The Devil, Satan, and Lucifer. One in the same or Not?

[Skwim]

It's actually a poetic description of king Nebuchadnasser the second.

Doesn't make any sense, but okay.

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[Skwim]

From the point of view of Theistic Satanism, probably there is no difference.

Classical understandings:

Lucifer = The king of hell in classical magic texts, King Nebuchadnezzar, or a Roman god symbolic of Venus as the morning star. Modern Luciferians would probably try to make him into something of a Promethean figure rather than directly equate any of these understandings.

Satan = Archangel Samael's title, or those working under him directly. There are more than one.

The Devil = Equivalent to either of the previous, but also the spiritual boogeyman of Christianity. Largely a pejorative statement in reference to the Satan/Lucifer hybrid.


Spiritually, for me, they're synonymous. The medieval texts equated Lucifer functionally but did so in the context of obfuscation in a time where doing a rite to Satan would probably get you killed. If you could put two and two together you'd figure it out anyway by definition. So, I guess it's about what time in history you'd like to go with. I like the Lucifer/Satan equivalency, but I am interested in the old occult.

Interesting. Thanks for the input.

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[Skwim]

Rev 12: 9 The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.

Rev 20:2 He seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil, or Satan, and bound him for a thousand years.

But I'm sure there are other opinions.

So the devil and Satan are one in the same being, but what about all the plural forms of "devil," "devils," that appear in the Bible?

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[Skwim]

In my opinion they are three separate beings. The Devil punishes people in hell. Satan wants to destroy or rule the human race. Lucifer wanted humanity to grow, offering them the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

Also, Lucifer means son of the morning and Satan means prince of darkness, not exactly the same thing.

Yeah, Lucifer does seem to stand apart from the other two, although in post #32 InChrist says they're all names for the same entity.

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[Kenny]

So the devil and Satan are one in the same being, but what about all the plural forms of "devil," "devils," that appear in the Bible?

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demons or little devils. Same as God and gods.

 

[Skwim]

Well, at least the translation you're using.
It says :


What is "even" in this case?!

Use other translations, for comparison!

I'm pretty sure it means "that evening." In other words,

"That evening, they brought unto him many that were possessed with devils: and he cast out the spirits with his word, and healed all that were sick:

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[Kenny]

Yeah, Lucifer does seem to stand apart from the other two, although in post #32 InChrist says they're all names for the same entity.

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Lucifer has a double application. So the he who appears as "an angel of light" has the title of Lucifer... but his name is Satan.

 

[Skwim]

demons or little devils. Same as God and gods.

Hmmmm . . . .

gotta say, that's a new one.

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[Skwim]

Lucifer has a double application. So the he who appears as "an angel of light" has the title of Lucifer... but his name is Satan.

How do you know this?

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[Faithofchristian]

In the Bible there are there three supernatural "badies."

The Devil, Satan, and Lucifer.

Luke 4:2 (KJV)
Being forty days tempted of the devil. And in those days he did eat nothing: and when they were ended, he afterward hungered.

Job 2:7 (KJV)
7 So went Satan forth from the presence of the Lord, and smote Job with sore boils from the sole of his foot unto his crown.

Isaiah 14:12 (KJV)
How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
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As I ask in my title, what difference, if any, is there between the three? If there isn't any difference then why bothering to use three different names?

Lucifer and Satan and the Devil are all one and the same. Lucifer was given the name's Satan and Devil.

There are other names that God gave Lucifer.
The wicked one
Death
Devil
Satan
The Rebellious one
Man of sin
son of perdition
Son of destruction
AnitChrist
The false prophet

All these names Represents Lucifer.

 

[Kenny]

Hmmmm . . . .

gotta say, that's a new one.

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It isn't hard to see... in context :Mark 3:14 And he ordained twelve,that they should be with him, and that he might send them forth to preach, 15 And to have power to heal sicknesses, and to cast out devils:

Obviously not "one" but many.

luke 4:41 And devils also came out of many, crying out, and saying, Thou art Christ the Son of God. And he rebuking them suffered them not to speak: for they knew that he was Christ.

