• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Questions for Atheists and Agnostics

ukok102nak

Active Member
... . telling the truth doesn't need to be someone who
belonged unto any particular religion nor even forcing anyone
to be on a particular group and especially if being one with people who doesn't
believed in existence of gods is not an issue at all as long as they telling the truth
but if a person has no intention of saying
what you want to hear from her or him and you already knew it that she or he is lying then
if we may say so as it is written
:read:
They are all adulterers, as an oven heated by the baker,
who ceaseth from raising after he hath kneaded the dough, until it be leavened.
Hosea 7:4 KJVA



(for the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth;)
proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.
And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them .
For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret.
But all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light:
for whatsoever doth make manifest is light.
Ephesians 5:9‭-‬13 KJVA
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Then you have authority over those writings and God itself.
No, I have authority over nothing or nobody, certainly not over God.
God has authority over everyone and everything.
I just decided to "believe" the Writings of Baha'u'llah are valid.
That gives me no authority.
As a Manifestation of God, Baha'u'llah has all authority because He is a Representative of God.

“The Person of the Manifestation hath ever been the representative and mouthpiece of God. He, in truth, is the Day Spring of God’s most excellent Titles, and the Dawning-Place of His exalted Attributes. If any be set up by His side as peers, if they be regarded as identical with His Person, how can it, then, be maintained that the Divine Being is One and Incomparable, that His Essence is indivisible and peerless? Meditate on that which We have, through the power of truth, revealed unto thee, and be thou of them that comprehend its meaning.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 70
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
No, I have authority over nothing or nobody, certainly not over God.
God has authority over everyone and everything.
I just decided to "believe" the Writings of Baha'u'llah are valid.
That gives me no authority.
It makes you the judge of what you now consider the word of God.
 

Bird123

Well-Known Member
I can speak for myself. I do not have a narrow view just because I have a religion. You are completely biased against religion. Biased people cannot see clearly. They have made up their mind and there is no room to let anything in that could be of value.

I also have beliefs, but the difference is that my beliefs come from a real religion and yours are made up by you. So your religion is a man-made religion as opposed to a religion of God.


I am not against anyone. On the other hand, I am for Truth. If the truth does not match your set of beliefs, that will be an issue you will have to deal with. I will not value Beliefs as if they were the truth. Beliefs just point a direction by which one should search to Discover the Real Truth.
 

Bird123

Well-Known Member
That is not what religion is. Religion comes from God, not from mankind. Baha’u’llah explains the nature of religion:

“And now concerning thy question regarding the nature of religion. Know thou that they who are truly wise have likened the world unto the human temple. As the body of man needeth a garment to clothe it, so the body of mankind must needs be adorned with the mantle of justice and wisdom. Its robe is the Revelation vouchsafed unto it by God. Whenever this robe hath fulfilled its purpose, the Almighty will assuredly renew it. For every age requireth a fresh measure of the light of God. Every Divine Revelation hath been sent down in a manner that befitted the circumstances of the age in which it hath appeared.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 81

I have found that every holy book Understands God. You understand nothing about God because the only way to understand God is from what is revealed in the scriptures.

But you argue everything else you do not agree with, as if you could ever know as much as a Messenger of God who reveals scriptures. God loves us unconditionally but there is a lot more to God than that.

Please do not speak for me. I am not a blind believer. I researched my religion before I joined it and I continue to research it every day, even after 48 years. I do not believe in it blindly.

You are not going to get any Real Answers about God anywhere except from religion. Anything else you conjure up is just an imaginary god because there is no way to know anything about God except from Messengers of God.

What Truth? Where did you get Real Truth, from yourself?

And follow you?

History refutes everything you say. God and God’s system has always depended on Messengers. The world would have completely perished long ago if God had not continually sent Messengers.

You do not know anything about God because there is no way to know anything about God without a Messenger of God and what he reveals. God loves all men but God does not consider all men equal. That would be totally unjust.

