Jehovah's Witnesses Knocked on My Door

[savagewind]

That is not how Jesus conducted himself.

Matthew 7:1-3

 

[savagewind]

Nobody has changed anything in any Bible and you can read it in a 20th century version or a 17th century one it still says the same thing.

Douay-Rheims Bible
Going therefore, teach ye (VERB) all nations; baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.

Young's Literal Translation
having gone, then, disciple (VERB) A all the nations, (baptizing them -- to the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit

King James Bible
Go ye therefore, and teach (VERB) all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost

New International Version
Therefore go and make disciples (PLURAL NOUN) of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit

New American Standard 1977
“Go therefore and make disciples (PLURAL NOUN) of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit

I know that you know that doing and making are different.

How come about? "having gone, therefore, [YOU] be a disciple to all the nations"

In other words, even though it will appear that I (Jesus) am gone, I will still be with you to teach you. As you keep on being my disciples please do so among every nation [do not be holeing up together as other like-minded human souls do]. You should teach them and even baptize them BUT THEY BELONG TO JEHOVAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Ezekiel 18:4

OMG

Whether you want to believe it is a different question of course.

 

[savagewind]

Some people have said for me to come on! To be a disciple means the same as to make a disciple. Believe that if you can, but even if that ridiculous notion was true it would still be changed from a verb to a verb and a noun which would mean that a word was added. Something added is a change.

When someone reads "disciple all the nations" a person might ask himself, "What does it mean?" and God will lead the man to know what it means.

When someone reads "make disciples of all the nations" a person might think, "I can't do that!" And because he is a humble man per order of Jehovah he will think that he should be a proper disciple before venturing to make another person a disciple. He will never reach disciple perfection and so will pass by the commission to be making someone else what he rightly believes he isn't, but he will know that it is not for someone else to be a perfect disciple so he will be left confused and so be like everyone else. If he is not smart, he will wait until someone reaches him to teach him. He will be willing to downgrade from Jesus The Teacher to anyone who wrongly believes that he or she can take the place of Jesus to teach.

There came a time where discipleship lost its power. How? By the change. Who knows if it would have worked the right way?

 

[Super Universe]

Jeepers...you're still stuck aren't you...

What this:

"I am comforted by my belief that God will soon bring complete justice to the earth and will right all wrongs. In the meantime, I cherish each day of life and do what I reasonable can to preserve it. (Revelation 21:5)"

means is:

'I am comforted by my belief that God will soon bring complete justice to the earth and will right all wrongs. In the meantime, I cherish each day of life and do what I reasonable can to preserve it...because Revelation 21:5 says "And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes, there shall be no more death, or sorrow, nor crying. There shall be no more pain, for the former things have passed away. Then He who sat on the throne said "Behold, I make all things new." And He said to me, "Write, for these words are true and faithful."'

The scriptural reference is cited (not quoted) so you can look it up and see that it gives support for the statement to the effect that the prophecy (in Revelation 21:5) is comforting to those who long for a time when God will "right all wrongs".

Nobody has changed anything in any Bible and you can read it in a 20th century version or a 17th century one it still says the same thing.

Whether you want to believe it is a different question of course.

The Revelations quote does not say or mean that God will bring justice to the earth and right all wrongs. If God brings justice then why do we need a legal system?

The earth will be a paradise when humans evolve and humans make it a paradise. God is not going to do it for you. And hiding in your home and hiding in a Kingdom Hall on Sunday's is not doing anything to help humans evolve. It's sitting around waiting for God to do everything for you.

 

[Super Universe]

To carry this much animosity for over 40 years is a testimony to how messed up you became.

The expression is to "harbor grudges"....and this is what I see you doing. Those grudges are given very safe haven in an unforgiving heart.....the events of your childhood are obviously still all very raw for you....like it happened yesterday. Yesterday is gone but you can't see to let it go.

You wouldn't recognize JW's anymore. The old days are gone and a whole new generation is keeping up with what is happening in the world and in the congregations.

Who said laughter and music were bad? Who said we can't share clean jokes? Seriously, you have no idea.....like you are caught in some kind of horrible time warp.

