Epilepsy = demonic possession!

[oldbadger]

Yes, I do believe in these things. I have heard by now many times over enough evidence from honest and sane people. Even by science 95% of the matter/energy in the universe is not directly detectable (sometimes called dark matter).

From 1973 until about 1977 my seriously epileptic and severely hysterical wife stopped having any fits, seizures, 'strokes' or convulsions after meeting with Harry Edwards of Leatherhead, a well known healer.

When she met him she told him that she did not believe, and he answered that this was OK because he was a 'healer' and no faith required.

When she became very ill again I made to contact Harry again but he had died or old age. I have kept a very open mind ever since those years.

 

[Skwim]

According to Matthew 17 v 14-18 it would appear Jesus believed those suffering from epilepsy were possessed by demons! In those far off days, it might have been forgivable for people to believe in such nonsense as a major epileptic seizure is very scary indeed. I have witnessed several as my husband has the condition after his brain haemorrhage in 2006, fortunately his meds control the seizures. In this day and age of modern medicine we know the cause of this condition, and of course mythical demons have nothing to do with it.

I have come across some ultra extreme Biblical literalists who not only believe demons actually exist, but epileptics are possessed by them. Hopefully no one on this forum is that silly?

Hopefully, but don't hold your breath. We have some real doozies here.

Hey! anyone here brave enough to admit you believe epilepsy is caused by demonic possession?
.​

 

[Quintessence]

In this day and age of modern medicine we know the cause of this condition, and of course mythical demons have nothing to do with it.

Truthfulness (or lack thereof) of this statement notwithstanding, the two explanations are not mutually exclusive. They can coexist and be complementary.

It is so sad that even today some think mythical demons exist and people are possessed by them.

Why is it sad?

 

[Kemosloby]

Actually you're wrong, I would be considered a lunatic if I didn't take psychiatric medication, so yes modern science can effectively cure or help control lunacy, same with epilepsy, there are all manner of medicines that can reduce the severity of epilepsy, and some really positive indications that marijuana can be used to control or prevent seizures.

I'm not trying to mess up your weed dreams....science is powerless over demons and will more likely get you high to keep you happy.

 

[YmirGF]

Why is it sad?

I cannot talk for @JJ50 but it is sad due to the enormous amount of work left to dispel belief in such nonsense as demons. That people living in the modern era still cling to such notions is troubling.

 

[Lyndon]

I'm not trying to mess up your weed dreams....science is powerless over demons and will more likely get you high to keep you happy.

I don't drink or do drugs, what about you????

 

[Lyndon]

I cannot talk for @JJ50 but it is sad due to the enormous amount of work left to dispel belief in such nonsense as demons. That people living in the modern era still cling to such notions is troubling.

You'd probably have a lot of problems with the teaching of the Buddha, because he believed in demons, devas, ghosts, demigods, gods and spirits!!

 

[Quintessence]

I cannot talk for @JJ50 but it is sad due to the enormous amount of work left to dispel belief in such nonsense as demons. That people living in the modern era still cling to such notions is troubling.

I'm going to back up a second here.

When you all are talking about "nonsense as demons" what, specifically, do you mean? What, specifically, are demons? How are you supposing people are "believing in" them and what are the specific consequences you think that belief has? In other words, how, specifically, is following this alternative paradigm (perhaps alongside modern ones) a problem?

I can see it for some cases - under some overtly ethnocentric assumptions - but not at all for others. I don't see anything inherently bad labeling that which is adversary to you as a "demon" and then perhaps using anthropomorphisms as a narrative device to explore that adversary, for example. That is a way of believing in demons. I also don't see anything inherently bad about someone supposing there is an otherworldly factor involved with a medical ailment such that they utilize modern and ancient practices (or even just one or the other - not really my business) to help cope with it. That is also a way of believing in demons. The only cases where I cringe a bit are those where traditional treatments are alleged to be counterproductive and cause harm, whether the patient is giving consensus or not. But even that is questionable given such assessments are, again, overtly ethnocentric. If some culture uses this as part of their customs, who the hell am I to tell them to knock it off?

I suppose I really like the Prime Directive from Star Trek, in spite of it being impractical and unworkable on planet Earth at present.

 

[idav]

I'm going to back up a second here.

When you all are talking about "nonsense as demons" what, specifically, do you mean? What, specifically, are demons? How are you supposing people are "believing in" them and what are the specific consequences you think that belief has? In other words, how, specifically, is following this alternative paradigm (perhaps alongside modern ones) a problem?