“Let no one imagine that by Our assertion that all created things are the signs of the revelation of God is meant that—God forbid—all men, be they good or evil, pious or infidel, are equal in the sight of God.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 187

God cannot be accessed by anyone at all, not even the Messengers. God contacts them and reveals a message, but they cannot access God, how much less could any ordinary human being ever access God. God is completely inaccessible.

“How wondrous is the unity of the Living, the Ever-Abiding God—a unity which is exalted above all limitations, that transcendeth the comprehension of all created things! He hath, from everlasting, dwelt in His inaccessible habitation of holiness and glory, and will unto everlasting continue to be enthroned upon the heights of His independent sovereignty and grandeur. How lofty hath been His incorruptible Essence, how completely independent of the knowledge of all created things, and how immensely exalted will it remain above the praise of all the inhabitants of the heavens and the earth!” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 261-262


All religions will tell you they come from God. How would they ever get followers if they did not convince people of that?

You list beliefs that tell you everything about God can only come through your messengers. You list beliefs of what one can and can not do. I already know none of these beliefs are true. I will not be confined to a box of beliefs when there is so much to Discover outside your box.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Clearly, you do not understand.
Clearly, you do not understand.
God is the Ruler of the universe who created all things. This is God 101 stuff.

“All praise to the unity of God, and all honor to Him, the sovereign Lord, the incomparable and all-glorious Ruler of the universe, Who, out of utter nothingness, hath created the reality of all things, Who, from naught, hath brought into being the most refined and subtle elements of His creation, and Who, rescuing His creatures from the abasement of remoteness and the perils of ultimate extinction, hath received them into His kingdom of incorruptible glory.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 64-65
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
I am not against anyone. On the other hand, I am for Truth. If the truth does not match your set of beliefs, that will be an issue you will have to deal with. I will not value Beliefs as if they were the truth. Beliefs just point a direction by which one should search to Discover the Real Truth.
We can discover our own truths, but humans are fallible so nothing humans can discover on their own is inerrant. As such what we discover is no more than a personal opinion we believe to be true. It cannot be called the Real Truth.

The Real Truth about God comes ONLY from God through the Manifestations of God because they alone get communication from God and they alone are infallible.

This is logic 101 stuff.
 

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
We can discover our own truths, but humans are fallible so nothing humans can discover on their own is inerrant. As such what we discover is no more than a personal opinion we believe to be true. It cannot be called the Real Truth.

The Real Truth about God comes ONLY from God through the Manifestations of God because they alone get communication from God and they alone are infallible.

This is logic 101 stuff.
A Baha'i on another thread said truth is relative. So doesn't that make God's Truth ever changing?
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
All religions will tell you they come from God. How would they ever get followers if they did not convince people of that?
They either came from God or they were made up by man. The evidence indicates they came from God.
You list beliefs that tell you everything about God can only come through your messengers. You list beliefs of what one can and can not do. I already know none of these beliefs are true. I will not be confined to a box of beliefs when there is so much to Discover outside your box.
I already know my beliefs are true because they come from an infallible Manifestation of God.
You are free to make up your own beliefs about God because you have free will.
I am not confined to a box of beliefs. I am free to discover anything I want to do because I have free will.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
A Baha'i on another thread said truth is relative. So doesn't that make God's Truth ever changing?
Only God has All Truth. Truth from God as it is revealed by Manifestations of God to humanity is relative Truth because it is revealed according to what humanity needs and is able to comprehend in any given age. There will always be more Truth from God in every new age because as humanity evolves materially, intellectually and spiritually, humanity needs more Truth and is able to comprehend more Truth.

Some of God's Truth such as social teachings and laws change over time but Spiritual Truth does not change. It is eternal.
 

Bird123

Well-Known Member
We can discover our own truths, but humans are fallible so nothing humans can discover on their own is inerrant. As such what we discover is no more than a personal opinion we believe to be true. It cannot be called the Real Truth.

The Real Truth about God comes ONLY from God through the Manifestations of God because they alone get communication from God and they alone are infallible.

This is logic 101 stuff.


Making mistakes is a part of God's system. More is learned through errors than almost anything else. I think you have said it: I'll never do that again. Did you need a book to tell you that?

