“God loves you anyway” – does He really?

[ThePainefulTruth]

Over the years I’ve heard a number of religious personalities from different so called Christian religions say that God loves everyone, He loves people no matter what. The last time I heard that was very recently.


But from a Christian perspective, it doesn’t make any sense. Christians base their belief in the Bible, and the Bible contains a number of laws and principles that God himself requires people to follow. If it wasn’t important how people behave, He wouldn’t have bothered in the first place.

Nice post. But you're using logic. By their "logic", God loves people who burn in eternal hellfire.

One can talk about forgiveness, which is mentioned frequently in the Bible, but forgiveness applies when people repent and stop doing whatever they were doing wrong. If someone acts against God’s principles, apologizes and then goes back to doing the same thing, would it make any sense for God to overlook their behavior and just love them anyway?

According to what I’ve learned in the Bible, I don’t think so.

As you say, someone has to genuinely repent in order to earn forgiveness or salvation, and the first one who must forgive us is our honest selves. If we're not genuine, we're the first to know.

Christians all the time claim that we must love and forgive others, no repentance required. You don't even ask for it. And look at what Paul said about repentance, only faith in Jesus is necessary, that we don't even need to try to be good.


"But didn’t he earn his right to heaven by all the good things he did? No, for being saved is a gift; if a person could earn it by being good, then it wouldn’t be free—but it is! It is given to those who do not work for it. For God declares sinners to be good in his sight if they have faith in Christ to save them from God’s wrath." --- Romans 4:4 (Living)

You could, for all intents and purposes, call this spiritual welfare, and I think multi-generational welfare recipients actually do think this way, if you want to call it thinking. More like emoting. I think you actually summed it up very nicely:

"I understand that from the perspective of people who don’t like to obey anything except their own whims it must be cool to belong to that kind of religion. The ideology of “do whatever you feel like and God will love you anyway” makes things easier, doesn’t it?"

They believe whatever justifies wherever their emotions lead them. They don't believe in anything but that their ego is god.

 

[ThePainefulTruth]

BTW, I don't believe God has a gender, reproduction, sexual or otherwise, not required. When a pronoun is required, I call God an "It"--no offense to anyone, including It, intended.

 

[savagewind]

God can be spoken of with no pronoun.

Instead of saying, God has given us his laws to obey, you can say, God has given us God's laws to obey.

 

[dfnj]

we are responsible for our actions and based on our actions we will live in the afterlife. hitler won't have a happy afterlife, his own lifetime was that of misery, so he is going to hell. people forget that our time on earth is limited and not more important than our afterlife.

I don't think so. I think God will use his infinite powers of forgiveness to forgive Hitler. Just because you have hate in your heart for revenge against Hitler doesn't mean God has hate in His heart. I think it is a mistake to think there is justice in the afterlife. If we want justice, we have to seek it now with secular laws. Man is responsible for his own messes.

 

[dfnj]

BTW, I don't believe God has a gender, reproduction, sexual or otherwise, not required. When a pronoun is required, I call God an "It"--no offense to anyone, including It, intended.

I believe I read once the Coptic word for God is gender neutral. But obviously, an omnipotent God can be all things at once. That is what is means to be omnipotent. God has no limitations so God can be every gender and no gender all at the same time. God can be an anthropomorphic type God as well as pantheistic type God all at the same time.

 

[savagewind]

I don't think so. I think God will use his infinite powers of forgiveness to forgive Hitler. Just because you have hate in your hate for revenge against Hitler doesn't mean God has hate in His heart. I think it is a mistake to think there is justice in the afterlife. If we want justice, we have to seek it now with secular laws. Man is responsible for his own messes.

I think that people like Hitler must change into a different person to be able to exist in the dominion of God so to say, God forgives people like that who have zero respect for life, is nonsense, imo.

 

[dfnj]

So I think it's a fact that freedom and civilization itself is built on love, mercy, wisdom, and the power of those three things. I realize some people are beyond mercy. But clear lines of justice and compassion must be defended. After all what do we all want for ourselves? We want safety, and peace, love and to contribute, or perhaps many just want power, control, and pleasure, and renowned reputations. I think the moral push and pull will always be there. And the fight for right and what's good is always more than worth it.

All find and good but what does God want?

 

[savagewind]

All find and good but what does God want?

Peace.

 

[dfnj]

I think that people like Hitler must change into a different person to be able to exist in the dominion of God so to say, God forgives people like that who have zero respect for life, is nonsense, imo.

What makes you think after you die you can still be disrespected? Do you think Hitler is going to continue to murder people already in Heaven? That is nonsense. People in Heaven are not going to have community like you are thinking in my opinion. People in Heaven will be too busy experiencing eternal heavenly bliss to really care about anything. So what difference does it make if God forgives Hitler and he gets to bath the pool of bliss. Why would you care one way or the another?

Everyone thinks they are a good person. I imagine Hitler thought he was a good person too.

 

[dfnj]

Peace.

Lol! Unless it's the Middle East then He wants us to bomb the living Shiite out the Arabs!

How do you know God want "Peace". Is He talking to you right now?

 

[savagewind]

What makes you think after you die you can still be disrespected? Do you think Hitler is going to continue to murder people already in Heaven? That is nonsense. People in Heaven are not going to have community like you are thinking in my opinion. People in Heaven will be too busy experiencing eternal heavenly bliss to really care about anything. So what difference does it make if God forgives Hitler and he gets to bath the pool of bliss. Why would you care one way or the another?

Everyone thinks they are a good person. I imagine Hitler thought he was a good person too.

I would not be able to be happy anywhere if it came to my attention what a terrible monster I was and that I had ruined the Earthly life of anyone.

