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What would Jesus do, a question for Republican's

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
Yeah and that was the parents vs the husband fighting over who had the rights to continue life support, and money won from a medical malpractice lawsuit. Not the parents/husband vs the state and the right to continue or discontinue life support. It's a completely different issue in because of the added complexity. It's not the same as parents getting denied by the state to seek treament.
The Florida Legislature, the Governor of the state, Senators from Tennessee and Wyoming, Representatives from Texas, Virginia and Illinois, the Congress (that passed "Terri's Law" which gave Jeb Bush the authority to intervene), and the US President were all involved in some way. If that's not direct government interference/involvement, I don't know what is.

I didn't have to ask the Prime Minister of Canada or the Premier of some province I don't live in, if I could remove my father from life support. The authority for that decision to be placed in my hands came from my father alone.
 

Enoch07

It's all a sick freaking joke.
Premium Member
The Florida Legislature, the Governor of the state, Senators from Tennessee and Wyoming, Representatives from Texas, Virginia and Illinois, the Congress (that passed "Terri's Law" which gave Jeb Bush the authority to intervene), and the US President were all involved in some way. If that's not direct government interference/involvement, I don't know what is.

I didn't have to ask the Prime Minister of Canada or the Premier of some province I don't live in, if I could remove my father from life support. The authority for that decision to be placed in my hands came from my father alone.

They would not have intervened if not for the power struggle between the parents of the patiennt and the patients husband. Which only got worse with lawsuit and millions of dollars at stake. It's totally different than the govt just stepping in and making the decision.
 

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
They would not have intervened if not for the power struggle between the parents of the patiennt and the patients husband. Which only got worse with lawsuit and millions of dollars at stake. It's totally different than the govt just stepping in and making the decision.
The government did step in and make decisions, all the way up the line from the Governor to the Congress to the President. This fits with what you have been talking about.


If my sister and I disagreed about turning off my father's machines, it would come down to lawyers and paperwork. The Prime Minister wouldn't step in at any point. And this is a country where we have universal health care.
 

BSM1

What? Me worry?
I believe He said you will always be able to help the poor and I believe we support that in both parties. Howeve I worked for OEO (the Office of Economic Opportunity) which was suposed to end poverty. It has helped a lot of people but it has not ended poverty or even diminished it.

No, he didn't. Just because you want something to be true doesn't make it so. Facts are tricky little devils.
 

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
There's where you go wrong at.
Nope, I'm right when I say that the vast majority of Democrats in Congress identify as Christian. They do.

First you have to establish what is the difference between a true Christian and a false Christian ?
Depends on which Christian(s) you're talking to.
Do you know the difference between them?
I know what the No True Scotsman Fallacy is.

No True Scotsman - RationalWiki
 
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Lyndon

"Peace is the answer" quote: GOD, 2014
Premium Member
There's where you go wrong at.

First you have to establish what is the difference between a true Christian and a false Christian ?

Do you know the difference between them?

Yeah the Republican ones are generally false Christians or Hypocrites, not that all the Democrat ones are that much better.
 
Even though I am not republican. I do love Jesus. So like I said in the other post.

Jesus believed in helping people by teaching them to fish, so that they could fish for food the rest of their life. Instead of just handing them a fish. Therefore giving them the freedom to live life and still have a way to not starve. Its a handup not a handout.

Social Justice demands that we give people a fish. Not bothering to teach them how to fish for themselves. This is a handout and not a handup. This sets up a welfare state of people who will have have to ask someone for a fish everytime they want food. They do not have freedom because they have to appease the hand that feeds them, or else they will starve.

Social justice is just a modern form of slavery. As indicated with its stance on open immigration. This is cheap modifed version of slave labor basically that keeps immigrants as under paid under the table manual labor. Democrats owned slaves up until the civil war, and it appears their stance on it has only slightly been modified in the past 150+ years to justify it.

So Jesus would support free college. Why aren't Republican Christians on board with free college?

Secondly, where is someone in Detroit going to go to fish so he can feed his family, also, what if he can't afford a fishing permit if he can find somewhere to fish?
 
Nope, but he also never demanded that everyone should adopt his beliefs. He always let people make their own decisions, even while they crucified him.

That's not the point of the OP. The point of the OP is about people who CLAIM to be Christian yet spit on the poor every chance they get.
 
I'm not a Republican but there is nothing affordable about Obamacare. The country can't afford it nor can the middle class. There are many great things that we would like to do for everyone but if we can't afford it then we can't afford it.

Jesus did not give money to the poor. He did not work a job and give all of his money to them. He taught us many good things but He left things the way they were. We're supposed to fix our society, not have it imposed by Jesus or God.

What did Jesus say about the rich? Many Republicans claim to be Christian but seem interested in helping the rich get richer, usually at the expense of the poor. How is it that almost every other modern country can afford Universal Healthcare for their people yet the richest country the world has ever seen cannot? The answer, the rich control the US and don't want to pay for other people to have health care. Its as simple as that.
 
Obviously that is not the case or else Charlie Gard case - Wikipedia might not have died because the U.K. denied him experimental treatment that might have saved him.

Again poverty is the issue that needs tackling. Not giving up our freedoms for healthcare or food or whatever. We focus all of our attention on helping the majority of the poverty stricken communities break the chains of poverty, we will see a large drop in problems associated with it. To do this wihtout giving up freedoms is hard, but it can be done.

The most the experimental treatment could have done was extend the babies suffering, not save his life, not repair his severe brain damage, just keep him alive a while longer in PAIN. The parents obviously were hoping for the best but numerous medical experts agreed that the experimental treatment would only extend the child's suffering and nothing more.
 