The only error I can see is that you believe holy books are sent from God. If God were to write a Holy Book, it would come out much different from anything in the world today.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Making mistakes is a part of God's system. More is learned through errors than almost anything else. I think you have said it: I'll never do that again. Did you need a book to tell you that?
I agree that making mistakes is part of the plan for learning. I made a pretty big mistake today and it could have been a great tragedy. Luckily, after two hours of prayers, it turned out okay, but I cannot even imagine if it hadn't. From now on I will be checking to make sure the front door is closed every time I go out and I will be really careful to never leave it open for one split second... Live and learn.

I do not need a book to tell me what is just common sense, but I like having a book to tell me what I should be seeking to acquire by way of spiritual attributes, since that is all I will be taking with me to the spiritual world after I die. I never would have thought certain things are important as they are had I not read them in the Baha'i Writings. Now I diligently aim for these high ideals. I see them simply as a Guide to right living. It is really no different from what is in the Bible although the Bahai Writings are more straightforward and easier to understand.
The only error I can see is that you believe holy books are sent from God. If God were to write a Holy Book, it would come out much different from anything in the world today.
It would not be any different from the Writings of Baha'u'llah since God did write those.

“Were any of the all-embracing Manifestations of God to declare: “I am God,” He, verily, speaketh the truth, and no doubt attacheth thereto. For it hath been repeatedly demonstrated that through their Revelation, their attributes and names, the Revelation of God, His names and His attributes, are made manifest in the world....... in moments in which these Essences of Being were deep immersed beneath the oceans of ancient and everlasting holiness, or when they soared to the loftiest summits of Divine mysteries, they claimed their utterances to be the Voice of Divinity, the Call of God Himself.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 54-55
 

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
Only God has All Truth. Truth from God as it is revealed by Manifestations of God to humanity is relative Truth because it is revealed according to what humanity needs and is able to comprehend in any given age. There will always be more Truth from God in every new age because as humanity evolves materially, intellectually and spiritually, humanity needs more Truth and is able to comprehend more Truth.

Some of God's Truth such as social teachings and laws change over time but Spiritual Truth does not change. It is eternal.
But the Baha'i Faith also says that all the religions of the past added traditions and misinterpretations into the mix, so they didn't "comprehend" the message. To me, each group or culture had their ideas, or mythology, about spiritual things. Why would the One True God reveal things about there being many gods? Or things about an evil spirit being? Or about reincarnation? Baha'is say none of those are true, yet they are part of other religions... and some of those religions Baha'is say are part of the true progression of religious truth. For me, it seems much more likely that people had a lot to do with developing the concepts about the spiritual world.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Sorry it has taken me so long to get back to this post. I have been writing it in a Word document off and on and I finally finished it and found time to post it.
This maybe the longest post I have ever seen. I don't even know how you got all this to fit in a single post. Regardless; yes you need to show the overwhelmingly mainstream understanding of the bible for the past 2000 years is incorrect. You can't just claim Newton got calculus wrong, you need to show his errors.
Believe me, it was not easy getting all that into one post!I had to pare it down several times before it was under the maximum length. Even though I eliminated a lot of this post, it was still too long for one post, so I am going to divide it into two posts.

How do you think I can show that the overwhelmingly mainstream understanding of the bible for the past 2000 years is incorrect in one post? The best I can do is whack away at it, one idea at a time.
No, the God you describe is less capable than the one I believe in. What you described is definitely not the God of the bible. My God can and did walk the earth as both a spirit and in the flesh.
It has nothing to do with capability. Just because God is “capable” of doing something does not mean God has to do it. That is illogical.

But in a certain sense, God did walk the earth, since Jesus was a Manifestation of God, a perfect mirror image of God, just not the Essence of God in the flesh.
I obviously do not find the writing of the Baha'i authoritative so posting them isn't very persuasive. I do believe in the bible so you have got to provide some reason to think the bible got it wrong.
Unfortunately, I do not know the Bible well enough to find the best verses that would say what I am trying to say. I only know a few verses I have collected. Let’s just take this one verse, which says exactly what I want to say, in all the translations below:

John 1:18

CEB No one has ever seen God. God the only Son, who is at the Father’s side, has made God known.

