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Do we need to repent of our sins now?

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Just repenting doesn't bring us into union with God, we need to be forgiven of our sins.

1 John 1:9 (ESV Strong's) 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

If one confesses sin now, they are forgiven. If we don't, we will be judged for those sins on judgment day.

Repentance is changing your ways through deeds. JW teaches that deeds not just words (if words at all) does not equal repentance.

In Catholicism, through your deeds and repentance (confession), communion, and penitence you become one with god through christ.

That's how I understand repentants.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Because they teach that by the death of the imperfect human, the person is acquitted from their sins.

Yes. When you are sacrificed in christ, your sins die/flesh die at death and your spirit (at judgement so JW believe) arise to be judged by your deeds on earth.

You can't acquitte sins from a sinless person.

So one is forgiven "before" one dies, not acquitted by an imperfect death!

Forgiven and acquitted are two different things. When one repents, god forgives them. They still need to do deeds so their judgement will lead them to the right place. Hence why deeds are part of the salvation process. Just the forgiveness (or grace) does not require deeds.

Forgiveness does not.
Salvation does.

JW would have to confirm the last part, though. Baptist and Catholics see things different than JW
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Exactly, the Bible says we will be judged for our deeds, I agree 100%. The witnesses however, teach that we will NOT be judged for our deeds while alive, but for our deeds "during" judgment day.

In the bible, we are forgiven for our transgressions while alive.
In the bible, we are to do things for god while we are alive.

We are not judged by our deeds while we are alive. JW is right, we are judged after our death when judgement comes. That's in scripture.

I don't know if there is scripture saying we are judged while we are alive. Judgement happens for the living and the dead. There is spiritual death and physical death.

The problem with both JW and protestants is ya'll feel that after death, we do not exist. So, it's like a creepshow watching people rise from the dead to be judged.

Christianity-regardless the form--does not make any sense to me logically and morally speaking. Though I understand how you guys put together the pieces to make it make sense from you guys perspective.
 

djhwoodwerks

Well-Known Member
We are not judged by our deeds while we are alive. JW is right, we are judged after our death when judgement comes. That's in scripture.

I didn't say we are judged while we are alive, but judged for our sins at judgment day, whether alive or dead.

Witnesses teach that, "after" one dies, and are resurrected, they are not judged for their "deeds" from when they were alive.

*** bh p. 214 par. 3 Judgment Day—What Is It? ***
According to the apostle John’s vision, “scrolls were opened,” and “the dead were judged out of those things written in the scrolls according to their deeds.” (Revelation 20:12) Are these scrolls the record of people’s past deeds? No, the judgment will not focus on what people did before they died.


The problem with both JW and protestants is ya'll feel that after death, we do not exist.

I am neither of those. I believe that we continue to exist after death. Jesus said,

John 11:11 (ESV Strong's) 11 After saying these things, he said to them, “Our friend Lazarus has fallen asleep, but I go to awaken him.”

They teach that "sleep" means ceases to exist. Jesus was teaching that death is just another form of consciousness, because when we sleep, we don't cease to exist. We dream and breathe and continue to exist. If we die and cease to exist, why would Jesus compare it to "sleep"?
 

djhwoodwerks

Well-Known Member
Yes. When you are sacrificed in christ, your sins die/flesh die at death and your spirit (at judgement so JW believe) arise to be judged by your deeds on earth.

Romans 6:5-7 (ESV Strong's) 5 For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his. 6 We know that our old self was crucified with him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing, so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin. 7 For one who has died has been set free from sin.

Jesus redeemed us from inherent sin, when we confess Him as Lord and obey His word, not from day to day sins we commit. We are to ask forgiveness for day to day sins.

1 John 1:9 (ESV Strong's) 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Inherent sin is not plural, it's singular.
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Maybe this is a topic for a different thread.

My goal with this thread is to show that the witnesses, who claim to be the "only true religion" teach that we are not judged for the way we live our life "before" we die, because we are acquitted of our sins when we die, and are resurrected with a clean slate to start afresh "during" judgment day.
This is a true generalization. I think it is not honest of anyone to say that it isn't.
There is one difference and it is amazing. They say that it is presently the time of the end. During this time many people will be judged for the sin of not believing in them. All of us who hear and reject their message are giving up the possibility of a resurrection to God's promise of a new heaven and Earth. When the trumpet sounds and our hearts stop beating that is when we will die forever. I am not making this up. Because I don't believe it, I am something to be loathed, according to them.....and amazingly so!.....according to most people. Not that I worry about it. According to my knowledge, it is a good thing that I am not liked. Matthew 10:22 So, thanks!
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Romans 6:5-7 (ESV Strong's) 5 For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his. 6 We know that our old self was crucified with him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing, so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin. 7 For one who has died has been set free from sin.

Jesus redeemed us from inherent sin, when we confess Him as Lord and obey His word, not from day to day sins we commit. We are to ask forgiveness for day to day sins.

1 John 1:9 (ESV Strong's) 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Inherent sin is not plural, it's singular.

I don't speak in "christian" language so we could be saying the same thing or my understanding isn't protestant.

We are forgiven for our sins thereby given the hope and faith in christ that you will be cleansed from your inherited sin; and once cleansed, you will be judged by your deeds, and based on your deeds is based on whether you are in union with god -forever or die without remembrance- (JW)

Because you are forgiven, you are no longer inslaved in sin. Since you still are in the flesh and do not have a new body, you still have inherited sin (temptation of the flesh) and commit sins (transgressions against god) until you die and then, as JW says too, you will be cleansed after death after judgement.

