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Why did you leave GOD?

U

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Im having a conversation in another thread, and a question just popped up.

To those who left from God-believing faiths.

Did you have a personal relationship with God?

EDIT: In this question, you must have believed God existed and had a personal relationship to answer the next question, what did HE do to make you leave rather than why did you leave Him.

If so, how did HE, not scripture (contradictions, terrible events, etc), not how you were raised (non religious, indoctrinated, etc), not your environment (other peer believers) influence you to leave your faith?

What did HE do to you that made you leave?

--
What I hear most is: "because I read the bible and see contradictions" or "its not rational and compatible with science" or "I just realized God does not exist. Hes just a fairy tale"

EDIT: What did God do in yojr personal relationship with Him to make you leave Him?
 
Last edited:
JustCallMeNick

JustCallMeNick

Member
Carlita said:
Im having a conversation in another thread, and a question just popped up.

To those who left from God-believing faiths.

First, did you know God personally?

If so, how did HE, not scripture (contradictions, terrible events, etc), not how you were raised (non religious, indoctrinated, etc), not your environment (other peer believers) influence you to leave your faith?

What did HE do to you that made you leave?

--
What I hear most is: "because I read the bible and see contradictions" or "its not rational and compatible with science" or revelation "I just realized God does not exist. Hes just a fairy tell"

What reason did GOD give you to leave Him?
Click to expand...
I have to say first off, this is a very theistic way of framing this question. Someone who transitions from theism to non-theism does so because they come to the conclusion that there is no God "there" to compel them to do anything one way or the other. So a better way to frame this might be, what did God NOT do to give you a reason to leave him?

For myself, I grew up with a very strong faith and a personal relationship with God (via Jesus) was always emphasized and important to me. I do have to say I have always been very "in my own head" with my faith; most of the time I found myself trying to be very rigorously intellectual about it all. That being said, there were times when I subjectively felt like God was near, or I felt a deep sense of calm while praying, or had an overwhelming emotional experience during times of prayer or worship (Evangelical music is very effective at inducing and capitalizing on that).
What I began to realize over time is that my life was really not any worse when my prayer life dropped off. I had begun to practice meditation and realized I could achieve the same sense of calm and clarity that I achieved while praying. Applying techniques and strategies to my life that I learned in Psychology classes or on the job working in mental health provided me with realizations just as insightful and helpful as anything that came to me during a private devotional time.
So what reason did God give me to leave him? He did nothing. And that's entirely the point.
 
U

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
JustCallMeNick said:
So what reason did God give me to leave him? He did nothing. And that's entirely the point
Click to expand...
I did mean what did He do, and this wraped it up. What did you want Him to do?

For me, I had a personal relationship with Him. He said "if you believe in me, you have to believe in my Father." Then I realized that people believed Jesus IS God not just His Son. I found I didnt believe in this teaching. I also agree with non trinitarians that He isnt God. I would have stayed in the Church if I believed in His Father. That one statement did it for me.

That is what "God" said to me that made me think why are you in a commitment by being in a relationship with the wrong person.

I know Christianity is always the victim in these threads. I wonder about other faiths too. (Off comment)
 
N

Nietzsche

The Last Prussian
Premium Member
Carlita said:
Im having a conversation in another thread, and a question just popped up.

To those who left from God-believing faiths.

Did you have a personal relationship with God?

If so, how did HE, not scripture (contradictions, terrible events, etc), not how you were raised (non religious, indoctrinated, etc), not your environment (other peer believers) influence you to leave your faith?

What did HE do to you that made you leave?

