Do you believe that Jesus is the Word?

[Sleeppy]

This doesn't make sense, as the the incarnation clearly does not mean everything. Merely because a word is used that is used elsewhere does not mean that you use a non-contextual understanding for it's meaning.

It doesn't make any sense? Or you don't care to understand what is evident? You have to be more specific.

Exactly which of my statements is false?

 

[Desert Snake]

That’s the big question, how god connects with humans. I don’t believe that God is so limited that it can only connect via one single human that lived two thousand years ago. The logos dwelling with man is because we are in gods image and because of wisdom/logos bestowed in the garden. God is in the hearts of mankind.

To take the gospels rather literally is a very crude way of looking at how God can “become” man as if God has to physically come down and impregnate a woman to create a half man half god. The power of God is within everything, within our atoms lie the power of the sun. Jesus can be seen as a way to reach God, a path, a way, the gate to reach “Our Father”.

We note some things, here.

Jesus says that He is the only way to reach , or rather know, the father. In other words there is no other path.
Jesus says to believe in Him, or face the wrath of God, which means, Elohim, here. Jesus is Elohim, so we know that the judgement is a personal one, not merely Jesus interceding on our behalf.

Hennce, Jesus is THE way, and the ONLY way to avoid the wrath of God, Elohim, by believing, in Him.

We note that to separate Jesus from the father, in more than name, not only do the deific names not make sense, but their inference, as well.

 

[idav]

We note some things, here.

Jesus says that He is the only way to reach , or rather know, the father. In other words there is no other path.
Jesus says to believe in Him, or face the wrath of God, which means, Elohim, here. Jesus is Elohim, so we know that the judgement is a personal one, not merely Jesus interceding on our behalf.

Hennce, Jesus is THE way, and the ONLY way to avoid the wrath of God, Elohim, by believing, in Him.

We note that to separate Jesus from the father, in more than name, not only do the deific names not make sense, but their inference, as well.

Jesus made a clear distinction between him and the father. He didn’t say he is the father he said the “father is within me”. Saying that Jesus is the only true religion is another matter all together but to me the saying “I am the way” means he is to be emulated and doesn’t mean he is a literal gate. It’s a way to righteous but we each have our own path. IMO it doesn’t mean that God is so limited that it can only reach humans via a literal son. You can tell it’s all figurative since Jesus says we will all be born again as “sons of God”, same as it says in the Tanakh where Jesus quoted from when Pharisees accused him of claiming he was The God.

 

[QuestioningMind]

The question is, do you believe that Jesus is the Word?


If so, how is Jesus not God?

After reading through all of the replies to this OP all I can conclude is that the God of the bible is a terrible communicator. Even those who believe that the bible is the Word of God can't agree on what He was attempting to convey. They use the exact same quotes and claim that the quotes have a completely contrary meanings. I'd expect better from an all powerful creator God, which suggests that maybe the entire book was actually created by fallible human beings.

 

[Desert Snake]

Jesus made a clear distinction between him and the farther.

John 1:1
The Godhood is all one God.

He didn’t say he is the father he said the “father is within me”.

Jesus is teaching the nature of the Godhood, Mark 12:29
Jesus is God, Elohim, and is the Lord, in human form.

Saying that Jesus is the only true religion is another matter all together but to me the saying “I am the way” means he is to be emulated and doesn’t mean he is a literal gate.

That is not what He teaches, however. Note that if that was what He taught, no one would make into Heaven, everyone would face Hell, and you would have a deity who is basically saying that you cannot achieve salvation. /since no one is perfect.

It’s a way to righteous but we each have our own path. IMO it doesn’t mean that God is so limited that it can only reach humans via a literal son.

That isn't my belief, and neither does Jesus teach that.

You can tell it’s all figurative since Jesus says we will all be born again as “sons of God”, same as it says in the Tanakh where Jesus quoted from when Pharisees accused him of claiming he was The God.

They accused Jesus of saying that, because He did say that. The disciples understood that, and hence why they worshipped Him, in the first place.

 

[idav]

They accused Jesus of saying that, because He did say that. The disciples understood that, and hence why they worshipped Him, in the first place.

If that’s what he meant then there was no reason to argue and quote a script that says “we are ALL sons of the most high”.

 

[WalterTrull]

After reading through all of the replies to this OP all I can conclude is that the God of the bible is a terrible communicator. Even those who believe that the bible is the Word of God can't agree on what He was attempting to convey. They use the exact same quotes and claim that the quotes have a completely contrary meanings. I'd expect better from an all powerful creator God, which suggests that maybe the entire book was actually created by fallible human beings.

No, no, no... I have just been informed that it's just wrong teaching. Whoda guessed?

 

[stvdv]

Bird is the word.

Only when it's a bird from the parrot family

 

[Desert Snake]

If that’s what he meant then there was no reason to argue and quote a script that says “we are ALL sons of the most high”.

No, 'we' are all sons of the Most High. Jesus is The Son, a deific Son, and as such, is apart from others.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

The question is, do you believe that Jesus is the Word?

I thought it was the bird (NOOOOOO! MUST NOT START SINGING!) LOL.

Seriously, only in a certain sense. Can't find the right words for it.

