There's too much gray area in the history of the matter. It's likely that Jesus or the person who inspired the character was crucified during various rebellions in Judea. It's likely that he was pulled down early precisely to prevent his death. I mean, I don't recall ever hearing anyone say the other criminals needed to brought down early because of the Sabbath or whatever. Maybe someone can confirm. It's also why I think the centurion whose servant Jesus healed was in on the entire thing, because Romans weren't known for caring whatsoever about Jewish sensibilities. It was lip service if nothing else to keep them quiet. If they truly cared about the Sabbath, all the crucified people would be taken down. Historically, I was under the impression the bodies were left to rot since they were examples to the rest of society. Taking everything down shortly after death doesn't fit the need for public reminders. At least, that's how it seems to me. It's not like we hear of Team Spartacus being taken down. At least, I couldn't find anything saying they were taken down, even if Romans were just tired of looking at the forest of crucifixes. The crucifixion of Jesus just reeks of conspiracy if you stop to think about it for awhile.
There is plenty of evidence even from non-Christian sources that say yes, Jesus was crucified.
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There are plenty of sources that talk of the gods participating in the Trojan War, too.
Given its deeply subversive nature as a symbol of resistance to Roman imperial rule, the 'cross' and the shameful slave death that it represents, was evidently not a literary fiction of the early Christians. It's as historical an event as any from antiquity can be.
It'd be even more historical if any of the apostles had witnessed it, but only John says John witnessed it. Everyone else says the apostles had all run off, so they witnessed neither the Passion nor the Crucifixion.
Muslim belief is based on a literal interpretation of the verses in the Quran quoted in the OP. Because Muslims believe the Quran is the unerring word of God, they believe it must be true.
Given that Jesus might have had a twin brother, I can see where Muslims would come up with "it was another guy". Having a twin means the plot becomes even worse, because now you have Person B capable of pretending to be Person A.
Which is why he is condemned in the Synoptic Gospels.
Which is weird because he doesn't really make much of an appearance until just before the Passion IIRC and his punishment for doing what DESTINY demanded seems curious.
His body died due to the spear piercing his lungs and heart when the Roman soldier checked to see if he was yet dead.
Does the verse say that? I recall it says his "side" was pierced. That could be any lateral point on the body.
What is always fascinating to me are the unbelievers who find themselves consumed with the details of the faith.
It's fascinating to me when believers aren't.
I'm not a Muslim because I know it isn't a religion. It is a political ideology conceived by Muhammad.
And Christianity was invented by Paul so he could distance himself from his Jewish roles pending a Roman crackdown. He changes his name, moves, and makes sure to emphasize his Roman citizenship. Romans at least kinda respected ancient religions, such as Judaism. They thought Christianity was some newfangled nonsense. Christianity was political from the get-go, especially once legalized, where the leaders go postal on just about every pagan anything they can get their bloodthirsty hands on.
I'm not an atheist. That's why I don't join unbeliever forums. Because it isn't worth my time.
See, God told ME to learn from others because it's important for some reason. I believe it links back to the advice to see that we are all parts of the same body and the eye cannot say to the hand the hand isn't needed. Conformity and uniformity breeds extinction, as there is no variation to allow for adaptation.
Unbelievers are the new parable.
In today's world, Jesus would preach about the Good Atheist, where all the self-righteous believers leave the injured person on the road but only the unbeliever is willing to help.
And current studies lend some credibility to that.
Muslims staunchly reject the Divinity of any prophet including Christ and Muhammad. However they will attribute supernatural powers to both which makes Islamic theology appear somewhat contradictory.
Not really. There's a difference between an X-Man and Thor or Galactus or whatever. Even Jesus derided people for looking for signs. Miracles don't prove anything, as we see in Exodus, where Egyptian priests could do magic tricks too. Hell, they probably invented the ones used. Moses would've learned Egyptian magic beliefs while growing up as Egyptian royalty.
Islam teaches that the mundane and the spiritual are not separate, hence why monasticism is shunned.
I agree. I get the desire to "get away from it all", but someone has to clock in and get to work if anything is going to be done.
However, good works do not keep ones salvation in Christianity. Good works are a fruit of ones eternal salvation.
There are plenty of verses that imply or outright state otherwise, though.
Jesus broke plenty of rules. Was he not saved, then? In other words, if the saved will want to do good works and follow the rules, and Jesus is breaking them about every other paragraph, what does this mean for him?
The grave, or the abyss, was the place where lost souls would go according to Hebrew scriptures. Sheol, as it was known.
And in pre-Jewish thought, the God Mot was God of Death and lived in a sewage-filled palace underground. Yum.
and was secretary to Peter, who was present.
When was he present? They had all run off and only John says John was there. The bible is FILLED with witnessed events where the witnesses weren't even there.
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