--
What I hear most is: "because I read the bible and see contradictions" or "its not rational and compatible with science" or "I just realized God does not exist. Hes just a fairy tale"

What reasons did GOD give you to leave Him?
Click to expand...
I told this story in Chat, but I'll tell it again because it's relevant to this;

I was in Bosnia in 2008-2009. I was doing some sight-seeing in the Balkans(this was a bit of a detour from my tour of Holocaust locations in the rest of Europe), and I'd just left the Banat region of Serbia(you can see where an ooooooold German community used to live there, was awesome). I was in a hilly area in Bosnia, not too far from Sarajevo, and decided to take some painkillers. So I did, and then started down a hill that looked much less steep than it was. As I skid down, it got softer & softer and eventually I lost footing.

I fell down, and tried to catch myself on the ground with my right hand & arm. My arm didn't stop on the ground. It went through. I was up to my elbow in what I can only describe as "people soup". I'd literally fallen into a mass grave. The smell was unlike anything I'd ever smelt before. Sickly sweet. Imagine someone burning sugar, meat & fruit all in the same pan. It took me a minute to realize what I fell into. I thought it was a sewage pit or some ****, but then I saw teeth(tiny, tiny teeth) and shreds of clothes and...yeah.

That was the last nail in the coffin for my faith in the God of Abraham. A week or so prior, I was at Mauthausen, where I read something an inmate had scratched into a board;

"Wenn es einen Gott gibt muß er mich um Verzeihung bitten."

"If there is a God, He will have to beg my forgiveness."

This work as an answer?
 
1137

1137

Here until I storm off again
Premium Member
I gave up because god couldn't be what I wanted it to be, and I was too young, angry, and in pain to realize that was only my fault. Beside that this is a pretty personal question, something I rarely say.

I also believe again.
 
P

Parsimony

Well-Known Member
Carlita said:
What did HE do to you that made you leave?
Click to expand...
If this question is addressed to people who no longer believe in God, then surely you realize that it is loaded? To them, He could not have done anything to them because He is not real. It would kind of be like asking people who do not believe in Santa Claus what Santa Claus did to them to make them stop believing in him. It's a contradiction.
 
U

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
I was wondering if they first had a personal relationship with them and if so, what did He do to make them leave.

EDIT. If readers didnt have a personal relationship with God or they never believed He existed to begin with, the question would not apply to them.

Emergence said:
If this question is addressed to people who no longer believe in God, then surely you realize that it is loaded? To them, He could not have done anything to them because He is not real. It would kind of be like asking people who do not believe in Santa Claus what Santa Claus did to them to make them stop believing in him. It's a contradiction.
Click to expand...
 
P

Parsimony

Well-Known Member
Carlita said:
I was wondering if they first had a personal relationship with them and if so, what did He do to make them leave.
Click to expand...
Even if they did have a relationship with Him, it would still have the same problem of contradiction. If they don't believe now, then it's meaningless to ask them what a non-existent being did to them. They would simply have changed the way that they viewed the relationship (i.e. it was an illusion of some kind).
 
U

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Emergence said:
Even if they did have a relationship with Him, it would still have the same problem of contradiction. If they don't believe now, then it's meaningless to ask them what a non-existent being did to them. They would simply have changed the way that they viewed the relationship (i.e. it was an illusion of some kind).
Click to expand...
That doesnt make sense. If I had a relationship with my girlfriend and she broke up with me, I may say "she broke with me because or this" or id say "we were not in a relationship to begin with" or maybe "i never had a relationship with anyone"

To say one has a personal relationship with someone that does not exist does not make sense.

So to those who believe He exists and had a personal relationship with Him, what di God do to make you leave?

(I didnt point the thread to hard atheists)
 
Marisa

Marisa

Well-Known Member
Carlita said:
Oh wow. If youre writer, id save that in a collection.

Okay. Please clarify. You left God because you fell into a grave?
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Would a loving god allow something like what he described to occur? That's what the quote from the death camp means.
 
Marisa

Marisa

Well-Known Member
Carlita said:
That doesnt make sense. If I had a relationship with my girlfriend and she broke up with me, I may say "she broke with me because or this" or id say "we were not in a relationship to begin with" or maybe "i never had a relationship with anyone"

To say one has a personal relationship with someone that does not exist does not make sense.