If so, how is Jesus not God?

Are the things I say me?

I believe that 'word', means the Creator aspect.

In that case, no. I see no Jesus in Genesis. It's hard enough trying to piece together Who the Creator is because pre-monotheism, El and Yahweh both had stakes in the claim.

And you believe this because...

It's at most just as silly as John making up what Genesis meant.

John 17:5

Jesus pre-exists His human incarnation, and puts Himself with the Father

John 17:11

Jesus says that He and the Father are one, means Godhood

John 17:16

More of equating His deific nature in the Godhood

John 17:21

Jesus literally equates His oneness with the Father, and separates Himself from people, ie He is God, He is Deific, and He is one with the Father.

Note that you only have John saying this? The bible doesn't agree with him.

Jesus says that He is the only way to reach , or rather know, the father. In other words there is no other path.

And John is lying, because plenty of people knew and even hung out with God prior to Jesus being born.

Note that if that was what He taught, no one would make into Heaven, everyone would face Hell,

Jesus should also be in hell. He said anyone who called people fools will burn in hell. He called people fools. He said people are judged by how we judge others. Based on his own judgments, he's toast.

The disciples understood that, and hence why they worshipped Him, in the first place.

The bible frequently shows Jesus griping that the apostles don't understand him.

 

[stvdv]

The question is, do you believe that Jesus is the Word?
If so, how is Jesus not God?

I believe:
Jesus == God
God <> Jesus

 

[WalterTrull]

I believe:
Jesus == God
God <> Jesus

'fraid I don't quite follow that math.

 

[wizanda]

He says none, shall come to the father, except through Him.

Only in the fake Gospel of John again...

In the other Gospels he points out Judaism didn't know his father, which is the God Most High, as they no longer accepted these concepts.

God is Elohim

El is God; Elohim is plural.

Jesus says to believe in Him, or face the wrath of God

Only in the fake Gospel of John again...

In the Synoptic Gospels Yeshua says by doing good works following him in action, words, and character, that is sufficient...

Plus that many will come saying "didn't we do this in your name", and the master will say, "depart from me, i do not know you".

Whereas we're told 11 times in the Gospel of John to believe in his name.

In my opinion.

 

[stvdv]

I believe:
Jesus == God
God <> Jesus

'fraid I don't quite follow that math.

It's from advaita [don't ask me to explain this one; that's beyond my "explain-grade"]

GOD == Jesus [would limit God to only Jesus, which is not true according to advaita IMHO]
XXX == GOD [always correct because advaita says "only God exists" or "only consciousness exists"] IMHO
YYY == GOD [just don't put GOD before the "==" sign]

WalterTrull == GOD [oke]
GOD == WalterTrull [not oke, although you might like it better]

 

[viole]

I believe that 'word', means the Creator aspect. In the New Testament, it is said, that creation is through Jesus, and by Jesus. This would seem to mean that Jesus is part of that Creator aspect.

In John 1:14
The text reads that the Word became flesh, with subsequent description.

So, that Word is the creator aspect of something like mosquitos? Or Ebola viruses? Or Mariah Carey?

Must be. These things do not look like coming from pure chance. How could the random movement of particles create something like parasitic wasps or children's eyeball eating worms? That's absurd. These things cry for an intelligent designer.

Well, who knows if that amazing designer was Jesus. But if yes, then thanks Jesus, I guess.

Ciao

- viole

 

[Desert Snake]

Only in the fake Gospel of John again...

In the other Gospels he points out Judaism didn't know his father, which is the God Most High, as they no longer accepted these concepts.

El is God; Elohim is plural.

Elohim includes the personal names.

Only in the fake Gospel of John again...

In the Synoptic Gospels Yeshua says by doing good works following him in action, words, and character, that is sufficient...

Your understanding is worldly, and flawed.

Plus that many will come saying "didn't we do this in your name", and the master will say, "depart from me, i do not know you".

Whereas we're told 11 times in the Gospel of John to believe in his name.

In my opinion.

Believe in His name, has more than meaning, but contextual to the argument, here, His name is Lord, or Lord with us. JHVH with us. His name is God. So of course we are supposed to believe in His name, and believe through His name, and believe that His name is 'real', ie that Jesus is God.

 

[Looncall]

I believe Jesus is the Word and Jesus is God.

What do you mean by "the Word"? This looks like Mumbo-Jumbo to me.

 

[viole]

Elohim includes the personal names.



Your understanding is worldly, and flawed.




Believe in His name, has more than meaning, but contextual to the argument, here, His name is Lord, or Lord with us. His name is God. So of course we are supposed to believe in His name, and believe through His name, and believe that His name is 'real', ie that Jesus is God.

SO, what is His name? Elohim? Lord? God? Jesus? JHVH? I hear someone saying it is G-d, however you pronounce that (there seems to be a divine allergy for vowels, for some reason).

So, maybe He is not the Word. He is the Wrd. Who can say?

Ciao

- viole

 

[viole]

What do you mean by "the Word"? This looks like Mumbo-Jumbo to me.

It is a deepity. really. I would not take that too seriously.

Ciao

- viole

 

[viole]

I believe:
Jesus == God
God <> Jesus

I agree.

Ciao

- viole