How are these Great Beings explained?

[Aupmanyav]

Yes so you believe... The Maitreya is Buddhist and the book I suggested was the Anagatavamsa Desana.

Yeah, Maitreya is Buddhist and 'Anagatavamsha Desana' is a Srilankan Theravada belief. Hindus have nothing to do with that.

 

[Aupmanyav]

In India it's nasty. Christians will beat kids who wear Hindu forehead marks to school, and refuse to treat non-Christians at some hospitals.

That is criminal and brought to the attention of authorities will be punishable with jail sentences.

 

[oldbadger]

I didn't really understand Deism when I read about it. Sounds like God is there, but not active?

Everything that exists is a part of the whole..... God.
That includes us as well as the tree in my back garden, and the starlings which sit in it. Everything in the Universe and beyond, and beyond.

But......... in the same way that I am mostly unaware of each molecule in my toenails, the whole is unaware of me, indeed I am mostly unaware of myself.

And so my God is disinterested in us because there's rather a lot of itself everythere. And since I think of her as Nature then for me she is feminine.

And that's alright, because just now, on the cutting edge of time, I am enormously privileged to be able to think about her.

 

[oldbadger]

............... Virtues can be seen as the Rays of the Sun, they radiate from the Sun but they are not the Sun. ......................................

That must be some kind of spiritual otherworld kind of reversed thought-pattern.

The Rays of the Sun are very definitely of the Sun and they are killers and without our Planetary Magnetism they would have destroyed us and everything long ago. Scorched to nothingness..........

And so, if Bahauallah had told us that the Earth's Magnetism is a 'virtue' then I would be impressed for a moment, because I know that magnetism, just as the Sun's rays, is also a killer in differing circumstances.

It's as if there is yin and yan to all, the real beauty. And where poets write about only the half of it all, then they are insulting us, because they assume that we are daft enough to be deceived by the 'mystical' hypnosis of it all.......... Of course many of us are daft enough, I have been for most of my life, but once given a little insight I can feel some irritation that I was so 'spiritually' treated whilst in my disabilities of younger years.

just cannot help it, but everything that I see in Bahai is upside down, or roundabout. But to be fair, Christianity is worse, much much worse. Only the Mosaic God and His laws can hold my respect now, because they were ABSOLUTELY not mystical, not spiritual, just laws for a stronger people, back in the day when those laws were all needed.

 

[oldbadger]

........ I don't see belief in God as a virtue at all. It's just a belief.

Winner....... !
The scruffy and cold tramp, shuffling through the crowds, up the city high street on a Saturday afternoon, an empty cider bottle hanging from his left hand, shouting to the World that he saw God last night. (I haven't actually lived this to the letter, but bloody nearly!)
And the crowd divides around him and moves on, as if he was never there.

But thatr's how the crowd should treat the local Reverend, really. Divide, move past, walk on.

 

[Dawnofhope]

There is no superstition greater than God, as also the belief in sons, manfiestations, prophets, mahdis, who claim the sole agency for selling tickets to heaven.

Cool. So why are you wasting your time talking to Baha'is?

 

[oldbadger]

Consider the analogy of the Manifestation of God being a Divine Physician that perceives the ills of humanity and provides the remedy.

If one of your colleagues reported such a person, down the road, offering Divine remedies........ would you call the cops?
BTW, that's probably the scruffy tramp who just walked up the high street in my previous post!

The physician provides advise that is clear, consistent, and effective. For Baha'is the Divine physician for today is Baha'u'llah.

OK, for Bahais, fair enough, but for the rest of the World we needed somebody who might have stopped us from making the place so dirty, hese recent centuries past.

How can a physician truly be said to be a healer if He says only "You work out your own illness and sort out the medication you think will suit you the best?"

But what else can we expect? Your healer has not got the World's prognosis right, really. Some of us perceive too many tenets that would just repeat the circle of humans being human, which can only lead to inhumanity.

 

[oldbadger]

Cool. So why are you wasting your time talking to Baha'is?

The above written to another..............
Should you ask that?
Look, another member believes that you are wrong, and since this is the correct place to say so, he says so, possibly in the hopes that you might see his light.

And so he might be trying to show you something, just as you seek to show him (and me) your something.