Our meetings are not dry and boring and neither are our publications. You are living in the past and it sounds like its way past time to move on.....anger and an unforgiving spirit eats you up from the inside. If you want Jesus' advice, he said that in order for God to forgive us, we have to forgive others. Where does that leave you, do you think? (Matthew 6:14-15; 18:21-22) Try forgiveness.....its so much better for the spirit than stored up resentment.

To carry animosity for 40 years is testimony to how messed up I became? I'm not messed up. I'm experienced. I don't sugar coat life.

I harbor grudges? I absolutely do. And the JW's don't? What happens if you try to convert some new friends of yours to your JW religion and they don't accept it, you cut them out of your lives, don't you? What are you supposed to do if your JW children leave and join the military?

I can't let yesterday go? It's never going to happen. JW's are still terrorizing their children.

I wouldn't recognize JW's anymore? The ones who have been coming to my house in the past few years have been preaching Jesus, that is a big change, but, here's the thing, if you can change your ideas then that means your original ideas were not from God. Did you know the Jews don't stone to death people for violating the sabbath anymore? If that was really from God how can a Jew stop doing it?

A whole new generation of JW's is keeping up with what is happening in the world? That's always been a JW trick, taking 2,000 year old biblical quotes and trying to apply them to today's problems.

Who said that laughter and music were bad? I don't remember any JW ever saying that they were bad but the Kingdom Hall services were humorless and so were all the JW's I met. As for music, they would sing a song or two during the services but everything just seemed so lifeless and drab. There is no new ideas, no new philosophy, you're all waiting for God to do everything for you. You will be waiting, and waiting, and waiting while the rest of us come up with all the new ideas and new discoveries and new inventions. We will improve society while you wait.

I should forgive the JW's? Nope, never going to happen. If you or anyone tried to do something to me as an adult I can defend myself. As a child I couldn't. The only real power you have is over those who desperately need to be part of something, even if that something is wrong.

 

[Clear]

Super Universe Said : "JW's are fulfilling the command given by Jesus to preach the kingdom message in all the world? Jesus did not say to torture your children by making them go up to other people's houses and preach what you want them to preach."
Deeje replied : "Most of our children love the preaching work because they love God and because they love telling people about the paradise to come."

I think SuperUniverses' comment on this point seemed petty and contextually inaccurate. I am not J.W. and do not agree with much of their theology but have found them, in the main, to be wonderfully dedicated and kind individuals. I would be very pleased to have one as my neighbor and friend.

I noticed a couple with a young son going from door to door and as they left a door, saw me walking and their little boy gave me a pamplet. He seemed very pleased to be out with his parents. I stooped down to get closer to his height and asked him about the pamplet and if he thought it was something important. He was enthusiastic in his reply to the affirmative. I told him I was honestly very glad to take the pamphlet from him and I promised him I would read it and let him know that I thought that he was trying to do a wonderful thing. Though I disagree with their theology, I honor them for their dedication and I do not feel an obligation to agree with those whom I respect.

Clear
ειειφισεω

You have found the JW's to be wonderfully delicate and kind? Ever lived with one? How many of their children have you known? I know one JW kid who became addicted to drugs at 16 because his father, one of the Kingdom Hall elders, was extremely strict and unforgiving in the home.

I know two girls who were raised JW and both of them are strippers now. I know another ex-JW kid who is now grown up, he is a functioning alcoholic and drug addict and his brother is not into drugs anymore but he has extremely low self esteem and he married a very over weight ex-drug addict lady who lost her kids to CPS and she hasn't seen them in 20 years and she has not tried to contact them ever.

Have you ever seen a kid tremble because they are so scared to preach religion to strangers? Some kids at first are so scared that they throw up on the driveway. Some start wetting the bed.

I spent 12 years as JW. You saw them on the street once or twice and you think you know JW's.

Hi SuperUniverse :

Please do not misunderstand me. I am not claiming that all J.W. Children (or other children) always LIKE religious activities of their parents. It is your generalization that J.W.s are “torturing” their children by having the children tract from door to door with their parents that seems overstated.

When one offers inaccurate generalizations to make a point, it taints the credibility of the post and it’s author (even if other aspects of a post might be perfectly correct).

We all tend to project our own feelings and emotions and observations inaccurately onto other situations and this affects the resulting descriptions. While you describe the J.W. as “torturing” their children by tracting, the two children I interacted with seemed happy to be out with their parents. While I do not know Jehovahs Witness theology, I do know children and do not believed the children I have met were being “tortured”.