NASB No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him.

NCV No one has ever seen God. But God the only Son is very close to the Father, and he has shown us what God is like.

NKJV No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him.

NLV The much-loved Son is beside the Father. No man has ever seen God. But Christ has made God known to us.

RSV No one has ever seen God; the only Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, he has made him known.

WE No one has ever seen God. But his only Son is very near to his Father's heart. He has told us plainly about God.

Jesus did all of the following: Made God known, explained God, showed us what God is like, declared God, made God known to us, told us plainly about God.

There are some other translations that say Jesus is God, but they make no sense:

NET No one has ever seen God. The only one, himself God, who is in closest fellowship with the Father, has made God known.

NIV No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known.

NLT No one has ever seen God. But the unique One, who is himself God, is near to the Father’s heart. He has revealed God to us.

We have seen Jesus so Jesus cannot be God.
How can God be in fellowship with Himself?
How can God be in a relationship with Himself?
How can God be near and dear to His own heart?
What, that verse justifies my own world view not yours? It specifically states that God became flesh which is what I have been saying.
No, that verse does not say that the Fullness of God became flesh. It says that God was manifested in the flesh. The question we have to ask is: what was manifested?

The Christian equivalent to the Bahá'í concept of Manifestation is the concept of incarnation. The word to incarnate means 'to embody in flesh or 'to assume, or exist in, a bodily (esp. a human) form (Oxford English Dictionary). From a Bahá'í point of view, the important question regarding the subject of incarnation is, what does Jesus incarnate? Bahá'ís can certainly say that Jesus incarnated Gods attributes, in the sense that in Jesus, Gods attributes were perfectly reflected and expressed.[4] The Bahá'í scriptures, however, reject the belief that the ineffable essence of the Divinity was ever perfectly and completely contained in a single human body, because the Bahá'í scriptures emphasize the omnipresence and transcendence of the essence of God…..
Jesus Christ in the Bahá'í Writings
There is a big difference between the Baha'i and Christians. Both Christians and the Baha'i hold the bible to be authoritative but Christians do not hold the writings of the Baha'i to be authoritative. So what does the bible say?

Mark 2:7
"Why does this man speak that way? He is blaspheming; who can forgive sins but God alone?"

Only God can forgive sins, Jesus forgave sins, Jesus is God.
Mark 2:6-10 But there was certain of the scribes sitting there, and reasoning in their hearts, Why doth this man thus speak blasphemies? who can forgive sins but God only? And immediately when Jesus perceived in his spirit that they so reasoned within themselves, he said unto them, Why reason ye these things in your hearts? Whether is it easier to say to the sick of the palsy, Thy sins be forgiven thee; or to say, Arise, and take up thy bed, and walk? But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins, (he saith to the sick of the palsy,)

Jesus did not say what is in Mark 2:7. The scribes said that. Then Jesus said in Mark 2:10 “But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins, (he saith to the sick of the palsy,).” So Jesus was saying that He, the Son of man, had the power to forgive sins. That concurs exactly with what Baha’u’llah wrote. In the passage below Baha’u’llah is saying that God’s chosen ones (Manifestations of God) have the power to forgive sins. I post this again only because it is from the Bible and it is necessary for me to make my point.

“It is also recorded in the Gospel according to St. Luke, that on a certain day Jesus passed by a Jew who was sick of the palsy, and lay upon a couch. When the Jew saw Him, he recognized Him, and cried out for His help. Jesus said unto him: “Arise from thy bed; thy sins are forgiven thee.” Certain of the Jews, standing by, protested saying: “Who can forgive sins, but God alone?” And immediately He perceived their thoughts, Jesus answering said unto them: “Whether is it easier to say to the sick of the palsy, arise, and take up thy bed, and walk; or to say, thy sins are forgiven thee? that ye may know that the Son of Man hath power on earth to forgive sins.”7 This is the real sovereignty, and such is the power of God’s chosen Ones!” The Kitáb-i-Íqán, pp. 133-134
Why do you post Baha'i beliefs as a Christian does not accept them. However we both accept the bible, so that is what you should post from. Jesus can't always have existed and yet be born. Jesus was a divine spirit clothed in flesh.
Briefly, Jesus has a Soul and a Body. The Soul of Jesus can have always existed because it was in the spiritual world, which has always existed, since it is without beginning or end. But we know that the Body of Jesus was born of Mary so it cannot have always existed.

