Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I do not know the Genesis account, I only very generally know what Adam and Eve story was supposed to mean to Christians, regarding the Fall and original sin. I do not believe the Adam and Eve story mans that. Here is one possible meaning: 30: ADAM AND EVEIt makes little sense to me that the Creator would put intelligent life on other planets or "worlds" without first ironing out the 'kinks' (possible abuses) in the administration of free will in this one....which as we know from the Genesis account, free will was not entirely "free". It was free to be expressed but only within the boundaries set by the Creator. This was the catalyst for satan's challenge in Eden. They had a choice as to how to drive their own free will....and they each chose badly, but for different reasons. What can we learn from them and all the other Bible examples? Why do we think those examples are in there?
Baha’is do not believe in original sin, that sin was inherited from Adam and Eve. We believe that man was born good but has a lower material nature that has the propensity to sin. In brief, Baha’is believe that the meaning of the serpent in the Adam and Eve story is attachment to the human world, or the material world, as opposed to God and the spiritual world. When Adam was born and entered the human world, He came out from the paradise of freedom and fell into the world of bondage. From the spiritual world, in the height of purity and absolute goodness, He entered into the world of good and evil... This attachment to the human world, which is sin, was inherited by the descendants of Adam, and is the serpent which is always in our midst and continues and endures... It is because of this attachment that men have been deprived of essential spirituality and their exalted position.
Whys do you believe heaven is for if not for the afterlife (eternal life)? In other words, if humans and animals are going to live eternally on earth in resurrected bodies what goes on in heaven?Since animals are an integral part of human life and experience, they will always be a part of our existence to enhance it and to add another element of love. But since animals are not mentioned as part of a life in heaven, we can assume that the future for humans will be entirely physical.
Animals were created first, so they belonged to this earth long before we came along. God designed us as their caretakers, so it will be an eternal arrangement.
We have free will here and we suffer and learn from our experiences and our mistakes and thereby develop our character, grow spiritual arms and legs so to speak. Our character which is the result of choices we have made is all we will need in a purely spiritual world, because that is all that we are, the sum total of our personality.Can you tell me why God would use a physical existence to train us for life in a spiritual realm? Do we have any reference to angels being former humans so that their lives were trained by a life here?
“Death is regarded as the shedding away of the physical frame but no more, the real part of the person is the soul, which is indestructible. In this there is nothing new, but the Bahá’í thought added another dimension to this idea. The soul is the sum total of the personality it is the person himself; the physical body is pure matter with no real identity. The person, having left his material side behind, remains the same person, and he continues the life he conducted in the physical world. His heaven therefore is the continuation of the pure life that he conducted in the physical world, and his hell is the continuation of the immoral life, which he conducted on earth. The effort to come nearer to God in the physical world continues with coming near God in the heaven of the mystical paradise. Remoteness from God in the physical life means remoteness in the world to come. Or, in the words of Bahá’u’lláh, Heaven is reunion with the Manifestation of God in the Abhā Kingdom, and hell is remaining with oneself. Heaven and Hell exist everywhere in this world as well as in the world to come. The difference between the two is the difference between the state of perfection achieved leading to the nearness of God here and hereafter, and the state of imperfection, which is caused by the failure to attain to virtue and the falling away from God.
The challenge of life in this world continues in the world of spiritual reality as well, only that in the latter the meeting of this challenge is easier because the person is free from physical needs.”
From: Death and Dying in the Bahá'í Faith
Obviously your beliefs differ from mine. Just because the ancient Jews believed something I see no reason why people continue to believe it... We are no longer living in ancient times.According to the book of Job, the angels were spectators to the creation of the material universe. (Job 38:4, 7) Angels are intensely interested in what God is doing here on this earth...anxious to see the outcome. (1 Peter 1:10-12) This is NOT a training ground for heaven and never was. The ancient Jews had no notion of going to heaven and no belief in any kind of afterlife except by a physical resurrection back to this earth under the Messiah's kingdom.
However, according to my beliefs, there are angels who are interested in what humans are doing down here on earth and is aiding them in doing God’s work:
“Let not your hearts be perturbed, O people, when the glory of My Presence is withdrawn, and the ocean of My utterance is stilled. In My presence amongst you there is a wisdom, and in My absence there is yet another, inscrutable to all but God, the Incomparable, the All-Knowing. Verily, We behold you from Our realm of glory, and shall aid whosoever will arise for the triumph of Our Cause with the hosts of the Concourse on high and a company of Our favored angels.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 140
Hell in the Baha’i Writings is distance from God, and when we turn away from God’s Manifestation for this day that is distancing ourselves from God.... So what we believe that John means by “all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,” is tied in with what Baha’u’llah wrote below “The verses of God have been revealed, and yet they have turned away from them. His proof hath been manifested, and yet they are unaware of it.” In so doing they distance themselves from God: “They hasten forward to Hell Fire, and mistake it for light.”Huh? Where do these ideas come from? Hell in the Bible is the grave...not some place for bad people to go. It is nothing more sinister than a restful place to sleep until the promised resurrection. (John 5:28-29) It is sleep with no conscious activity at all. (Ecclesiastes 9:5, 10) Everyone goes there.
John 5:28-29 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
Is really the same thing as the following but the grave is for those who are spiritually dead, not physically dead...
“Say: The heavens have been folded together, and the earth is held within His grasp, and the corrupt doers have been held by their forelock, and still they understand not. They drink of the tainted water, and know it not. Say: The shout hath been raised, and the people have come forth from their graves, and arising, are gazing around them. Some have made haste to attain the court of the God of Mercy, others have fallen down on their faces in the fire of Hell, while still others are lost in bewilderment. The verses of God have been revealed, and yet they have turned away from them. His proof hath been manifested, and yet they are unaware of it. And when they behold the face of the All-Merciful, their own faces are saddened, while they are disporting themselves. They hasten forward to Hell Fire, and mistake it for light. Far from God be what they fondly imagine! Say: Whether ye rejoice or whether ye burst for fury, the heavens are cleft asunder, and God hath come down, invested with radiant sovereignty. All created things are heard exclaiming: “The Kingdom is God’s, the Almighty, the All-Knowing, the All-Wise.”” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 41-42
(Continued on next post)