I agree with your point that, someone who does not adhere to Jehovahs Witness theology cannot “know them”. You say that you “spent 12 years as JW.” (post 144) but in post #148 you admit you, yourself were never truly a Jehovahs Witness by admitting “I was not a real full time JW. I never accepted any of it”. You were never a converted J.W. yet claim that you “had the experience”.

In reality, you also did not “have the experience” of being a real Jehovahs Witness. This is, I think, one of the points Deeje is trying to make. The same is true of a person claiming to have been Catholic, or Lutheran, or Mormon, or any other denomination.

Your descriptions feel exaggerated and embellished. You claim “I escaped half of the dark nightmare when I was 16 and the other half at age 20 when I left home.” “torture”, “nightmare”, etc. These all feel like amplifications and overstatements.

I am not saying that you are correct or incorrect in your feelings, merely that over generalizations and embellishments distract from an objective description. I am not trying to tell you that you are wrong or right or to diminish your base position. I am not arguing with you that J.W. theology is correct or wrong (I think it has a lot of error), but rather I am trying to discuss the specific principle of overstatement, embellishment and the inaccuracies and pitfalls of inflations in our descriptions.


I hope your journey is wonderful SuperUniverse. I hope I did not come across as hyper-critical. That was not my intention.


Clear
ειτωσισεω

 

[Super Universe]

It's not called lying. It's why there are differing denominations of a singular Christian religion.

It's all in the "interpretation" of Scripture.

It's no different than Christians who cherry pick.

There are different interpretations of scripture? That's fine. They can say "We think this says this." They can interpret all they want but when you give a biblical reference and people check the biblical reference and it is different, that is lying.

It's no different than Christians who cherry pick? But the Christians who cherry pick are saying "We like these parts and not these other parts," while the JW's are changing the parts they don't like to make them more reflective of JW beliefs.

 

[savagewind]

There are different interpretations of scripture? That's fine. They can say "We think this says this." They can interpret all they want but when you give a biblical reference and people check the biblical reference and it is different, that is lying.

It's no different than Christians who cherry pick? But the Christians who cherry pick are saying "We like these parts and not these other parts," while the JW's are changing the parts they don't like to make them more reflective of JW beliefs.

The interpretations that the Jehovah's Witnesses use are in the Name of God. They believe that their ideas about the scriptures are what God wants them to know but not only them, all of us. If we refuse their opinions it is as though we are refusing Jehovah. When someone leaves them it is said of the person that they have left Jehovah.

@Deeje if what I write in this post is twisted and rubbish why don't you prove that it is?

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

When the bible says "Lord" they change it to "Jehovah" because they think they are the only ones who use the correct name for God.

It's not like they're calling Him Joe Bob Jenkins or anything, though.

Also, many time "LORD" is used when the correct "translation" would've used the name Jews aren't allowed to say.

but I have a scar on my left arm from a dog released on me when I was 9 when he saw us coming up the driveway.

I would never sic my dogs on people clearly not meant to kill us. Besides, Bear and Sarah would just want a doggie snack from you anyway. One bone each and they'd be friends for life, LOL.

"To survive, we need clean water, food, clothing, and shelter from the weather." 1 Timothy 6:7, 8. The bible says "...with food, clothing, we shall be content.

I agree that they changed it, but you DO need more than food and clothes.

"Physical training is beneficial for a little," 1 Timothy 4:8.

Couch potato lifestyles aren't healthy either.

I can trace my health problems to physically sedentary lifestyles (some because I'm lazy, some because I'm too disabled to train properly).

Before you consider engaging in a certain activity, get to know the risks involved. Ask yourself, "Does this activity amount to little more than a gamble with death or serious injury?

Yeah, I'm not sure how they pulled that out of the actual verse.

"Good and stable friends helped me to make better choices about activities I wanted to participate in. When my friends changed, so did my life." Proverbs 13:20. This is somewhat changed from the bible.

This all seems to be a formatting issue: they word it like they are quoting but they aren't. They should learn how to cite sources properly when using paraphrasing.

It also says a multiheaded dragon will be on Earth.

Maybe the biblical authors saw clips of King Ghidorah?

