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The Book of Ruth

Ellen Brown

Well-Known Member
I listened to someone talk about the book today, and I am certain that modern, feminist, American women would be frothing at the mouth over it. It has been a long time since I was exposed to it, so I had almost completely forgotten about it. Chapters 3 and 4 are especially interesting.

It is very interesting that Ruth's children end up originating the babe David. The speaker had an explanation of this that is much better than mine.
 

Misunderstood

Active Member
I listened to someone talk about the book today, and I am certain that modern, feminist, American women would be frothing at the mouth over it. It has been a long time since I was exposed to it, so I had almost completely forgotten about it. Chapters 3 and 4 are especially interesting.

It is very interesting that Ruth's children end up originating the babe David. The speaker had an explanation of this that is much better than mine.

I feel it is a wonderful story of some very Godly people. I only wish our world behaved more like the characters in this book.

I can see the modern feminist women having issue with the customs of the time. But we all need to deal with our customs whether they are right or wrong; they had to deal with their customs. But as women of their time I feel they dealt with a bad situation (lose of husband and children) in hard times (a drought), as well as anyone could. Everyone should be inspired by them whether male or female.
 

Ellen Brown

Well-Known Member
I feel it is a wonderful story of some very Godly people. I only wish our world behaved more like the characters in this book.

I can see the modern feminist women having issue with the customs of the time. But we all need to deal with our customs whether they are right or wrong; they had to deal with their customs. But as women of their time I feel they dealt with a bad situation (lose of husband and children) in hard times (a drought), as well as anyone could. Everyone should be inspired by them whether male or female.


I wish that the situation in Ruth was done today, and perhaps in rural communities it repeats to some extent.

I can't imagine going to a man's bed and sleeping at his feet, but were the that Ruth had was available...
 

pearl

Well-Known Member
I listened to someone talk about the book today, and I am certain that modern, feminist, American women would be frothing at the mouth over it. It has been a long time since I was exposed to it, so I had almost completely forgotten about it. Chapters 3 and 4 are especially interesting.

Interestingly, Matthew makes an exception in his atypical construction of Jesus' genealogy, including four women, though considered scandalous, Ruth being one, they played an important role in God's plan and considered to be the instrument of his Holy Spirit. So I guess we ought to acknowledge them as heroines.
 

Misunderstood

Active Member
I wish that the situation in Ruth was done today, and perhaps in rural communities it repeats to some extent.

I can't imagine going to a man's bed and sleeping at his feet, but were the that Ruth had was available...

I feel for the situation it was appropriate. Boas was asleep when she went over and lay at his feet. I think it was as close as would be a appropriate and still show her and Naomi's intentions. I think laying next to him would have been to forward.

I also think that if the roles were reversed even in today's customs it would be forward of a man to lay next to a woman if he was to join her unawares. But would be appropriate to sleep on the floor or at the door. The times and the situation makes a big difference in these types of things.
 

Ellen Brown

Well-Known Member
Interestingly, Matthew makes an exception in his atypical construction of Jesus' genealogy, including four women, though considered scandalous, Ruth being one, they played an important role in God's plan and considered to be the instrument of his Holy Spirit. So I guess we ought to acknowledge them as heroines.


Modern cultures are so different from that day. I can only really speak for the place in America where I live. Today the interchange between Ruth and Boaz would not be likely to happen. Though it is not said, so I do not know, I assume that Boaz had another wife (s) already, so his union with Ruth could represent Polygamy? If so, I think it likely that is probably the only scenario that God would approve of?

I've seen and experienced how abusive and sick and dysfunctional families can be, so I am doubtful about doing the same in 2019.
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
I think the story of Ruth is absolutely amazing. Given the patriarchal culture of the time, Ruth showed amazing initiative and independent thinking. Had she stayed in Moab, she undoubtedly would have had an easy time finding a husband. But she loved her mother in law, and very likely she had been influenced by the Judaism of her husband. And so she undertook a risky conversion -- she traveled far from her home to a strange land with strange customs with no guarantee of a husband (meaning it was likely she would live in poverty). But she persisted with the convert's plea, "Let your people be my people, and your God my God."