 

[savagewind]

Lol! Unless it's the Middle East then He wants us to bomb the living Shiite out the Arabs!

How do you know God want "Peace". Is He talking to you right now?

You are talking to me right now and you are not God. Obviously.

 

[osgart]

Lol! Unless it's the Middle East then He wants us to bomb the living Shiite out the Arabs!

How do you know God want "Peace". Is He talking to you right now?

Is God a false standard used to coerce someone into a way of life?

Or is there a reality which is unmistakably God?

Or perhaps God means that which is perfect in all ways? And humans go about interpreting what that perfection is, and they end up with only their own sense of perfection.

Is there a knowable standard of ideal authority, and is that God?

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

I do not doubt that you are just thirty.

And yet another one. What the hell does that mean, eh? I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt to explain such a vague (yet probably condescending) comment.

God is not jealous of anyone else.

Then why did he say that he is a jealous god? You can't be jealous of yourself - it doesn't work like that. That's not what jealousy means.

You also only believe that your god is the source of all life. For all you know we're made by Odin, or Zeus, Род, Prometheus, Isis, or any number of other deities that are credited with the creation of humankind.

I didn't even say that God protects God's children. Did I?

No, you just said that when he's described as jealous that it actually means "protective", and then you went on with examples and metaphors of you being "jealous" of your children. As well as examples related to your god about "someone taking children". Et cetera, et cetera. It doesn't take a grade-schooler to connect those dots.

Is tutoring an abusive profession, in your opinion? How about the job of a life coach, is that evil? Is to trust in medicine stupid? How about special diets? Dumb?

Actually, it is funny. You are making me laugh.

You're avoiding the issue. "God knows what's best for us" do you honestly not hear how that sounds? Let me lay this out for you, and you just check off which ones fit the bill. Here are 21 indications of an emotionally abusive relationship:

1. Humiliating or embarrassing you. (The entire Book of Exodus)
2. Constant put-downs.
3. Hypercriticism.
4. Refusing to communicate.
5. Ignoring or excluding you.
6. Extramarital affairs.
7. Provocative behavior with opposite sex.
8. Use of sarcasm and unpleasant tone of voice.
9. Unreasonable jealousy.
10. Extreme moodiness.
11. Mean jokes or constantly making fun of you.
12. Saying “I love you but…”
13. Saying things like “If you don’t _____, I will_____.” (The Ten Commandments, anyone?)
14. Domination and control. (The whole bloody book)
15. Withdrawal of affection.
16. Guilt trips.
17. Making everything your fault. (Adam and Eve)
18. Isolating you from friends and family.
19. Using money to control.
20. Constant calling or texting when you are not with him/her.
21. Threatening to commit suicide if you leave.

 

[savagewind]

And yet another one. What the hell does that mean, eh?

I think that with age comes listening skill.

I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt to explain such a vague (yet probably condescending) comment.

You got that right.

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

Obviously age does not grant such a virtue. I'm done with you too, savage.

 

[savagewind]

Obviously age does not grant such a virtue. I'm done with you too, savage.

Because you believe an ancient word has the modern meaning that you decide upon. Is that not called not listening?

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

Because you believe an ancient word has the modern meaning that you decide upon.

You think that I'm deciding what jealousy means? Here, let me also lay out the etymology of "jealous".

jealous (adj.)

c. 1200, gelus, later jelus, "possessive and suspicious," originally in the context of sexuality or romance (in any context from late 14c.), from Old French jalos/gelos "keen, zealous; avaricious; jealous" (12c., Modern French jaloux), from Late Latin zelosus, from zelus "zeal," from Greek zelos, which sometimes meant "jealousy," but more often was used in a good sense ("emulation, rivalry, zeal"), from PIE root *ya- "to seek, request, desire". In biblical language (early 13c.) "tolerating no unfaithfulness." Also in Middle English sometimes in the more positive sense, "fond, amorous, ardent" (c. 1300) and in the senses that now go with zealous, which is a later borrowing of the same word, from Latin.

No sense of the word means "protective".

So far as actual ancient words, the Hebrew word used is "קַנָּא" (qanna') which translates to "jealous". Just jealous, not "special-god-emotion-protective".

 

[savagewind]

You think that I'm deciding what jealousy means? Here, let me also lay out the etymology of "jealous".

jealous (adj.)

c. 1200, gelus, later jelus, "possessive and suspicious," originally in the context of sexuality or romance (in any context from late 14c.), from Old French jalos/gelos "keen, zealous; avaricious; jealous" (12c., Modern French jaloux), from Late Latin zelosus, from zelus "zeal," from Greek zelos, which sometimes meant "jealousy," but more often was used in a good sense ("emulation, rivalry, zeal"), from PIE root *ya- "to seek, request, desire". In biblical language (early 13c.) "tolerating no unfaithfulness." Also in Middle English sometimes in the more positive sense, "fond, amorous, ardent" (c. 1300) and in the senses that now go with zealous, which is a later borrowing of the same word, from Latin.

No sense of the word means "protective".

So far as actual ancient words, the Hebrew word used is "קַנָּא" (qanna') which translates to "jealous". Just jealous, not "special-god-emotion-protective".

If you have a zeal for something and you desire it you will be protective of it. You just will.

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

If you have a zeal for something and you desire it you will be protective of it. You just will.

That's not the use being used in the bible. Hence, why I bolded the biblical language as used in the 1200's. And yet even "zealous" is not necessarily flattering, and is often as negative as it is positive. And even still, the word used in the original text - as given to you - does not translate to "zealous". It does not translate to "lovingly protective" or other such interpretations. It means "jealous" in the sense of intolerance for the worship of other deities. Jealous of "his people," so much so that he denied them any contact with anything that might "tempt" them away from him. This is shown throughout the Old Testament.