So to those who believe He exists and had a personal relationship with Him, what di God do to make you leave?

(I didnt point the thread to hard atheists)
Click to expand...
You're starting with the presupposition that god does exist. Your question is kind of like asking someone when he stopped beating his wife.
 
N

Nietzsche

The Last Prussian
Premium Member
Carlita said:
That is disturbing. I dont see the connection though.
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Why would an all-loving, all-powerful god allow that to happen? The Holocaust, the Rwandan Genocide, the Bosnian Genocide..

Those are not the acts of an omnipotent, all-loving God. I cannot believe, and even were I given proof, would not believe, in the God of Abraham.
 
Ouroboros

Ouroboros

Coincidentia oppositorum
Carlita said:
Did you have a personal relationship with God?
Click to expand...
How does anyone have a personal relationship with God? People said this when I was Christian, and I repeated the same phrase and even claimed I had a personal relationship, but did I really? I prayed. I read the Bible I went to church. I was active. I really, really, really believed, except for the times when I had doubt, then I didn't believe. But was it personal? I'm going out tonight with my wife and my friends. We're going out for dinner and drinks. That's personal. I know what my wife, and my best buddy likes when it comes to beer, drinks, etc. I don't know what God wants. I asked many times, but didn't get any answer. I never heard a voice. I never saw signs. I looked for them. I waited for a voice. I wanted to see an angel at least. Nothing. Not even a simple miracle of any kind.

If so, how did HE, not scripture (contradictions, terrible events, etc), not how you were raised (non religious, indoctrinated, etc), not your environment (other peer believers) influence you to leave your faith?
Click to expand...
The lack of evidence. We, as a family had a really tough time for many years (which we're still suffering from), and we needed God's help to get out of it or at least get some comfort. We didn't. I lost my faith. My wife lost her faith. My kids lost their faith. People around us started to doubt and question God even. So... it was the non-existence of the personal touch that caused it.

What did HE do to you that made you leave?
Click to expand...
He didn't do anything. That was the problem. Nothing. Simple, nothing at all. Not a word. Not a sign. Not a miracle. Not a thing.

--
What I hear most is: "because I read the bible and see contradictions" or "its not rational and compatible with science" or "I just realized God does not exist. Hes just a fairy tale"

What reasons did GOD give you to leave Him?
Click to expand...
The reasons he gave me was that he didn't even bothered to answer me when I asked him to tell me that he exists. He even refused to answer me that simple question.

Now, I've come around, however, and I realized that God doesn't speak in words and isn't personal like a person. God is everything. The universe, reality, nature, life, existence, all of it, that is God. Not some being that lives outside this universe, but rather IT that all things are made of, and we all participate in. We are part of God.
 
P

Parsimony

Well-Known Member
Carlita said:
That doesnt make sense. If I had a relationship with my girlfriend and she broke up with me, I may say "she broke with me because or this" or id say "we were not in a relationship to begin with" or maybe "i never had a relationship with anyone"
Click to expand...
Unless you later came to believe, for whatever reason, that your girlfriend never existed but was some kind of illusion, hallucination, trick, etc. instead.
To say one has a personal relationship with someone that does not exist does not make sense.
Click to expand...
Right, that's why they would only say at the time of their belief that they thought He actually existed. Afterwards, they would say that they were deluded into thinking they had a relationship.
So to those who believe He exists and had a personal relationship with Him, what di God do to make you leave?

(I didnt point the thread to hard atheists)
Click to expand...
Oh, so you are asking people who still believe there is a God? That's a different ballgame then.
 
Marisa

Marisa

Well-Known Member
Carlita said:
I understand that. Im trying to hear a direct answer. He left d because God didnt do anything to help him?
Click to expand...
More to the point god didn't do anything to help those 2-3,000 people rotting in a mass grave.

ETA: so answer the question, would a loving god allow genocide to occur?
 
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