I do not know what you mean when you say that Jesus was a divine spirit clothed in flesh.
Even miracles performed by men are done so through the power of God. Jesus is the only being other than the father who performed miracles by their own authority. Even angels must depend on God to perform miracles.
That is absolutely true. Jesus was able to perform miracles because He had the Power of God. Baha’u’llah also performed miracles because He had the Power of God. Angels can perform miracles because they have the Power of God.

(Continued on next post...)
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
What I posted is what the bible says, it's the word of God not mere men. You can't (or shouldn't) quote the bible when it suits you and reject it when it is inconvenient. The entire bible must be allowed to speak. This is not an issue of what the bible means it is simply what the bible says.
As I pointed out above, the Bible says different things in different translations, so what are we to do?
This verse also supports my claim.

Keep in mind that God is one being composed of three divine persons - the trinity.
No, God is not composed of three divine persons; God is One. The Trinity is not in the Bible. You well know that not all Christians believe in the Trinity and they are all reading the same Bible. How do you explain that?
It says it again here. It is saying that no one has seen God except in the form of the divine son.
I cannot disagree with that. Jesus the Son had a divine nature. But that is not the same thing as saying Jesus was God, or that God became Jesus in the flesh. God’s Attributes were perfectly manifested in Jesus, but God’s Essence cannot be manifested to anyone, not even to Jesus. It forever remains hidden from anyone except God. Thus God is separate from Jesus because God is forever one and alone, sanctified above corporeal existence, although God is one with Jesus because both share the same Spirit.

John 10:30 I and my Father are one.

Then in John 10:36-37, Jesus says “Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God? If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not.”

Jesus is desperately trying to convince the Jews that He is not claiming to be God; He says He is the Son of God.

Jesus manifested God and Jesus was also a Mediator between God and man, as is expressed in this verse:

1Timothy 2:5 For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,

Notice that the verse says “and” which is differentiating God from Jesus.
I don't understand why you keep posting verses that prove my own arguments instead of yours. It specifically says that Jesus is God.
That translation says that but hardly any of the many translations say that Jesus is God (see above short list).
Instead of telling me what you believe you should be telling me why what you believe is true.
I believe it is true because that is what the Baha’i Faith teaches, and the Revelation of Baha’u’llah supersedes any previous revelations from God, such as the Bible. However, it does not contradict the Bible because God’s Word cannot contradict itself. Social teachings and laws and the message of God change from age to age, but the spiritual truths, such as the nature of a Manifestation of God, does not change. So Jesus has always been who Jesus was, a Manifestation of God, even though Christians do not understand that since they interpret the same verses to mean Jesus was God incarnate, since that is what was decided upon at Councils such as Nicaea and it became Church doctrine.
The bible specifically says that God (the word or logos) did take on flesh and dwell with us.

New International Version
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
New Living Translation

So the Word became human and made his home among us. He was full of unfailing love and faithfulness. And we have seen his glory, the glory of the Father's one and only Son.
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Then when God sent Jesus, Jesus was “manifested” in the flesh, and the Word that was God and was with God became flesh and dwelt among us. That does not mean that God became flesh, but rather that the Attributes of God were manifested in Jesus who came in the flesh and revealed God to humanity.