When she gets to Israel, she takes Naomi's advice to go after Boaz, who would be obligated to a levirate marriage demanded in the Torah if he can just get around the claim by one kinsman who was closer. Naomi advised Ruth to "lie by his feet." "Uncovering his feet" is a euphemism for uncovering his genitals, and lying by his feet until morning is a euphemism for having sex. In this way, although it was risky, Ruth was proposing marriage to Boaz. That's a pretty gutsy broad!

The next day, Boaz did indeed work out his rights to the levirate marriage, and Ruth was his.

Born a Moabite, she died a Jew. It shows the power of making choices. One of the consequences of her powerful choices was that her grandchild was King David himself.
 

Ellen Brown

Well-Known Member
I think the story of Ruth is absolutely amazing. Given the patriarchal culture of the time, Ruth showed amazing initiative and independent thinking. Had she stayed in Moab, she undoubtedly would have had an easy time finding a husband. But she loved her mother in law, and very likely she had been influenced by the Judaism of her husband. And so she undertook a risky conversion -- she traveled far from her home to a strange land with strange customs with no guarantee of a husband (meaning it was likely she would live in poverty). But she persisted with the convert's plea, "Let your people be my people, and your God my God."

When she gets to Israel, she takes Naomi's advice to go after Boaz, who would be obligated to a levirate marriage demanded in the Torah if he can just get around the claim by one kinsman who was closer. Naomi advised Ruth to "lie by his feet." "Uncovering his feet" is a euphemism for uncovering his genitals, and lying by his feet until morning is a euphemism for having sex. In this way, although it was risky, Ruth was proposing marriage to Boaz. That's a pretty gutsy broad!

The next day, Boaz did indeed work out his rights to the levirate marriage, and Ruth was his.

Born a Moabite, she died a Jew. It shows the power of making choices. One of the consequences of her powerful choices was that her grandchild was King David himself.

I did not realize that the translated language was that far off? Goodness!
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
I did not realize that the translated language was that far off? Goodness!
Unless I'm mistaken, it's not that the translations are off, it's that we don't use the same euphemisms anymore.

Think of the euphemisms WE use TODAY! "Sleeping together"? I remember the King James translation, "and Adam KNEW Eve his wife." LOL Probably people thousands of years from now will have trouble knowing what we're saying.
 

whirlingmerc

Well-Known Member
I listened to someone talk about the book today, and I am certain that modern, feminist, American women would be frothing at the mouth over it. It has been a long time since I was exposed to it, so I had almost completely forgotten about it. Chapters 3 and 4 are especially interesting.

It is very interesting that Ruth's children end up originating the babe David. The speaker had an explanation of this that is much better than mine.

Ruth is a fascinating book.

In early chapter all the Jewish men in the story died 'under the law' but an unlikely despised Moabite, Ruth, was the one with 'a circumsized heart' In a way it's a picture of God extending salvation to unlikely gentiles

In some ways the book is about the mother in law, Naomi. She thinks God is opposed to her in the start but at the end becomes convinced God is doing something wonderful and even gives risky advice to Ruth her daughter in law to lay at Boaz feet and then 'do whatever he tells you' at the barley harvest as he was sleeping.

Risky but with a happy ending
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
but an unlikely despised Moabite, Ruth, was the one with 'a circumsized heart' In a way it's a picture of God extending salvation to unlikely gentiles
You are correct that the story does begin with Ruth as a righteous Gentile. However, Ruth is not content with "Your God shall be my God." She also states "Your people shall be my people." IOW she undergoes conversion and becomes an Israelite. Born a Moabite, she dies a Jew.
 

whirlingmerc

Well-Known Member
You are correct that the story does begin with Ruth as a righteous Gentile. However, Ruth is not content with "Your God shall be my God." She also states "Your people shall be my people." IOW she undergoes conversion and becomes an Israelite. Born a Moabite, she dies a Jew.

Other great points about the account include Boaz as the kinsman redeemer, the near relative who steps in and pays the debts of his relative, a redemption. Also a great image of Jesus.
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Other great points about the account include Boaz as the kinsman redeemer, the near relative who steps in and pays the debts of his relative, a redemption. Also a great image of Jesus.
You think of Jesus as marrying his brother's wife? I'm pretty used to Christians seeing Jesus in the Tanakh where he really isn't, but this one surprises me.
 

whirlingmerc

Well-Known Member
You think of Jesus as marrying his brother's wife? I'm pretty used to Christians seeing Jesus in the Tanakh where he really isn't, but this one surprises me.

