(5) Therefore, God exists.

(6) Therefore, God is the locus of all objective moral values and duties.​

That's to say, as Dostoevsky once mused, "If there is no God, everything is permitted."

Morals are subjective, not objective. Morals come from your mind and the laws of the society you live in.

Evil doesn't prove a god exist. Evil just proves that there are humans that do bad things to others.
 

sooda

Veteran Member
Sorry all this about hygiene and hand-washing that religions - in this case, Judaism, Christianity and Islam - like to take credits for being the first seemed awfully trivial.

Sorry but all three lost the contest, to an even older culture and religion.

According to the Sumerian poem, titled today as the Death of Bilgames - which Bilgames or Gilgames being the Sumerian name for Gilgamesh.

Anyway, in this text, the ritual of hand washing was supposedly lost in Sumer, but after Bilgames met Ziusudra, the Sumerian hero of the Flood, Bilgames brought back the custom of hand washing to Uruk.



Source: Death of Gilgamesh, translation from Electronic Text Corpus of Sumerian Literature, Oxford University.

Later versions of the Gilgamesh myth, from the Akkadian, Babylonian and Assyrian of the Epic, don’t include this hand washing ritual, but the oldest Gilgamesh-Ziusudra myth do have it.

Sorry, but the whole hand washing custom is not original idea of the Abrahamic religions.

Great post....
 

ecco

Veteran Member
If those places are so awesome and moral why are their suicide rates so extraordinarily high?
One cause of suicide is religiously inspired feelings and actions against homosexuals.

But there are other reasons as well...
Shunning and Suicide in the Jehovah’s Witnesses: Alienation’s Deadly Toll
For one woman in Michigan who had left the Jehovah’s Witnesses, the strain of losing her community was too much, and, struggling under the weight of the shame her abusers had taught her to assume, she drowned the family dog and shot her husband and two adult children, before turning the gun on herself. According to family friends, Lauren Stuart and her husband had left the organization because their children wished to attend college – something the Jehovah’s Witnesses strongly discourage – and she wished to pursue a modeling career. Because she could no longer be a member of the group in good standing, former friends ignored her, looking the other way when seeing her in town, refusing to speak with her or acknowledge her presence. In a small community, such treatment can make life intolerable, and although the Jehovah’s Witnesses have claimed in court that shunning is a “personal choice” and never absolute, their own internal convention videos show a harsh reality, where parents are coached to ignore their own children if they are disfellowshipped.​
 

Maximilian

Energetic proclaimer of Jehovah God's Kingdom.
Jeremiah 20:7 O Lord, thou hast deceived me, / and I was deceived;


“The word of Jehovah has been the cause of insults and jeering all day long.

I am not going to make mention of him,

And I will speak no more in his name.” -Jeremiah 20:8, 9​

As a result of struggling with indifference, rejection, as well as persecution while proclaiming Jehovah’s judgments, Jeremiah likely felt that he did not really have the strength to carry on. Yet, Jehovah utilized his strength against such inclinations, enabling Jeremiah to keep going.

"But in my heart it became like a burning fire shut up in my bones,

And I was tired of holding it in;

I could no longer endure it.

Jehovah was with me like a fearsome warrior.


That is why those persecuting me will stumble and will not prevail.

They will be put to great shame, for they will not succeed.

Their everlasting humiliation will not be forgotten.

But you, O Jehovah of armies, are examining the righteous one;

You see the innermost thoughts and the heart.

Let me see your vengeance on them,

For to you I have committed my legal case.

Sing to Jehovah! Praise Jehovah!" -Jeremiah 20:9, 11-13​

Jehovah thus "fooled" Jeremiah by employing him to achieve what the prophet himself believed he could not accomplish.

dt_170111_cherry_picking_800x600.jpg


That is some outstanding cherry picking, though, lol :D
 

ecco

Veteran Member
After creating the first human pair, our Almighty Creator dictated that sexual relations between a man and a woman can only be within the bonds of matrimony.
Are you saying that Abel married Eve or that Abel married his sister(s)?
 

ecco

Veteran Member
Where is your conclusive evidence?