As I understand it, demons and devils are synonymous.

 

[Kenny]

How do you know this?
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Hermeneutics and exegesis... but you don't have to agree.

 

[Skwim]

Lucifer and Satan and the Devil are all one and the same. Lucifer was given the name's Satan and Devil.

Obviously this is in the Bible somewhere. Please point it out if you would.

Hermeneutics and exegesis

Doesn't really tell me much, does it.

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[Bob the Unbeliever]

So at one time there was an angel named Lucifer who what, fell from grace, and changed from an angel into a devil named Satan? Hmmm. So where does this tale come from?

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the same place the rest of those impossible myths come from?

Some poor sod's imagination/drug-induced hallucinations?

 

[Skwim]

Well, first the KJV is perhaps the worst possible translation to use in determining this. They are, however, completely different beings in their native beliefs.

Well, other translations say the same thing, so it makes little difference which translation I chose for the verses.

The Devil is a mish-mash sham of various beings, names, and archetypes. A vague, ever-shifting boogyman meant to instill obedience through fear for the Church.

How do you come by this information?

Satan (properly Ha-Satan) is a high-ranking angel in the Hebrew faith who has never fallen from grace or challenged the Throne.

So Satan is a high-ranking angel still in god's good graces. That's interesting in light of all the bad stuff he's said to be responsible for. Do you suppose that all the bad stuff Satan does is at god's behest?

Lucifer is the Roman deity personifying the dawn.

But why do you suppose the Hebrews recognize a Roman deity and bother to put him in their scriptures?


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[Skwim]

Lucifer, Satan and the Devil is an evolving paradigm. Lucifer was the morning star. The morning star symbolizes a place in time where night becomes day, or where unconsciousness interfaces the dawning of consciousness.

Lucifer is analogous to randomizing principle, that is added to the perfection of creation. This type of randomness is not necessarily bad, since it can lead to new things and more creation. In that sense, Lucifer was a creative spirit that unconsciously tweaked natural human instinct; night, to help create self awareness; consciousness or the dawn of a new day. The invention of fire is not natural instinct, but nevertheless was very useful for further human development.

WOW! That's a lot of information you've gleaned from one simple verse.

Satan is connected to the next phase of change in the human psyche; self awareness. Satan is not thrown from heaven until Revelations. Satan is in heaven as a councilor to God and is in control of the earth and humans, from Adam and Eve, until after Jesus. Satan is connected to law and/or knowledge of good and evil. Law creates an internal polarization in the human psyche, from which randomizing impulses can appear; prohibition can create temptation. Sin taking opportunity through the commandment produces sin of every kind.

The Devil appears when Satan is thrown fro heaven. This transition meant that the randomizing principle is no longer connected to deep unconscious processes, induced by law, that are beyond the conscious mind and will. The Devil has a connection to willpower and choice.

Actually, the devil appears much before Satan is thrown from heaven in Revelations. If I'm not mistaken, devils first appear in Leviticus.

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[The Kilted Heathen]

How do you come by this information?

I forget exactly where, but several theology, philosophy, and Church History courses throughout high school and college. However it's pretty evident to see. "His" names are numerous and butchered (e.g. Beelzebub is a perversion of Ba'al Zaebub, the Canaanite deity of death and rebirth), he looks like a satyr or Pan himself, and his supposed actions and motives twist and pull from various non-Christian deities throughout what was the Roman Empire who oppose either the actions or the will of the Church, indirectly or directly.

So Satan is a high-ranking angel still in god's good graces. That's interesting in light of all the bad stuff he's said to be responsible for. Do you suppose that all the bad stuff Satan does is at god's behest?

Said by who, though? Some Evangelicals would lay acne at Satan's feet, if it vexed them enough. But yes, Ha-Satan cannot act without prior authorization by Yahweh; this is pretty clearly illustrated in the book of Job, especially once one understand that in Hebrew culture and faith, Ha-Satan's duty is to test the piety and faith of mankind--typically the heroic figures but also the every-man. He doesn't whisper temptations to corrupt and turn people from god, but rather playing a spiritual game of Devil's Advocate (ironic, I know), to ensure that these men who are supposed to be high and holy actually are. It's a screening process, basically.