I can see it for some cases - under some overtly ethnocentric assumptions - but not at all for others. I don't see anything inherently bad labeling that which is adversary to you as a "demon" and then perhaps using anthropomorphisms as a narrative device to explore that adversary, for example. That is a way of believing in demons. I also don't see anything inherently bad about someone supposing there is an otherworldly factor involved with a medical ailment such that they utilize modern and ancient practices (or even just one or the other - not really my business) to help cope with it. That is also a way of believing in demons. The only cases where I cringe a bit are those where traditional treatments are alleged to be counterproductive and cause harm, whether the patient is giving consensus or not. But even that is questionable given such assessments are, again, overtly ethnocentric. If some culture uses this as part of their customs, who the hell am I to tell them to knock it off?

I suppose I really like the Prime Directive from Star Trek, in spite of it being impractical and unworkable on planet Earth at present.

If an American says they believe in Angels and Demons they might be telling the truth.
Poll: Nearly 8 in 10 Americans believe in angels

 

[Kemosloby]

I don't drink or do drugs, what about you????

Nothing against drinking, it just forget to have a drink most of the time. I would use drugs medicinally if any good ones were legal, didn't require a prescription and were reasonably priced.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Joan of Arc might have been an epileptic, people couldn't decide if she was a saint or demon possessed, history says she was a saint and the clergy were the devils in sheeps clothing.
Was Joan of Arc Epileptic? | The Future of the Mind

St. Joan of Arc was not epileptic.

"A number of more recent scholars attempted to explain her visions in psychiatric or neurological terms. Potential diagnoses have included epilepsy, migraine, tuberculosis, and schizophrenia.[109] None of the putative diagnoses have gained consensus support, and many scholars have argued that she didn't display any of the objective symptoms that can accompany the mental illnesses which have been suggested, such as schizophrenia. Dr. Philip Mackowiak dismissed the possibility of schizophrenia and several other disorders (Temporal Lobe Epilepsy and ergot poisoning) in a chapter on Joan of Arc in his book Post-Mortem in 2007.[110]

Dr. John Hughes rejected the idea that Joan of Arc suffered from epilepsy in an article in the academic journal Epilepsy & Behavior.[111]"
Joan of Arc - Wikipedia

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I believe in demons and in possession but not that epilepsy is caused by demons. It's just an illness.

 

[Revoltingest]

if you actually talk to a bona fide schizophrenic about what the voices say, some of them do sound like demons tormenting the poor guy, modern science would say the voices all come from inside his head, I'm not convinced.

Something interesting in the news....
Scientists zap 'voices' from schizophrenia sufferers
[PARIS] Scientists have pinpointed a part of the brain where "voices" torment schizophrenia
sufferers, and partially muted them with magnetic pulse treatment, a team reported on Tuesday.
More than a third of sufferers treated with magnetic pulses in a patient trial experienced "significant"
relief, the scientists said in a statement.
"We can now say with some certainty that we have found a specific anatomical area of the brain
associated with auditory verbal hallucinations in schizophrenia," the team said.
"Secondly, we have shown that treatment with high frequency TMS (Transcranial Magnetic
Stimulation) makes a difference to at least some sufferers."

 

[Shadow Wolf]

For the ancients, it's easy to understand how observing and/or experiencing a seizure could have been thought to be caused my malevolent spirits.
For the people today, there's no excuse because we know what's behind a seizure and the various things that can potentially trigger one.

 

[YmirGF]

I'm going to back up a second here.

When you all are talking about "nonsense as demons" what, specifically, do you mean? What, specifically, are demons? How are you supposing people are "believing in" them and what are the specific consequences you think that belief has? In other words, how, specifically, is following this alternative paradigm (perhaps alongside modern ones) a problem?

I can see it for some cases - under some overtly ethnocentric assumptions - but not at all for others. I don't see anything inherently bad labeling that which is adversary to you as a "demon" and then perhaps using anthropomorphisms as a narrative device to explore that adversary, for example. That is a way of believing in demons. I also don't see anything inherently bad about someone supposing there is an otherworldly factor involved with a medical ailment such that they utilize modern and ancient practices (or even just one or the other - not really my business) to help cope with it. That is also a way of believing in demons. The only cases where I cringe a bit are those where traditional treatments are alleged to be counterproductive and cause harm, whether the patient is giving consensus or not. But even that is questionable given such assessments are, again, overtly ethnocentric. If some culture uses this as part of their customs, who the hell am I to tell them to knock it off?