Heaven and earth will pass away, but My words will never pass away.

Except all the words we see cited in the bible but no longer exist.

But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, in which the heavens will pass away with a roar and the elements will be destroyed with intense heat, and the earth and its works will be burned up.

One way to get that result is for the sun to nova, but there won't a new earth after that, 'cause, you know, the sun blew up.

Just wanted to point out that, regardless of if their verses are correct, Jehovah Witnesses study scripture more than almost anybody.

Studying inaccuracies as if they are accurate won't get you anywhere, though.

You misunderstood......or perhaps you just don't get it? It wasn't a quotation, it was a citation.

Poorly formatted, if there's confusion about it.

There is a great difference in True Christianity and Nominal Christians.

Ah, but since some scenes could be evidence that Jesus is only marginally Christian, how are we to define "True Christianity"?

When the change no longer says the same thing as the original verse but the verse is cited as a "reference" and it's done intentionally, not accidentally, that is lying.

Avoiding Plagiarism: Quoting and Paraphrasing

Now, this particular denomination involved is not a big fan of doing anything remotely scholarly and forbids such things, so I take it even using an approved scholarly format that you'd actually learn in middle school is going to be left unmastered. However, there IS a difference between quoting and paraphrasing.

The difference is that modern JW's know you need more than just food and clothing to survive so they added in the word "clean" and they added "and shelter from the weather," to make it sound like the bible has relevance for today.

And there would be nothing really wrong with that if they phrased it correctly. Even Jesus says "You have heard it said [blah blah], but truly I tell you, [blah blah v 2.0]." I'm not a big fan of JW's for the most part and only agree with them on one or two general things, but I don't think they're lying so much as not sufficiently trained in proper citations. It's a fixable thing.

If you send a huge number of teenagers out into the world to preach your religion, not all of them are going to do a perfect job of it.

That's why I'm not into evangelism. I understand it's mandated in the bible, but a bad salesman is more harmful than just letting the product speak for itself.

From my perspective, this seems more like a case of "fan fiction". Like if I re-wrote a version of Harry Potter for my own purposes and changed his scar from a lightning bolt into a poo emoji. It's not lying... simply another fiction.

Or if one gospel doesn't go into as much detail as you'd like, you just get 2 buddies and write about 3 more.

Satan the devil rebelled against God by hijacking the human race in Eden

Which is also fan fiction, as Satan isn't in that story at all.

1) it is promoting nationalism, which is not something a Christian can do. We serve a kingdom that is not earthly, so because we do not have dual citizenship ("My kingdom is not from this source") we do not participate in nationalistic activities...period, regardless of the nation we occupy. We are however, very law abiding. So what is more important....standing for the anthem but being a thief or a murderer, or being a responsible citizen who is just following their conscience? Who is it harming?

I'm with you on this one. It's one thing to sing a song (though I've recently seen what the other verses are, and it's even worse than just celebrating lots of people dying in explosions), but to treat a flag or a song like, well, gospel is idolatrous, imho.

You obviously know nothing about the dangers of blood transfusions.

Super may not but I do, being a nurse and all. Any harm that comes is strictly due to procedures not being followed. That's all.

"Things" don't make you happy....."people" make you happy.

I'm an introvert, so people make me happy much less than they do extroverts.

You don't stand for the anthem because that promotes nationalism? What's wrong with nationalism?

It tends to promote "my country right or wrong", which is dangerous and leads us to crazies wanting world domination/destruction. It leads to people claiming US citizens in Puerto Rico shouldn't get any assistance because they're not on the mainland, aka "the REAL US". It leads to people threatening ICE on brown people who are actually citizens. It leads to xenophobic economic policies that ignore that in the 21st century, we MUST treat the entire planet as one big economy.

 

[Super Universe]

Hi SuperUniverse :

Please do not misunderstand me. I am not claiming that all J.W. Children (or other children) always LIKE religious activities of their parents. It is your generalization that J.W.s are “torturing” their children by having the children tract from door to door with their parents that seems overstated.

When one offers inaccurate generalizations to make a point, it taints the credibility of the post and it’s author (even if other aspects of a post might be perfectly correct).