As Abdu’l-Baha wrote: “For the Word does not signify the body of Christ, no, but the divine perfections manifested in Him.” Abdu'l-Baha, Some Answered Questions, p. 206

Jesus was the perfect revelation of God in the flesh because he who has seen Jesus in the flesh has seen the all the Attributes of the Father. As Baha’u’llah wrote:

“Were any of the all-embracing Manifestations of God to declare: “I am God,” He, verily, speaketh the truth, and no doubt attacheth thereto. For it hath been repeatedly demonstrated that through their Revelation, their attributes and names, the Revelation of God, His names and His attributes, are made manifest in the world.......” Gleanings, p. 54

But nobody has ever seen the Essence of the Father, which is why Jesus could not be FULLY GOD. That is why Jesus said: John 1:18 “No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.” Jesus meant that no man has seen the Essence of God because God cannot incarnate His Essence and reveal it to man, which is what Baha’u’llah also said in this passage;

“Know thou of a certainty that the Unseen can in no wise incarnate His Essence and reveal it unto men. He is, and hath ever been, immensely exalted beyond all that can either be recounted or perceived.” Gleanings, p. 49
This may be the biggest post I have ever seen. It is too much information to respond to sufficiently so let’s take things one at a time so we can fully investigate them.

Let’s start with just one set of verses. Once we have discussed them fully then we can move on. Let’s see if God can become flesh.

New International Version
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

So we can see from this verse that the "word" (or logos) was God.

New International Version
The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

Now we can see from this verse that the word (logos or God) became flesh and dwelt with us.

These two verses specifically claim that God came to Earth and dwelt with us in the flesh.
I think I covered that point above. In brief, God manifested His Attributes on earth in Jesus, but the Essence of God did not become flesh.
A couple of other things to keep in mind.
The trinity - God is one being composed of three persons.
I think I touched on that above but we can go over that more later if you want to.
Also, both the Baha’i and Christians consider the bible as authoritative but Christian do not believe the writing so the Baha’i are authoritative so that means only the bible is common ground between us. The Baha’i’s writings are not accepted by Christians so quoting from them is just not persuasive.
If I quote the Baha’i Writings, that is just to explain what I believe about the subject at hand. I will try to make any quotes brief.
So let’s discuss the verses above, then once done we can move on to other issues. Is this acceptable to you, posting as much stuff as you did all at once does not allow us to spend much time on any one part. So what do you think the verses I posted mean?
I think I explained that above. Let me know if you have any questions.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
But the Baha'i Faith also says that all the religions of the past added traditions and misinterpretations into the mix, so they didn't "comprehend" the message. To me, each group or culture had their ideas, or mythology, about spiritual things. Why would the One True God reveal things about there being many gods? Or things about an evil spirit being? Or about reincarnation? Baha'is say none of those are true, yet they are part of other religions... and some of those religions Baha'is say are part of the true progression of religious truth. For me, it seems much more likely that people had a lot to do with developing the concepts about the spiritual world.
First of all, we do not have any original scriptures from any of these older religions written by the Prophet who is behind the religion, so we cannot really know what was said. Secondly, whatever was written got changed over time by human meddling. That is why Baha'u'llah said we should disregard these older religions and turn towards Him.

“This is the Day when the loved ones of God should keep their eyes directed towards His Manifestation, and fasten them upon whatsoever that Manifestation may be pleased to reveal. Certain traditions of bygone ages rest on no foundations whatever, while the notions entertained by past generations, and which they have recorded in their books, have, for the most part, been influenced by the desires of a corrupt inclination. Thou dost witness how most of the commentaries and interpretations of the words of God, now current amongst men, are devoid of truth. Their falsity hath, in some cases, been exposed when the intervening veils were rent asunder. They themselves have acknowledged their failure in apprehending the meaning of any of the words of God.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 171-172
 

Podo

Member
Is there any reason to think that God, if God exists, would want 100% of people in the world to believe in Him?

If God wanted everyone to believe in Him, what do you think God would do in order to accomplish that?

Do you think that God can show up on earth? If so, how would God do that?

If a singular god existed, it would either desire everyone's worship and therefore be imperfect by virtue of simply having "wants." Or, it would not care if we worshiped it, thus meaning that there is no point in doing so.

If it wanted everyone to believe it in, but couldn't force it, then it was not all-powerful and does not deserve my worship. If it could make everyone worship it and chose not to, then it is sadistic and not worth my worship. If it just sorta half-assedly attempts to convince people to worship it via cryptic writings that get corrupted by humans over the centuries, then it's pretty bad at its job.

No, because if it existed and IF it could manifest, it would have done so.
 
Top