I suppose I really like the Prime Directive from Star Trek, in spite of it being impractical and unworkable on planet Earth at present.

Even though I have very strong views on the topic I do appreciate your post. Thank you. In the spirit of your post (pun intended) I do agree that belief in demons or demonic, well anything, exists within the realm of primitive civilizations and perhaps people who hold onto such primitive ideas. In person, I would, in fact, do little to dispel a person's ideas about demons, not because I could not launch an effective argument, but rather, because I would understand that such lunacy is not easily detached once it has taken hold. I would take the "Prime Directive" approach and simply assume I had encountered an incredibly primitive personality and quickly move away from them lest I catch some kind of infection.

I have to make dinner now, but will ponder this a bit more and get back to ya.

 

[Lyndon]

Way to insult someone, yay!!

 

[Etritonakin]

It is so sad that even today some think mythical demons exist and people are possessed by them.

I suppose it is good that many people are unaware of such things, but there are even humans who seek power to do such things (similar to the movie "Push") -and the demons are happy to oblige. They are simply a different sort of being (and more powerful and capable), but similar to humans psychologically.

In another movie, a man stares at a goat until the goat dies.
The man might think he has tapped into some sort of unknown human power, but an unseen power can use such to manipulate.

I'm not saying the movies reflect reality accurately, but -at the very least -people are thinking about such things and attempting to do them.

It might seem ridiculous, but the world is going to get very weird very quickly.
It is actually already becoming so, but not all realize it for various reasons.

You might check out Rev 16, etc. -so you have some background (it helps you freak out less should you ever experience something very weird).

Some do believe actual illnesses are demonic activity, but that misunderstanding has nothing to do with whether or not demons (the rebellious third of the angels) exist.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I'm not saying the movies reflect reality accurately, but -at the very least -people are thinking about such things and attempting to do them.

The psychic research was eventually shut down because it produced nothing, but it's actually pretty scary how accurately that movie does reflect reality, including the part of trying to train people to kill by thought, and even lacing the water with LSD and giving it to unsuspecting troops (it wasn't a party though). Of course it's exaggerated to fill a comical purpose, but the government is that nutty, that sadistic, that batty, and that cruel.

 

[YmirGF]

You'd probably have a lot of problems with the teaching of the Buddha, because he believed in demons, devas, ghosts, demigods, gods and spirits!!

I won't even entertain the idea that Buddha himself believed in the unholy crew. It says more about what those around him believed and that he simply worked through the muck as best as he could.

Way to insult someone, yay!!

Heck, I haven't even begun to sink my teeth into this topic. Hang tight.

 

[JesusBeliever]

According to Matthew 17 v 14-18 it would appear Jesus believed those suffering from epilepsy were possessed by demons! In those far off days, it might have been forgivable for people to believe in such nonsense as a major epileptic seizure is very scary indeed. I have witnessed several as my husband has the condition after his brain haemorrhage in 2006, fortunately his meds control the seizures. In this day and age of modern medicine we know the cause of this condition, and of course mythical demons have nothing to do with it.

I have come across some ultra extreme Biblical literalists who not only believe demons actually exist, but epileptics are possessed by them. Hopefully no one on this forum is that silly?

Hi there, I had seizures identical to those recorded in Matthew and what I can tell you is that I myself was and am convinced from the experience within my own body that I was being demon oppressed. Please note that I was conscious during my seizures. Something my mum had been told for years was impossible. And it was only through seeking the Lord Jesus in prayer that my particular seizures eventually stopped, just like in the story. I was once stabbed with an injection to knock me out during a seizure and apparently I woke up soon after upon hearing my mothers voice and snarled at her. My mother said to the attending nurse, "I can tell you now, that is not my daughter." To which the nurse replied, "we've never seen this before."

I understand peoples reluctance to believe this as I also struggled with this belief system myself growing up. My greatest fear as a kid was that Christians would believe that I had been given these seizures coz I was exceptionally evil. And I feared their rejection. I now know as an adult that this is not the case, and that they want deliverance and healing for the sufferer. And I'm thankful for those believers who have had the courage to keep the conversation alive despite being viewed as silly, cruel or judgmental. So that other sufferers whom mainstream medicine have been unable to help, might find healing through our Lord Jesus Christ, the Great and Amazing Physician.

Yours sincerely