At the point where any of us says (to any other) 'so why are you here, then?' the conversation is dead, or it might be.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

And so, if Bahauallah had told us that the Earth's Magnetism is a 'virtue' then I would be impressed for a moment, because I know that magnetism, just as the Sun's rays, is also a killer in differing circumstances.

I have always wondered about this passage on Magnatisim. I have thought since reading in in 1984, that Magnatisim based power source, will be the power of the future;

"O servant of Bahá! Be self-sacrificing in the path of God, and wing thy flight unto the heavens of the love of the Abhá Beauty, for any movement animated by love moveth from the periphery to the centre, from space to the Day-Star of the universe. Perchance thou deemest this to be difficult, but I tell thee that such cannot be the case, for when the motivating and guiding power is the divine force of magnetism it is possible, by its aid, to traverse time and space easily and swiftly. Glory be upon the people of Bahá." (Abdul'baha)

Regards Tony

 

[Dawnofhope]

The above written to another..............
Should you ask that?
Look, another member believes that you are wrong, and since this is the correct place to say so, he says so, possibly in the hopes that you might see his light.

And so he might be trying to show you something, just as you seek to show him (and me) your something.

At the point where any of us says (to any other) 'so why are you here, then?' the conversation is dead, or it might be.

OB, despite our different POVs, we have some rapport.
We've come to know each other somewhat.
I'll consider what you have to say, and you'll consider what I say.
None of our words may have a heck a lot of difference but thats fine.
We'll probably learn a thing or two from each other and thats a good thing.

@Aupmanyav mystifies me somewhat. I wonder why he's here.
We're in the general debate section.
We're all free to come and go.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Jesus was later declared to be part a Trinity. Christians believed in Satan and hell. How many doctrines and beliefs that Baha'is say aren't true before you agree and say "no" Jews were right not to follow the wrong teachings of Christianity?

It is written that in the OT that there is a time and a season for everything.

To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven:
A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted;
A time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up;
A time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance;
A time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing;
A time to get, and a time to lose; a time to keep, and a time to cast away;
A time to rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak;
A time to love, and a time to hate; a time of war, and a time of peace.
Ecclesiastes 3:1-8

Had the Jewish people listened to Christs advice they would have realised it was not the right time to be taking up arms against the Romans.

Jesus warned His diciples during the Olivet discourse recorded in the synoptic gospels about the coming tribulations, that the temple would be destroyed, and they should flea Judea. They did not heed His call, instead they believed in another who lead them to battle and defeat against the Romans.

The Jews believed in Satan and Shoel.

The trinity wouldn't become part of Christian doctrine until the fourth century.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Still doen't address what Jews think of Baha'i's. But agreeing to not proselytize is great. Too bad the Muslims, Baha'i' , and Christians wouldn't extend the same courtesy to Hindus. India should have made the same deal in return for the Delhi Baha'i temple. Maybe the Jews will share with us how they did it.

The Jews knew how to drive a hard bargain.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Wasn't all this symbolic? Or, was it a made up story? Since the story wasn't written down for several years.

Matthew 27:50-54 becomes allegorical as the writer takes artistic licence fusing history with embellished symbols. The earthquakes, resurrections, and temple veil tearing were not literal events.

 

[Dawnofhope]

As a Baha'i I am guided by the writings of Abdu'l-Baha and Baha'u'llah that I consider just as authoritative, if not more so, than the bible.

He didn't sacrifice himself, - he was executed for attempted undermining of the authority.

It is clear from John 12 and John 13 that Jesus knew what was coming and it is what His Heavenly Father required of Him.

It was Caiaphas the high Priest and the council who sealed the deal as they considered Jesus a heretic and to have Blaphemed against God.
Matthew 26:57-68

He spoke against the Priests and Romans, incited riots and had to run, tossed Temple courtyards, chasing people with whips, etc

Sure He caused a disturbance in the the temple. He didn't incite riots.

He even appears to have had guerrilla fighters in his group.

Judas Iscariot and Simon called Zelotes,

There is no evidence of Jesus having military intent to over throw the authorities.

