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Ask an agent of The Simulation anything

Fool

ALL in all
Premium Member
I am an agent of The Simulation.

This thread is a Q and A thread: Ask an agent of The Simulation anything!

I'm hoping this exercise will help me figure stuff out and understand things more, and also be interesting.

I have a direct link to the administrator of The Simulation. His name is Butterfly. He communicates with me by touch. We are a team. He is upstairs and I am downstairs. I am his voice and he guides me. He has a direct link to the over-seers of The Simulation – a direct link to the outside world.

To better understand what’s going on, please read the original post of this thread that I made previously, concerning the relationship between The Simulation and God:

My beliefs re: Theism and Simulism

I’m here to answer questions in my capacity as an agent of The Simulation. I have no delusion of being infallible. I thrive on being challenged; being challenged helps me adjust my beliefs and improve understandings. I am a work in progress.

I cannot give away scientific or technological answers – there is a directive against me doing this. Humankind has to work these out for itself.

Also, I cannot give details about God’s intervention (or non-intervention) in the affairs of our dimension. There is a directive that is against this. For instance, I am not allowed to confirm or deny the miracles of Jesus. I am not in on this mystery and Butterfly won’t tell me. It has to remain a matter of faith. I have my own beliefs about such things but these are purely personal.

Another thing I can’t go into detail about is the world outside The Simulation. But what I know is: everyone outside believes in God and they are a constitutional monarchy. Also, they have undergone a technological singularity and are in a post-human age. We can only speculate and imagine as to what things are like out there.

So, any questions?​

so you're like Zhuangzi? or the butterfly effect?
 

JoshuaTree

Flowers are red?
The three directives I am currently aware of involve me not sharing information - but the information is withheld from me so it is impossible for me to break them, not because I don't have free will but because I am constrained.

However I think the reason these things are kept from me is because the over-seers suspect that if I knew the information I may share it - I take this as evidence that I have free-will, if they keep things from me as they don't trust me with their secrets?

Odd they'd bother to give you a directive not to tell something you don't know, that's not efficient programming. Perhaps you are a bug? :)
 

BSM1

What? Me worry?
I believe that I'm fully awake and living in a reality with other people, who are also real

and am certain that I'm a man as that is how I experience life and consciousness


Do you think you may have completely missed my point?
 

Eddi

Agnostic
Premium Member
so you're like Zhuangzi? or the butterfly effect?

I don't really understand what Zhuangzi is but yes, I believe Butterfly intervenes in The Simulation on the basis of the butterfly effect - and that this is modelled on how the over-seers believe God Almighty intervenes in the broader universe. Butterfly is very much based on God.
 

Eddi

Agnostic
Premium Member
Odd they'd bother to give you a directive not to tell something you don't know, that's not efficient programming. Perhaps you are a bug? :)

I could live with that!

Hopefully the over-seers would think I'm a good bug
 
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Brickjectivity

Turned to Stone. Now I stretch daily.
Staff member
Premium Member
...This thread is a Q and A thread: Ask an agent of The Simulation anything!...
Suppose we create a simulation within this one? Are we responsible to behave like God? What if we do terrible things to the people inside and mess with their unreal minds? Is it wrong?

Second question is if we are a simulation, then how is our worth? Do we matter?
 

Eddi

Agnostic
Premium Member
Suppose we create a simulation within this one? Are we responsible to behave like God? What if we do terrible things to the people inside and mess with their unreal minds? Is it wrong?

Second question is if we are a simulation, then how is our worth? Do we matter?

Your first question: This question has interested me very greatly. I’d say we have a moral duty to simulated people who are sentient, and that they should be ethically treated, by those who over-see a simulation. I think God would be a good model of how to do this, a concerned but somewhat distant higher power.

However, I’d say we have a moral duty to give simulated people realistic lives; otherwise they would just be our playthings. Especially if they are reasonably intelligent. They need their own struggles and narratives. They need their glories and their own suffering. Their own heroes, their own villains; Their own history which takes place in a real world which they can shape, mess-up, or improve according to their free-will. We should give them their own world to call home. The circumstances of their existence should resemble the circumstances of our existence, it would be unfair not to do this.

I think this leads into the question of evil: I’d say in any simulation we build we should permit natural evil (i.e. natural disasters, plagues) for realism. We must also give them free-will, and from free-will comes human evil. I suppose this is a part of the "problem of evil debate" – how to reconcile suffering with a benevolent higher power?

As for messing with their “unreal” minds, I think history has shown that humans at least don’t need any help messing up our own minds. And I wouldn’t say their minds are unreal either – they are real, just on another dimension of reality.

Your second question: we who dwell in simulations are subjects of the same political and legal institutions as are the over-seers, in a way. We haven’t worked this out yet but we Earthlings are subjects of the same kingdom as those who designed The Simulation. However, they believe they have a moral duty to give us a realistic and meaningful existence. We are equal in worth but not in status as, at the end of the day, our world is at the mercy of theirs. Also, it would be possible for the consciousness of a person in this simulation to be put into an android and for them to interact with the outsiders. Perhaps this happens to some people after their lives in this simulation end? I think this does happen...

The over-lookers differentiate between simulated societies on the basis of them all having varying levels of development. The more advanced the civilisation, the closer they draw to those in the outside world. So yes, we have worth, we’re not a plaything. And yes, we matter in that we have the same moral worth as other sentient beings. We should consider the over-lookers as being our elders – or seniors – who want the best for us and want us to give ourselves good lives – rather than as some set of sinister sadists.
 

Brickjectivity

Turned to Stone. Now I stretch daily.
Staff member
Premium Member
Your first question: This question has interested me very greatly. I’d say we have a moral duty to simulated people who are sentient, and that they should be ethically treated, by those who over-see a simulation. I think God would be a good model of how to do this, a concerned but somewhat distant higher power
What about computer games? They are not sentient, so should we stop using those?