But why do you suppose the Hebrews recognize a Roman deity and bother to put him in their scriptures?

You won't find the name Lucifer in Hebrew scriptures. You only find that in translations by Roman Christians, which then trickled down to every translation of the bible out there. The Old Testament of the bible is so far removed and altered from the Torah that they're practically completely different texts.

 

[nPeace]

In the Bible there are there three supernatural "badies."

The Devil, Satan, and Lucifer.

Luke 4:2 (KJV)
Being forty days tempted of the devil. And in those days he did eat nothing: and when they were ended, he afterward hungered.

Job 2:7 (KJV)
7 So went Satan forth from the presence of the Lord, and smote Job with sore boils from the sole of his foot unto his crown.

Isaiah 14:12 (KJV)
How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
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As I ask in my title, what difference, if any, is there between the three? If there isn't any difference then why bothering to use three different names?

As @Hockeycowboy said in post 5, persons are called by descriptives names. It is not more a name than it is a description, representing the character or role of the person.

Lucifer 'means 'day' star', or 'morning star' and applied to the role of the person called Lucifer.

At
Revelation 12:9 And the great dragon was hurled down--the ancient serpent called the devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.
It refers to the one called Devil and Satan, and represents that one as a dragon.

Those who follow Satan, or Beelzebub, are called demons.
At Matthew 8:16 the word used is daimonizomai, which means, to be possessed by a demon.
I'm not sure why some translations used devils.

 

[Kenny]

Obviously this is in the Bible somewhere. Please point it out if you would.



Doesn't really tell me much, does it.

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You have to take it in context:

12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! How art thou cut down to the ground, who didst claim the Gentiles as an inheritance!
13 Thou who said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven; upon high next to the stars of God I will exalt my throne: and I will sit upon the mount of the testimony and in the sides of the north;
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
15 Yet thou shalt be cast down to Sheol, to the sides of the pit.
16 Those that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble; that shook the kingdoms;

The earthly king never was in heaven nor could he stand next to the start of God and certainly would never by like the most High. The "sides of the north" is a designation for the habitation of God. Taking that into the consideration of the imagery of Revelation 12:4 since "the dragon is Satan" And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven and cast them to the earth; and the dragon stood before the woman who was ready to be delivered, to devour her child as soon as it was born, along with Ezekiel 28:

13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering: the sardius, topaz, diamond, turquoise, onyx, and beryl, the sapphire, ruby, and emerald, and gold; the works of thy tambourines and of thy pipes were prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
14 Thou, great cherubim, wast covered, and I placed thee; thou wast in the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked among stones of fire.
15 Thou wastperfect in all thy ways from the day that thou wast created, until iniquity was found in thee.
16 Because of the multitude of thy trafficking thou wast filled with violence, and thou hast sinned; and I cast thee out of the mountain of God, and I cast thee unto evil from among the stones of fire, O cherubim that wast covered.
17 Thine heart lifted thee up because of thy beauty; thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness; I will cast thee to the earth; I will expose thee before the kings, that they may behold thee.
18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuary by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy trafficking; therefore I brought forth fire from the midst of thee, which has consumed thee, and I brought thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all those that behold thee.

it is our understanding that it was Satan... more scriptures support that position but that is the short of the long of it.

 

[syo]

The Devil, Satan, and Lucifer.

devil is from ''diavolos''. in greek diavolos is slanderer. when christianity was introduced to greeks they identified satan with diavolos because diavolos/slanderer was the highest evil.

Satan
Satan is the servant of god, an angel. his duty is to bring temptation by offering the opposite. god likes it this way so we can build character.

Lucifer
Lucifer is a king i forget his name who would be cruel to israel and he would be hated and not be buried like a king.