How Much of the Bible is God's Word?

[Nakosis]

I can see parts of the Bible, the part that states God as speaking directly. Generally through prophets. Jewish recognized Prophets.

What of the rest? There's songs, pomes, general advice, Hebrew law, linage, stories etc...

Does anyone, other than Protestants see the entire Bible as God's Word, God's laws, basically if going against any part of as acting against the will of God, a sin.

Must every word of the Bible be understood via discernment as being direct instruction from God? Or are their parts of the Bible from a less divine source? Stories, advice, civil laws created by men.

Were the disciples of Jesus, disciples or prophets of God. The gospel, the "good news" written by followers of Jesus, need this also be accepted as the Word(s) of God?To act against the words of a disciple is acting against the will of God? Or is it perhaps not heeding, going against advice given by a church leader?

 

[RabbiO]

@Nakosis -

Whose Bible is the subject of your query? What constitutes the entire Bible to your understanding? Obviously, Christian scripture is not part of my scripture. Even in Christianity different denominations do not share the same canon.

 

[Nakosis]

@Nakosis -

Whose Bible is the subject of your query? What constitutes the entire Bible to your understanding? Obviously, Christian scripture is not part of my scripture. Even in Christianity different denominations do not share the same canon.

I'd be interested in your view of the Tanakh as well.
Most protestants I run into, well when I talk to them about the Bible I get the feeling they see every word of the Bible as God's law. However not every word is spoken by God.

Like this recent question about slavery. Yes the Hebrews had slaves and there are laws written that deal with having slaves. Does this mean God condoned slavery or just that the Hebrews had a civil issue to deal with.

 

[Ellen Brown]

@Nakosis -

Whose Bible is the subject of your query? What constitutes the entire Bible to your understanding? Obviously, Christian scripture is not part of my scripture. Even in Christianity different denominations do not share the same canon.

I've been trying to understand how much of what Christians call the Old Testament is "cannon" to Jews? Not being a degreed religious person, but simply one who reads a lot, I do not purport to being an expert.

I think that all of the Abrahamic writings have suffered over time.

 

[lukethethird]

I've been trying to understand how much of what Christians call the Old Testament is "cannon" to Jews? Not being a degreed religious person, but simply one who reads a lot, I do not purport to being an expert.

I think that all of the Abrahamic writings have suffered over time.

Read about the Septuagint, you can wiki it, it should answer your questions.

 

[exchemist]

I'd be interested in your view of the Tanakh as well.
Most protestants I run into, well when I talk to them about the Bible I get the feeling they see every word of the Bible as God's law. However not every word is spoken by God.

Like this recent question about slavery. Yes the Hebrews had slaves and there are laws written that deal with having slaves. Does this mean God condoned slavery or just that the Hebrews had a civil issue to deal with.

You phrase your query rather strangely, as if one could point to certain words or passages that allegedly are God's word and then to others that are not. This seems a bit simplistic. What Christians - and perhaps Jews too, I don't know about them - would maintain, surely is that there is divine inspiration in it, leading to messages for humanity from God being present. But clearly, as the writers were fallible human beings of a particular time, place and culture, the messages may be imperfectly expressed. So one has to read it looking for the messages and separating them from extraneous ideas. Like analysing any other work of literature, in effect.

 

[Earthling]

There's a few point I would offer for consideration.

1. The only portion of the Bible written by Jehovah God himself, with his own hand, is the 10 words, often called the 10 commandments. (Exodus 31:18 / Exodus 34:28 / Deuteronomy 4:13)

2. Jehovah God's words to his prophets and other writers of the Bible, were inspired. Though they may have consulted records, oral histories and testimonies, the content of the sacred scriptures were infallible.

3. The translation of the Bible as we know it, was not, however, inspired. So contradictions, errors and spurious texts are a part of that.

 

[Rival]

I've been trying to understand how much of what Christians call the Old Testament is "cannon" to Jews? Not being a degreed religious person, but simply one who reads a lot, I do not purport to being an expert.

I think that all of the Abrahamic writings have suffered over time.

All of it except what is called Apocrypha.

 

[Nakosis]

You phrase your query rather strangely, as if one could point to certain words or passages that allegedly are God's word and then to others that are not. This seems a bit simplistic. What Christians - and perhaps Jews too, I don't know about them - would maintain, surely is that there is divine inspiration in it, leading to messages for humanity from God being present. But clearly, as the writers were fallible human beings of a particular time, place and culture, the messages may be imperfectly expressed. So one has to read it looking for the messages and separating them from extraneous ideas. Like analysing any other work of literature, in effect.

I think part of my misunderstanding is the idea of "divine inspiration". I can be inspired by a painting or a song. Doesn't mean I have any actual insight on the artist or song writer. However in this case it meant as "a divine influence or action on a person believed to qualify him or her to receive and communicate sacred revelation".

So for many Christians, this would mean every word of the Bible is a sacred revelation? At least this is what it seems to have become to mean, but is this what was intended by the authors?

If we set aside this belief, the Bible IMO doesn't read like sacred revelation. While there are obvious prophets and prophecy, there are parts which are not. Of course this is my opinion and I'm seeking the opinion of others.