We all tend to project our own feelings and emotions and observations inaccurately onto other situations and this affects the resulting descriptions. While you describe the J.W. as “torturing” their children by tracting, the two children I interacted with seemed happy to be out with their parents. While I do not know Jehovahs Witness theology, I do know children and do not believed the children I have met were being “tortured”.

I agree with your point that, someone who does not adhere to Jehovahs Witness theology cannot “know them”. You say that you “spent 12 years as JW.” (post 144) but in post #148 you admit you, yourself were never truly a Jehovahs Witness by admitting “I was not a real full time JW. I never accepted any of it”. You were never a converted J.W. yet claim that you “had the experience”.

In reality, you also did not “have the experience” of being a real Jehovahs Witness. This is, I think, one of the points Deeje is trying to make. The same is true of a person claiming to have been Catholic, or Lutheran, or Mormon, or any other denomination.

Your descriptions feel exaggerated and embellished. You claim “I escaped half of the dark nightmare when I was 16 and the other half at age 20 when I left home.” “torture”, “nightmare”, etc. These all feel like amplifications and overstatements.

I am not saying that you are correct or incorrect in your feelings, merely that over generalizations and embellishments distract from an objective description. I am not trying to tell you that you are wrong or right or to diminish your base position. I am not arguing with you that J.W. theology is correct or wrong (I think it has a lot of error), but rather trying to discuss the specific principle of overstatement, embellishment and the inaccuracies and pitfalls of inflations in our descriptions.


I hope your journey is wonderful SuperUniverse. I hope I did not come across as hyper-critical. That was not my intention.


Clear
ειτωσισεω

It is my generalization that JW's are torturing their children? I've probably known more JW children than you have. Every single one of them hated going door to door, they hated getting spanked in a room of the Kingdom Hall simply for falling asleep during service, they hated not being able to stand for the anthem, they hated being pulled out of public school, they hated that they had to pretend to accept the religion.

When one offers inaccurate generalizations? 12 years as a part time JW. What's your experience with JW's? Two children who were with their parents? Did you think the children would ask for help with their parents standing there? That never happens. Even severely abused children rarely escape their parents. They don't know enough about society to know that there are people who will truly protect them and care for them.

I learned to be very quiet and introverted around my dad because drawing attention always resulted in a comment that I was not following JW teachings, as if asking a question was against JW teachings.

You believe the JW children you met were not being tortured? People in North Korea who love their leader are not being tortured either.

In reality I did not have the experience of being a JW because I did not accept it? That is spin. Spin. Spin. And it's spin from someone who only saw JW's on the street. What, did you think that the child would come to your door and tell you that they threw up on the sidewalk the first time they had to go door to door? Did you think they would tell you that they started wetting the bed and don't know why? Did you think they would tell you how embarassed they are when they don't get a Christmas or birthday present?

Torture and nightmare seem to you to be over statements? Walk in my shoes first, then judge.

You hope my journey is wonderful? It's a learning experience.

 

[Super Universe]

The interpretations that the Jehovah's Witnesses use are in the Name of God. They believe that their ideas about the scriptures are what God wants them to know but not only them, all of us. If we refuse their opinions it is as though we are refusing Jehovah. When someone leaves them it is said of the person that they have left Jehovah.

@Deeje if what I write in this post is twisted and rubbish why don't you prove that it is?

I know but Charlie Taze Russell did not have a vision. He admitted that he did not. He did not provide humanity with any new philosophy like Abraham did or Moses or Jesus.

Charlie picked some things he liked and dismissed other ideas that he did not like. JW's do not believe in hell fire because when he was growing up and did normal boy things Charlie's mother would tell him "You're going to burn in hell Charles," so he invented a religion that does not believe in hell fire.

Also, Charlie did not understand the trinity so that is why JW's don't believe in it.

 

[savagewind]

Studying inaccuracies as if they are accurate won't get you anywhere, though.

It will get them somewhere. it won't get them to anything good.

I understand it's [evangelism] mandated in the bible,

I am hoping that you will share what Bible source you learned to believe that (but, please not Matthew 28:19 just in case it really doesn't mean to "make" disciples.)
Or maybe you know another definition of evangelize other than this one: convert or seek to convert (someone) to Christianity.

Maybe you only mean "to preach". If that is it, then I agree that it is mandated. I think preaching Jesus Christ is wonderful even when it is poorly done.