 

[oldbadger]

I have always wondered about this passage on Magnatisim. I have thought since reading in in 1984, that Magnatisim based power source, will be the power of the future;

"O servant of Bahá! Be self-sacrificing in the path of God, and wing thy flight unto the heavens of the love of the Abhá Beauty, for any movement animated by love moveth from the periphery to the centre, from space to the Day-Star of the universe. Perchance thou deemest this to be difficult, but I tell thee that such cannot be the case, for when the motivating and guiding power is the divine force of magnetism it is possible, by its aid, to traverse time and space easily and swiftly. Glory be upon the people of Bahá." (Abdul'baha)

Regards Tony

...... for a moment.
Now why didn't Bahaualla mention that?
His son wrote as he read, which is fine, but there was no divinity in it.
Magnetism is part of the plus and minus of the World. When giving us a shield to the Sun's Rays it is benevolent. I can think of many uses where it is dreadful.

 

[Dawnofhope]

If one of your colleagues reported such a person, down the road, offering Divine remedies........ would you call the cops?
BTW, that's probably the scruffy tramp who just walked up the high street in my previous post!

I doubt if Baha'u'llah would have had anymore inclination to do my job, as I would His. Its a great allegory though.

OK, for Bahais, fair enough, but for the rest of the World we needed somebody who might have stopped us from making the place so dirty, hese recent centuries past.

The world has come a long way in the last 200 years since Baha'u'llah was born. Many of His teachings that would have been considered unthinkable in nneteenth century Persia have become maiinstream today.

But what else can we expect? Your healer has not got the World's prognosis right, really. Some of us perceive too many tenets that would just repeat the circle of humans being human, which can only lead to inhumanity.

So what you change about Baha'u'llah's prescription for humanity, had you have been appointed Prophet or Divine Manifestation for all humanity?

 

[oldbadger]

OB, despite our different POVs, we have some rapport.
We've come to know each other somewhat. I'll consider what you have to say, and you'll consider what I say.
None of our words may have a heck a lot of difference but thats fine. We'll probably learn a thing or two from each other and thats a good thing.
@Aupmanyav mystifies me somewhat. I wonder why he's here.
We're in the general debate section.
We're all free to come and go.

At some considerable risk of irritating @Vinayaka ........ Indeed he himself rather than @Aupmanyav.
Occasionally I will visit a local transport cafe for breakfast. A couple of regulars are often seen, stuffing a full-english (you would know them on sight, by weight alone) are usually telling the other diners about what is wrong with the World.
Beyond their usual subject matter, such as how to play football correctly, or how to rule the UK, their most intense subject is Cold Calling Religious Do Gooders!
You know me, I would never even think of dropping the match, but I may innocently have mentioned once how the JWs had recently called. I would not need to describe the self righteous furore resulting. When one of 'em gets really excited he spits egg across the cafe.
Such responses on doorsteps often do Mystify JWs, just as you might be mystified by attitudes here. But a JW would never send any away........
How does it go....? It's the only passage I ever learned.
Not every sea hath pearls; not every branch will flower, nor will the nightingale sing thereon.
Then, ere the nightingale of the mystic paradise repair to the garden of God,
and the rays of the heavenly morning return to the Sun of Truth.............. make thou an effort.

 

[oldbadger]

So what you change about Baha'u'llah's prescription for humanity, had you have been appointed Prophet or Divine Manifestation for all humanity?

What do I know?
I found a rock and got underneath it.
Can't see much in here.......

 

[Vinayaka]

The world Centre is in Israel, many Jews each day visit the Gardens and hear the explanation of the significance.

It has nice gardens, and is much like a tourist attraction. I wandered around the yeards of the Mormon temple in Utah for that reason. I still hve no idea what Jews think of Baha'i. P

 

[Vinayaka]

Baha'is are free to make use of various means of contraception providing it does not lead to permanent sterilisation.

So it's changed from this:
'Birth control, however, when exercised in order to deliberately prevent the procreation of any children is against the spirit of the Law of Bahá’u’lláh, which defines the primary purpose of marriage to be the rearing of children and their spiritual training in the Cause. The Universal House of Justice will have to consider this issue and give its verdict upon it.'

"The Universal House of Justice feels that the time has not yet arrived for legislation on this matter, and that these instructions provide sufficient guidance for the friends for the time being.

(From a letter of the Universal House of Justice to the National Spiritual Assembly of the British Isles, July 13, 1967)"
Good to know.