Suicide among LGBT youth - Wikipedia
Research has found that attempted suicide rates and suicidal ideation among lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender (LGBT) youth is significantly higher than among the general population.[1]

[1]
Haas, Ann P.; Eliason, Mickey; Mays, Vickie M.; Mathy, Robin M.; Cochran, Susan D.; D'Augelli, Anthony R.; Silverman, Morton M.; Fisher, Prudence W.; Hughes, Tonda; Rosario, Margaret; Russell, Stephen T.; Malley, Effie; Reed, Jerry; Litts, David A.; Haller, Ellen; Sell, Randall L.; Remafedi, Gary; Bradford, Judith; Beautrais, Annette L.; Brown, Gregory K.; Diamond, Gary M.; Friedman, Mark S.; Garofalo, Robert; Turner, Mason S.; Hollibaugh, Amber; Clayton, Paula J. (30 December 2010). "Suicide and Suicide Risk in Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Transgender Populations: Review and Recommendations". Journal of Homosexuality. 58 (1): 10–51. doi:10.1080/00918369.2011.534038. PMC 3662085. PMID 21213174.
Proctor, Curtis D.; Groze, Victor K. (1994). "Risk Factors for Suicide among Gay, Lesbian, and Bisexual Youths". Social Work. 39 (5): 504–513. doi:10.1093/sw/39.5.504.
Remafedi, Gary; Farrow, James A.; Deisher, Robert W. (1991). "Risk Factors for Attempted Suicide in Gay and Bisexual Youth". Pediatrics. 87 (6): 869–875.
Russell, Stephen T.; Joyner, Kara (2001). "Adolescent Sexual Orientation and Suicide Risk: Evidence From a National Study". American Journal of Public Health. 91 (8): 1276–1281. doi:10.2105/AJPH.91.8.1276. PMC 1446760. PMID 11499118.
Hammelman, Tracie L. (1993). "Gay and Lesbian Youth". Journal of Gay & Lesbian Psychotherapy. 2 (1): 77–89. doi:10.1300/J236v02n01_06.
Johnson, R. B.; Oxendine, S.; Taub, D. J.; Robertson, J. (2013). "Suicide Prevention for LGBT Students". New Directions for Student Services. 2013: 55–69. doi:10.1002/ss.20040.​
 

Maximilian

Energetic proclaimer of Jehovah God's Kingdom.
2 Chronicles 18:22 Now therefore, behold, the Lord has put a lying spirit in the mouth of these your prophets; the Lord has spoken evil concerning you.

Ezekiel 14:9 And if the prophet be deceived and speak a word, I, the Lord, have deceived that prophet

2 Thessalonians 2:11 Therefore God sends upon them a strong delusion, to make them believe what is false.

Let's have a more detailed look at the circumstances of Israelite King Ahab. Untruthful prophets guaranteed Ahab of victory in war against Ramoth-gilead, even while Jehovah’s prophet Micaiah foretold catastrophe. As unveiled in vision to Micaiah, Jehovah permitted a spirit being to be “a deceptive spirit” in the lips of Ahab’s prophets. In other words, this spirit being employed his power upon these so they spoke, not reality, but the things they themselves wished to express and what Ahab desired to hear from them. Even though warned, Ahab chose to be conned by their lies and then paid for this with his life.—1 Kings 22 :1-38 ; 2 Chronicles 18.

As is plain to any honest reader, rather than maliciously depriving Ahab of the truth, Jehovah God offered it to him and then let him decide whether to accept it or not.


Careful, now. Your noetical bigotry is beginning to seep through . . .
 

Maximilian

Energetic proclaimer of Jehovah God's Kingdom.
And you need to consider that what Yahweh wanted to achieve, [he] could have achieved with one snap of those omnipotent fingers. Assuming an omnipotent god (as [his] billing repeatedly states) and a real Jesus (which is an open question), all this 'kill my son' business is a meaningless charade.

Your casuistry exhibits a style of simplistic thinking that overlooks an extremely complex and multi-dimensional dilemma that could only be handled through extraordinary measures.

Try again.
 
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