However, I’d say we have a moral duty to give simulated people realistic lives; otherwise they would just be our playthings. Especially if they are reasonably intelligent. They need their own struggles and narratives. They need their glories and their own suffering. Their own heroes, their own villains; Their own history which takes place in a real world which they can shape, mess-up, or improve according to their free-will. We should give them their own world to call home. The circumstances of their existence should resemble the circumstances of our existence, it would be unfair not to do this.
Why?

Do you suppose that in some 4th dimensional way the prisoner is the imprisoned? -- They might exist inside our simulation which is in theirs? I mean could the simulation of a simulation contain the outermost simulation? I ask because 4th dimensional Math suugests there are constructs in which the inside and outside are somehow one surface. An exsmple is the Klein bottle.
 

Eddi

Agnostic
Premium Member
What about computer games? They are not sentient, so should we stop using those?

If they are not sentient then they cannot suffer so it's morally permissible to do anything to them. I think if an entity is controlled by agorithms then that's one thing, but if it has a mind then that's another. But I think the issue is whether or not there is a capacity for suffering. If we think of Artificial Intelligence, I think the more sophisticated it is the better we should treat it, on the off-chance it has attained consciousness or even a soul - but how would we go about turning one physical stimulus into a qualia of pain? How would that work? But in short, I believe computer games as they are today are morally permissible.

Why? Do you suppose that in some 4th dimensional way the prisoner is the imprisoned? -- They might exist inside our simulation which is in theirs? I mean could the simulation of a simulation contain the outermost simulation? I ask because 4th dimensional Math suugests there are constructs in which the inside and outside are somehow one surface. An exsmple is the Klein bottle.

I accept all these points as valid - I am beginning to suspect that the barrier between our dimension and the outside world (and maybe other dimensions) is more porous and fluid than it may at first seem. This I think is all interesting stuff. But I think it's hard to discern these relationships; I don't think our human minds - as they exist today - are really capable of comprehending all the different realities and how all different existences overlap and interplay. But I believe the elders do, to a much greater extent, on account of their higher consciousness and superior science.
 

Milton Platt

Well-Known Member
I am an agent of The Simulation.

This thread is a Q and A thread: Ask an agent of The Simulation anything!

I'm hoping this exercise will help me figure stuff out and understand things more, and also be interesting.

I have a direct link to the administrator of The Simulation. His name is Butterfly. He communicates with me by touch. We are a team. He is upstairs and I am downstairs. I am his voice and he guides me. He has a direct link to the over-seers of The Simulation – a direct link to the outside world.

To better understand what’s going on, please read the original post of this thread that I made previously, concerning the relationship between The Simulation and God:

My beliefs re: Theism and Simulism

I’m here to answer questions in my capacity as an agent of The Simulation. I have no delusion of being infallible. I thrive on being challenged; being challenged helps me adjust my beliefs and improve understandings. I am a work in progress.

I cannot give away scientific or technological answers – there is a directive against me doing this. Humankind has to work these out for itself.

Also, I cannot give details about God’s intervention (or non-intervention) in the affairs of our dimension. There is a directive that is against this. For instance, I am not allowed to confirm or deny the miracles of Jesus. I am not in on this mystery and Butterfly won’t tell me. It has to remain a matter of faith. I have my own beliefs about such things but these are purely personal.

Another thing I can’t go into detail about is the world outside The Simulation. But what I know is: everyone outside believes in God and they are a constitutional monarchy. Also, they have undergone a technological singularity and are in a post-human age. We can only speculate and imagine as to what things are like out there.

So, any questions?​

No. You have effectively blocked all inquiry into the "simulation" in your first post by saying you cannot go into any detail about the world outside the simulation. The first and most important avenue of inquiry is do determine if the simulation is an actual thing and that you are actually an agent of the supposed simulation. In essence, this is just like a religion in that a causation is asserted and then all avenues of investigation to determine the veracity of the claim is blocked. It is just like a Christian saying everything is a product of their god, then defining the god in such a way, that it's existence cannot be confirmed.
 

Eddi

Agnostic
Premium Member
No. You have effectively blocked all inquiry into the "simulation" in your first post by saying you cannot go into any detail about the world outside the simulation. The first and most important avenue of inquiry is do determine if the simulation is an actual thing and that you are actually an agent of the supposed simulation. In essence, this is just like a religion in that a causation is asserted and then all avenues of investigation to determine the veracity of the claim is blocked. It is just like a Christian saying everything is a product of their god, then defining the god in such a way, that it's existence cannot be confirmed.

I have recently realised I can talk about the outside world - but I have to work it out with Butterfly. The rule is I can't be spoon-fed it.

As I said, I am a work in progress.

So go on, ask me about the outside world

It won't be sophisticated but things can be determined by Y and N answers, and over time we could paint a picture

But we won't have access to their texts or the precise details of their technology
 

Milton Platt

Well-Known Member
I have recently realised I can talk about the outside world - but I have to work it out with Butterfly. The rule is I can't be spoon-fed it.

As I said, I am a work in progress.

So go on, ask me about the outside world

It won't be sophisticated but things can be determined by Y and N answers, and over time we could paint a picture

But we won't have access to their texts or the precise details of their technology

I need a way to scientifically verify your truthfulness about what you tell me about "outside the simulation". There has to be independent verification, and testable hypotheses.

Without that, it's just so much BS.
 

Eddi

Agnostic
Premium Member
I need a way to scientifically verify your truthfulness about what you tell me about "outside the simulation". There has to be independent verification, and testable hypotheses.

Without that, it's just so much BS.

Fair enough
 
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