 

[savagewind]

Let's think. What can preaching be good for? Teaching, perhaps. THEY believe and say that preaching is for converting people. Converting to what, I wonder? To the preacher's way of thinking! That can't be right.....

 

[savagewind]

The interpretations that the Jehovah's Witnesses use are in the Name of God. They believe that their ideas about the scriptures are what God wants them to know but not only them, all of us. If we refuse their opinions it is as though we are refusing Jehovah. When someone leaves them it is said of the person that they have left Jehovah.

@Deeje if what I write in this post is twisted and rubbish why don't you prove that it is?

I really, really, really might love an actual response and analysis for why my posts you @Deeje call twisted and rubbish. It is the truth that we both profess to love. Correct?

Please, then, tell me why my inquires you call "rubbish".

 

[siti]

The Revelations quote does not say or mean that God will bring justice to the earth and right all wrongs. If God brings justice then why do we need a legal system?

The earth will be a paradise when humans evolve and humans make it a paradise. God is not going to do it for you. And hiding in your home and hiding in a Kingdom Hall on Sunday's is not doing anything to help humans evolve. It's sitting around waiting for God to do everything for you.

I agree with your last paragraph - but I honestly don't think that nit-picking possibly dubious but entirely innocuous misinterpretations of scripture is helping humans evolve either. For the record, the Bible does indeed say - especially but certainly not exclusively in Revelation - that God will bring justice and the scripture cited will be the result of the removal of wickedness. Like I said - its up to you whether you believe it. I don't, but I have no truck with those who correctly claim this is what the Bible says because it is what the Bible says.

 

[Clear]

Hi SuperUniverse :

Regarding your generalization that J.W. are “torturing their children”.


1) The claim to know more J.W. Children as an appeal to authority does not help

I believe you have known more JW Children than me. Still, If you did, it would not prove "all J.W. children are tortured” by their parents. It does not prove that "all J.W. parents spank their little child "for “falling asleep”. It does not prove "all little J.W. children" only “pretend” to accept their religion.

While I believe there are imperfect Jehovah's Witness Parents (we are all “a work in progress”), the widespread observation that most parents love their children and treat them kindly is in stark opposition to your hyper-generalizations that all Jehovah witness parents torture their children and none of them are kindly, normal parents.

These over-generalizations (e.g. “every single one of them hated it”) and exaggerations (life as “torture”, escaping from a “nightmare”, etc) are simply not credible, and the generalizations feel more like a personal emotional “dumping” or an act of revenge for perceived “wrongs” done to you.

While you have known more J.W. children, I probably know more about children than you.

I’ve practiced medicine for about 35 years, most of it a specialization in pediatrics which is the treatment of children. I’ve treated multiple health problems including anxiety, and depression. A three year old is simply not sophisticated enough to create and sustain a mask of cheerfulness, and continue positive, spontaneous, communication when being tortured.


2) Your descriptions are not authentic “TORTURE”

A) You describe that “they threw up on the sidewalk the first time they had to go door to door”
This is not “torture”.
A sensitive adolescent may throw up from nerves before their first date. That is not torture.

B)You describe “they started wetting the bed and don't know why?”
This is not “torture”.
Almost one of 5 boys still wets the bed at 5 years old (15-16%). This is normal and not a result of "torture". Many other stresses cause bed wetting. Moving to a new home may cause wetting the bed. That is not “torture”. Having a new child born into the family frequently causes it. That is not “torture”. There are many subtle anxieties and physical immaturities and other reasons for bedwetting that are not “torture”.
MOST kids I treat for enuresis (wetting) do not know the reasons for it, nor do most of the finest parents know the reasons.

C)You describe embarrassment “when they don't get a Christmas or birthday present?”
This is not torture.
Many children in poor countries do not receive a Christmas or birthday present when others around them have enough to receive gifts. This is not torture.

Your exaggerations do not prove all J.W. children are “tortured”.


3)The generalization that all others have the same experience as ourselves is inaccurate

Instead of allowing that other J.W. Children may have had a different, more positive experience than yours, you try to justify the hyperbole by claiming that “severely abused children rarely escape their parents. They don't know enough about society to know that there are people who will truly protect them and care for them.”