You can show compassion and help people by helping them to help themselves. Forcing people to depend on a welfare state does not have a positive outcome in the long term future. In fact that is a bleak future with Orwellian tones.

You see it as not compassionate because we refuse to hand over loads of cash to fix the problem short term. Which it would. We are thinking long term success here, where hopefully the majority of people are standing on their own 2 feet and does not need help.

Morgan Freeman agrees here as he calls bulls**t on Don Lemon for saying that black folk are not able to pull themself up by their bootstraps.

There will always be some amount of poverty and a small amount we cam handle. But not only can we not realistically afford an ever increasing welfare state, we don't want that welfare state grow in power to begin with.

So what are the Republicans kick *** plans to help people get on their feet and support themselves?
 
That may be the case. I am not an expert on Canadian, Australian, or UK healthcare. But I know the Candian one is not as great as U.S. citizens think it is, because I have Canadian friends who have said as much. My one friend in Australia loves his healtcare there so maybe the Australians are on to something. But then again your not allowed to own firearms there either, so the freedom restriction is already in place, which is no bueno for me.

Where is the freedom for people who cannot afford healthcare? They have the freedom to die because they cannot afford treatment and medication? So the freedom you want the poor to have is the choice between no healthcare and no healthcare? I'm sure Jesus would be down with that.
 

Super Universe

Defender of God
What did Jesus say about the rich? Many Republicans claim to be Christian but seem interested in helping the rich get richer, usually at the expense of the poor. How is it that almost every other modern country can afford Universal Healthcare for their people yet the richest country the world has ever seen cannot? The answer, the rich control the US and don't want to pay for other people to have health care. Its as simple as that.

What did Jesus say about the rich? You can look it up. I'm not your servant. If you read what I posted then you know that what I said was that Jesus TAUGHT us many good things but He did not take very many actions to fix things.

Many Republicans claim to be Christians but seem to be interested in getting richer? And poor people don't want to become richer?

Are the super rich that way at the expense of the poor? To some degree, yes, they are. I would absolutely agree that we need to change some things, raise the minimum wage for one. BUT, Jesus did not force His ideas upon us.

If you want to get into a regular debate about politics, I'm all for it but that topic goes in a different section. Jesus did not declare Himself a Democrat or say that everyone should be a Democrat.

How is it that every other modern country can afford universal healthcare for their people but we cannot? We can't because we're greedy, that's why. There are too many hands in the bucket.

The rich control the US? They do. They're called Senators.

But what does any of that have to do with Jesus?

And just for the record, I'm a Democrat.
 
Actually yes they do. Because I did not sign up for Obamacare because I already had insurance I pay for. I still got charged $250 tax for not signing up for Obamacare. Obamacare is a racketeering scheme.

I want poverty stricken people to break the chains of poverty so that they don't need my help. That is the Christian thing to do. Not establish a welfare state, so that you can keep your thumb on people as you wish to do.

I have to call BS here. You only get charged for not having insurance. If you have insurance regardless of how/where you got it, you can't be charged the penalty for not having insurance. So, you either don't know what you're talking about or are being purposely dishonest. Which is it?
 
What did Jesus say about the rich? You can look it up. I'm not your servant. If you read what I posted then you know that what I said was that Jesus TAUGHT us many good things but He did not take very many actions to fix things.

He supposedly died to teach us we should be compassionate and generous to each other. Maybe you're talking about a different Jesus than me?

Many Republicans claim to be Christians but seem to be interested in getting richer? And poor people don't want to become richer?

Yes and yes.

Are the super rich that way at the expense of the poor? To some degree, yes, they are. I would absolutely agree that we need to change some things, raise the minimum wage for one. BUT, Jesus did not force His ideas upon us.

So we agree on this at least, good.

If you want to get into a regular debate about politics, I'm all for it but that topic goes in a different section. Jesus did not declare Himself a Democrat or say that everyone should be a Democrat.

I never claimed he did so where is this coming from?

How is it that every other modern country can afford universal healthcare for their people but we cannot? We can't because we're greedy, that's why. There are too many hands in the bucket.

Agreed, the rich need their tax cuts, screw everyone else.

The rich control the US? They do. They're called Senators.

And the rich elites who own them.

But what does any of that have to do with Jesus?

*sigh* The OP is about the hypocrisy of Republicans who claim to be good Christians yet spit on the poor. Try to keep up.

And just for the record, I'm a Democrat.

So? Hillary and her corporate sell out cronies (most of the Democratic party) are no better.
 
A friend of mine had all 4 of his children on Obamacare. He makes more per than I but he cannot afford healthcarw for all 4 and all of his other bills as well (single dad, the mom is a nightmare dont ask). Out of nowhere about a year ago they just pulled the coverage on all 4. Now he cant get them reinsured because be is refused and he cant afford regular insurance. I just have not seen any positives come from Obamacare.

"Obamacare" is a Republican plan that is a giveaway to the insurance companies. Obama is a sell out just like the Republicans are. All the ACA did was force people to get insurance or get penalized. It didn't enforce any price controls, didn't foster free market and competition. The ACA is a joke and a desperate distraction by Republicans and Democrats (because they're both corporate sell outs) trying to kill talk and action towards universal healthcare. That's the reality. We need a third party that actually cares about the American people as a whole instead of caring about just the 1%.
 
I appreciate your desire to help the poor. The NT contains certain declarations:

1. When helping the poor, it's Christians first!

2. People who don't work should not receive certain (all!) handouts!

3. People who do not provide for their own families are worse than unbelievers!

:)

Can you point me to where it says these things in the bible, thanks.
 
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