The difference is I read that JW believe the earth would be a new earth and we will get new bodies. There are no such thing as spirits or souls.
 

djhwoodwerks

Well-Known Member
Maybe "REPENT" was the wrong word to use for my OP, I should have used FORGIVEN instead.

Do we need to be forgiven of our sins now? Can we, die in our sins and be acquitted/forgiven of them with our imperfect death?

John 8:24 (ESV Strong's) 24 I told you that you would die in your sins, for unless you believe that I am he you will die in your sins.”

How could Jesus tell them this if we are acquitted when we die? He didn't say, "you will die in your sins, but not to worry, you will be acquitted when you die and get a second chance".
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Those are correct! If we are forgiven of our sins while we are alive, we are sinless, so how can we be acquitted when we die? "You can't acquit sins from a sinless person"!

No. You are forgiven of your sins when you are alive. You are not acquitted of your sins until you die and according to JW, you are dead both spirit and flesh until judgement. When judgement comes, god judges you by your deeds. If he favors your deeds and faith, many protestants believe you will live with god forever sinless with a new body.

On earth, as long as you have flesh, you are not perfect; therefore, you can only receive forgiveness or pardon by grace. You are not saved yet.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
I didn't say we are judged while we are alive, but judged for our sins at judgment day, whether alive or dead.

Witnesses teach that, "after" one dies, and are resurrected, they are not judged for their "deeds" from when they were alive.

*** bh p. 214 par. 3 Judgment Day—What Is It? ***
According to the apostle John’s vision, “scrolls were opened,” and “the dead were judged out of those things written in the scrolls according to their deeds.” (Revelation 20:12) Are these scrolls the record of people’s past deeds? No, the judgment will not focus on what people did before they died.




I am neither of those. I believe that we continue to exist after death. Jesus said,

John 11:11 (ESV Strong's) 11 After saying these things, he said to them, “Our friend Lazarus has fallen asleep, but I go to awaken him.”

They teach that "sleep" means ceases to exist. Jesus was teaching that death is just another form of consciousness, because when we sleep, we don't cease to exist. We dream and breathe and continue to exist. If we die and cease to exist, why would Jesus compare it to "sleep"?

I'd have to ask a Jehovah's Witness what deeds they are judged on if not their present deeds during life. That does not make sense logically. Spiritual deeds? I don't know.

The latter, I've seen scripture for both sides. Though, it makes sense that the dead will cease to exist until the day of judgement. So, they are not saying they are gone forever. They are just saying they aren't walking around earth waiting to be judged.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Do we need to be forgiven of our sins now? Can we, die in our sins and be acquitted/forgiven of them with our imperfect death?

Yes, forgiven is a better word. Yes, you have to be forgiven of your sins now (or ask for forgiveness/repent) so you can be in union with god through jesus.

It makes less sense to die without asking for forgiveness. Once you do that, your whole life, you haven't made a union with god. That's like asking someone to marry you but you never formed a relationship to begin with.
 

djhwoodwerks

Well-Known Member
I'd have to ask a Jehovah's Witness what deeds they are judged on if not their present deeds during life.


They teach they are not judged for their deeds "before" they died.

*** bh p. 214 par. 3 Judgment Day—What Is It? ***
Are these scrolls the record of people’s past deeds? No, the judgment will not focus on what people did before they died. (While they are alive)

They are judged for their deeds "during" judgment day.

*** bh p. 215 Judgment Day—What Is It? ***
Thus, individuals will be judged on the basis of what they do during Judgment Day. (emphasis on DURING is theirs)
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
They teach they are not judged for their deeds "before" they died.

*** bh p. 214 par. 3 Judgment Day—What Is It? ***
Are these scrolls the record of people’s past deeds? No, the judgment will not focus on what people did before they died. (While they are alive)

They are judged for their deeds "during" judgment day.

*** bh p. 215 Judgment Day—What Is It? ***
Thus, individuals will be judged on the basis of what they do during Judgment Day. (emphasis on DURING is theirs)

Yes, I told you that. They don't believe in souls. When we die, we cease to exist. During judgment, after, you die, god will raise the dead from the ground and judge people by their deeds.

I don't understand what you're disagreeing with.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
If God forgives us of our sins, but still holds them against us until we die, has He really forgiven us?

Many protestants feel when they receive grace and forgiveness, god no longer holds them accountable for their inherited sin. Others say we don't have inherited sin but god died for our sins (with an s-transgressions) so that those who asked for his forgiveness (repent), they will by faith hope to live with god forever though jesus.

The idea is if you repent, he does not hold you accountable. I think JW think the same thing just they don't like the rituals involved with repentance.
 

DavidFirth

Well-Known Member
Acts 2:38
Peter replied, "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
 

djhwoodwerks

Well-Known Member
The idea is if you repent, he does not hold you accountable.

Asking for forgiveness and repenting are two different things. One can ask for forgiveness, and never repent. As you stated in an earlier post, repentance is a change of mind/heart. One can change their mind about stealing, after they have stolen, and never ask for forgiveness. Is that persons sin of theft forgiven even if never asking to be forgiven, just because they changed their mind?
 

djhwoodwerks

Well-Known Member
Yes, I told you that. They don't believe in souls. When we die, we cease to exist. During judgment, after, you die, god will raise the dead from the ground and judge people by their deeds.

I don't understand what you're disagreeing with.

What deeds are we judged by, the deeds we did while alive, before we died, or by the deeds we do after we are resurrected "during" judgment day?
 
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