While one sees some forum members relating bad experience with multiple prior religions, if your claim is correct that "all children of J.W. parents" are tortured, then there should be armies of grown children who echo your specific claim. (millions of such claims should exist if each parent couple of the 8.4 million Jehovah’s Witness couple have only one child).

Another characteristic problem with hyper-generalizations is that they are often illogical. For example, you ask “You believe the JW children you met were not being tortured?” but then offer the comment that “People in North Korea who love their leader are not being tortured either.” as support. There is no logical connection between the two comments.



4) SuperUniverse said : “In reality I did not have the experience of being a JW because I did not accept it? “

Yes, you were NOT a converted and believing Jehovah’s Witness simply because you lived with them any more than I would become a Hindu, or Catholic or Athiest simply by living among Hindu, among Catholics or among Athiests.

You had the experience of being a sensitive, non-believer of Jehovah’s Witness theology, having had what you describe as a difficult life as you lived with Jehovah’s witnesses. These are two different things. You did NOT experience being an actual and authentic “Jehovah’s Witness”. You may have pretended to be one, but you were never the authentic item (according to your own admission).


5) I am not speaking to theological issues, but to inaccuracy of generalizations.

I am not a Jehovah’s Witness. I strongly disagree with many religious doctrines and principles they teach. (e.g. I do not like their paraphrase of the biblical text-with some exceptions.) While I cannot judge accurately what is really going on, it seems as though you are trying to excite forum prejudice against them, perhaps as a unrecognized act of revenge for wrongs you think you suffered.

SuperUniverse I still hope you find joy in this life and that your journey becomes one of fulfilled joy.

Clear
ειφιτζσεω

 

[savagewind]

While I cannot judge accurately what is really going on, it seems as though you are trying to excite forum prejudice against them,

Which would balance the attitude of the Jehovah's Witnesses to make everyone a Jehovah's Witness. Just so you know, that is their goal.

 

[siti]

Douay-Rheims Bible
Going therefore, teach ye (VERB) all nations; baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.

Young's Literal Translation
having gone, then, disciple (VERB) A all the nations, (baptizing them -- to the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit

King James Bible
Go ye therefore, and teach (VERB) all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost

New International Version
Therefore go and make disciples (PLURAL NOUN) of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit

New American Standard 1977
“Go therefore and make disciples (PLURAL NOUN) of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit

I know that you know that doing and making are different.

How come about? "having gone, therefore, [YOU] be a disciple to all the nations"

In other words, even though it will appear that I (Jesus) am gone, I will still be with you to teach you. As you keep on being my disciples please do so among every nation [do not be holeing up together as other like-minded human souls do]. You should teach them and even baptize them BUT THEY BELONG TO JEHOVAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Ezekiel 18:4

OMG

You are obviously very confused and very troubled. Anyway, I don't reciprocate your confidence - I am pretty sure that you may not know that 'to make' is a verb. The Greek word μαθητεύσατε used in Matthew 28:19 is in fact a verb, which, according to Strong's Concordance (not Jehovah's Witnesses) means:

"to disciple, i.e. helping someone to progressively learn the Word of God to become a matured, growing disciple (literally, "a learner," a true Christ-follower); to train (develop) in the truths of Scripture and the lifestyle required, i.e. helping a believer learn to be a disciple of Christ in belief and practice."
​

 

[Deeje]

Matthew 7:1-3

Are you following this advice? Seems like a lot of straws are hiding some large rafters in yourself. Sometimes I see your endless rambles and wonder what you're on.....?...or off?

You pretend that you were a JW and yet what you post is so completely removed from anything we believe......it's ridiculous.

The word according to SW.....sorry I'll pass.

 

[siti]

Which would balance the attitude of the Jehovah's Witnesses to make everyone a Jehovah's Witness. Just so you know, that is their goal.

No it isn't - that is just complete nonsense - every JW knows that world conversion is entirely impossible and every indication of scripture is that the vast majority of mankind will not respond favourably to the message preached by Christ's followers. JWs might still believe that "millions now living will never die" (despite the fact that there can scarcely be a handful of people in the entire world who were alive when the Watchtower's second president first made that declaration in 1918) but there isn't one that doubts that billions of others will die at Armageddon. Your argument is as preposterous as ever. There are plenty of serious doctrinal issues to challenge JWs with if you have a mind to do so but your statement here is just false.