 

[Nakosis]

There's a few point I would offer for consideration.

1. The only portion of the Bible written by Jehovah God himself, with his own hand, is the 10 words, often called the 10 commandments. (Exodus 31:18 / Exodus 34:28 / Deuteronomy 4:13)

2. Jehovah God's words to his prophets and other writers of the Bible, were inspired. Though they may have consulted records, oral histories and testimonies, the content of the sacred scriptures were infallible.

3. The translation of the Bible as we know it, was not, however, inspired. So contradictions, errors and spurious texts are a part of that.

Right, so several Christians believe they have been given a gift of discernment which allows them to correctly understand the Bible. So you have to be "divinely inspired" to understand the divine inspiration of the Bible.

However not every Christian believes this, Jew, I'm not sure about. However I know they have the writings of Rabbis their wisdom to aid in understanding.

 

[Firemorphic]

I've been trying to understand how much of what Christians call the Old Testament is "cannon" to Jews? Not being a degreed religious person, but simply one who reads a lot, I do not purport to being an expert.

I think that all of the Abrahamic writings have suffered over time.

My understanding, is that the Torah is the central scripture. (and I greatly appreciate that on many levels and have much respect for the Torah personally).
Then from there the Nevi'im expands on the elements of the Torah itself but doesn't have the level of religious/spiritual authority as the Torah. Then Ketuvim is taken as a compliment to both, as it contains literature (like Job) and poetry/hymns (like the Psalms) in comparison to the aforementioned scriptures; Torah and Nevi'im.
There is a large source of Rabbinic literature (commentaries, dialogues on Law etc) that are foundational to much of Jewish tradition but is not part of the Tanakh itself. Alongside this is a great wealth of mystical literature as well, expanding on the Torah's complexity.

Christians approach the Tanakh ("old" testament) through a completely different set of eyes as Jews and with a completely different way of interpreting it theologically. Christianity (in general) tends to see both the "old" testament (Tanakh) and the "new" testament as halves of one whole, whereas Jews see the Tanakh itself as three separate things, with three different levels of religious/spiritual authority.

 

[Earthling]

Right, so several Christians believe they have been given a gift of discernment which allows them to correctly understand the Bible. So you have to be "divinely inspired" to understand the divine inspiration of the Bible.

However not every Christian believes this, Jew, I'm not sure about. However I know they have the writings of Rabbis their wisdom to aid in understanding.

Well, the writings of men don't compare to the assistance of Jehovah's Holy Spirit. (Psalms 143:10 / Zechariah 7:12 / Joel 2:28-29 / 2 Peter 1:20-21 / Luke 4:1 / Acts of the apostles 18:25

 

[Ellen Brown]

All of it except what is called Apocrypha.

Thank you. Though I imagine that Christians interpret some of the same passages differently, and are likely wrong to Jews.

I see distinct similarities between Jews and Muslim practices, so I believe that Islam copied the Jews to a large extent.

 

[exchemist]

I think part of my misunderstanding is the idea of "divine inspiration". I can be inspired by a painting or a song. Doesn't mean I have any actual insight on the artist or song writer. However in this case it meant as "a divine influence or action on a person believed to qualify him or her to receive and communicate sacred revelation".

So for many Christians, this would mean every word of the Bible is a sacred revelation? At least this is what it seems to have become to mean, but is this what was intended by the authors?

If we set aside this belief, the Bible IMO doesn't read like sacred revelation. While there are obvious prophets and prophecy, there are parts which are not. Of course this is my opinion and I'm seeking the opinion of others.

Every word? Not for many Christians, no. Only for fundamentalists.

This I think is an issue that bedevils so much discourse on forums such as this one - and more widely in the media. There tends to be an undue emphasis on extreme and unrepresentative positions, partly because these make for more custard pie- throwing, which the media love, and partly because it is often the extremists who are motivated to go on-line and promote their views

There is, as so often, a summary of the various traditions within Christianity on Wiki: Biblical inspiration - Wikipedia

I suppose the view I have articulated is a bit "modernist" in the Wiki terminology, but perhaps that is not so surprising.

 

[Sand Dancer]

It is a human product, based on the views of folks living in that location in the world at that time in history. Things change as we learn more about the world.

 

[1213]

I can see parts of the Bible, the part that states God as speaking directly. Generally through prophets. Jewish recognized Prophets....
....Were the disciples of Jesus, disciples or prophets of God. The gospel, the "good news" written by followers of Jesus, need this also be accepted as the Word(s) of God?To act against the words of a disciple is acting against the will of God? Or is it perhaps not heeding, going against advice given by a church leader?

I also think, sayings that are attributed to God, are His words. Also, Jesus teachings are God’s word, because:


Jesus therefore answered them, "My teaching is not mine, but his who sent me. If anyone desires to do his will, he will know about the teaching, whether it is from God, or if I am speaking from myself.
John 7:16-17

And the rest, I think it is inspired or made in guidance of God.

 

[tayla]

I can see parts of the Bible, the part that states God as speaking directly.

In my view the Bible is fiction. There is no deity speaking through the writers.