I shall take surprise as a compliment

Esther is also a great picture of Jesus as she 'went under the curse of the law to save her people" even through she married a divorced Pagan King a type need not 'walk on all fours"
see The festival of the dice!!!" The story of Esther Esther: For such a time as this - storytelling version
(ok this is the storybook version but still Kosher !!)
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
I shall take surprise as a compliment

Esther is also a great picture of Jesus as she 'went under the curse of the law to save her people" even through she married a divorced Pagan King a type need not 'walk on all fours"
see The festival of the dice!!!" The story of Esther Esther: For such a time as this - storytelling version
(ok this is the storybook version but still Kosher !!)
Please limit your speculations to what is actually written in the scroll of Esther.

Nowhere does it say that Esther is under some sort of curse like a “curse of the law whatever that means.

I’m sure she was delighted to marry the king. He was the most suitable bachelor in the land.

What is the festival of dice? I have no idea what you are talking about.
 

The Anointed

Well-Known Member
Interestingly, Matthew makes an exception in his atypical construction of Jesus' genealogy, including four women, though considered scandalous, Ruth being one, they played an important role in God's plan and considered to be the instrument of his Holy Spirit. So I guess we ought to acknowledge them as heroines.

Five actually.

In the genealogy of Joseph ben Jacob, who married the already pregnant Mary, and who did not consummated that union until after she had given birth to her first born son, Jesus the son of Joseph ben Heli, which genealogy is recorded in Matthew, five righteous women are mentioned: Tamar, who played the prostitute and seduced Judah, her father-in law into having sex with her, by which union she conceived and later bore his twin sons, Perez and Zerah.

Then there is Rahab the madam of a whore house in Jericho, who later married Salmon, and bore his son ‘Boaz.’ The third is Ruth, who with sexual cunning deceived Boaz into marrying her, to whom she bore ‘Obed.’

The fourth is Bathsheba, who committed adultery with King David, who had her husband ‘Uriah’ killed, and she was the mother of Solomon, of whom the Lord said; “He shall be my son and I shall be his Father and it is he who shall build my temple for me.” [See 2nd Samuel 7: 14. and 1st Chronicles 17: 13.] Solomon was then blessed with the ruler ship of the most glorious period of Israel’s history. And last of all is Mary who united with her half brother Alexander Helios to conceive and bear Jesus, the promised Messiah.
 

whirlingmerc

Well-Known Member
Please limit your speculations to what is actually written in the scroll of Esther.

Nowhere does it say that Esther is under some sort of curse like a “curse of the law whatever that means.

I’m sure she was delighted to marry the king. He was the most suitable bachelor in the land.

What is the festival of dice? I have no idea what you are talking about.

Esther as a Jew was under the 'curse of the Law" in the sense of the Babylonian edict Haman cooked up. By coming forward and identifying herself as a Jew she put herself under "the curse of the law"

No speculation.
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Esther as a Jew was under the 'curse of the Law" in the sense of the Babylonian edict Haman cooked up. By coming forward and identifying herself as a Jew she put herself under "the curse of the law"

No speculation.
Sure she was under the King’s decree (not Hamamatsu) but it was simply a terrible law which later got overturned. The overwhelming majority of the laws provided order and justice. So I wouldn’t say that Esther was under a curse of the law.
 

whirlingmerc

Well-Known Member
Sure she was under the King’s decree (not Hamamatsu) but it was simply a terrible law which later got overturned. The overwhelming majority of the laws provided order and justice. So I wouldn’t say that Esther was under a curse of the law.

being under a death sentence sounds like a curse to me

Esther came under the death sentence of her people when she identified herself as a Jew in order to save them
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
being under a death sentence sounds like a curse to me

Esther came under the death sentence of her people when she identified herself as a Jew in order to save them
No, normal sentences of the justice system are not considered curses. Curses have a supernatural element.

Is there some reason you feel the need to say she is cursed by the law? I mean have you started with the idea that she is cursed and then went looking for evidence?
 
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