Christians in the military

[Meshak]

More denial.

This does not change the fact that according to your bible god himself used the services of a military.

Suit yourself.

I know Jesus does not agree with you pro-military Christians.

Jesus is not for His followers killing each other. Jesus is not just for your country. Jesus is for the whole world. He does not play favoritism.

You can rant all you want. It does not change the fact that Jesus does not advocate killing each other.

 

[Shermana]

Suit yourself.

I know Jesus does not agree with you pro-military Christians.

Jesus is not for His followers killing each other. Jesus is not just for your country. Jesus is for the whole world. He does not play favoritism.

You can rant all you want. It does not change the fact that Jesus does not advocate killing each other.

Jesus also doesn't advocate letting your family members get physically assaulted while you sit there and do nothing either.

And Peter specifically advocates being ready to actually answer any question or challenge to your belief.

Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect,

What do you got against 1 Peter 3:15 so much?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Jesus says His followers are not of this world; military is of this world, they have no business butting into the political matters.

So Christians shouldn't be involved in politics either?

What else is "of this world"?

Yes, everyone owe tax to the government even Christians because we use public facility.

Just remember, this topic is about "christians" in the military.

FWIW, I once came across a tax protest by a Quaker group: they refused to pay the portion of their taxes that would have gone toward the Armed Forces and instead put it in an escrow account.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Jesus also doesn't advocate letting your family members get physically assaulted while you sit there and do nothing either.

He doesn't?

Matthew 5:39:

But I say to you, Do not resist the one who is evil.

 

[Shermana]

He doesn't?

Matthew 5:39:

See my earlier post where this common misunderstanding is addressed, he's referring to petty slaps and insults.

 

[sojourner]

I guess I just don't see the argument as valid. The OP is completely proof-texted, so does not bear up as evidence for the claim made. The OP has failed to show that Christians may not serve in the military. It's really just that simple.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

See my earlier post where this common misunderstanding is addressed, he's referring to petty slaps and insults.

Do you remember a post number?

 

[Shermana]

Do you remember a post number?

Here, I'll restate it.

FWIW, I think anyone who thinks Jesus was saying to not resist period in any situation like your family about to be brutally ravaged or something like that is deliberately attempting to avoid the context of the rest of the statement and would be implying Jesus was a complete idiot. I don't think ANYONE would have followed a teaching to not fight back in any situation whatsoever (except a few Darwin award candidates), and such a belief would have died out in a matter of months if that's how it was being interpreted.

The examples he uses are not life threatening situations. Being forced to walk a mile by a Roman Centurion, being slapped in the face, being sued, etc. All those have one thing in common: NOT LETHAL. Or even that dangerous.

The word "resist" in question here is not about Violent resistance. It's about opposing, but not like the English-language idea of "violent resistance".

Strong's Greek: 436. ????????? (anthistémi) -- to set against, i.e. withstand

I challenge you to find one use of Anthistemi where it applies to actual physical resistance in the face of danger.

This is the gotquestions.org article (A site I normally hate but is still a broken clock right twice a day) I used to support this notion.

What does the Bible say about self-defense?

Here's another:

What Did Jesus Mean When He Said to Turn the Other Cheek (Matthew 5:39)?* | Answers To Tough Questions

Does this mean that we should never resist when somebody attacks us? Should we let everyone take advantage of us?

This can’t be what Jesus meant. After all, Jesus denounced the Pharisees who attacked Him ( Matthew 23 ), and objected when He was struck by one of the officers of the high priest ( John 18:22-23). Further, He advised His disciples to take measures to defend themselves ( Matthew 10:16; Luke 22:36-38 ). He also declared that they shouldn’t worry beforehand about how they should respond to their enemies’ charges, because He would give them the right words to say so that their adversaries wouldn’t be able “to contradict or resist” them ( Luke 21:14-15 ).

Similarly, the apostle Paul aggressively defended himself against his enemies, asserting his rights as a Roman citizen, and making it clear to his attackers that there could be consequences if he were unlawfully harmed ( Acts 23:1-3; 25:14-27 ).

So I think it's quite clear that Jesus was not referring to total non-resistance in all situations, and that the word "resist" and the examples he gave were not about serious situations where life, limb, and physical sanctity were at stake.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Here, I'll restate it.

FWIW, I think anyone who thinks Jesus was saying to not resist period in any situation like your family about to be brutally ravaged or something like that is deliberately attempting to avoid the context of the rest of the statement and would be implying Jesus was a complete idiot. I don't think ANYONE would have followed a teaching to not fight back in any situation whatsoever (except a few Darwin award candidates), and such a belief would have died out in a matter of months if that's how it was being interpreted.

The examples he uses are not life threatening situations. Being forced to walk a mile by a Roman Centurion, being slapped in the face, being sued, etc. All those have one thing in common: NOT LETHAL. Or even that dangerous.

But he talks about potentially lethal situations in other passages. For instance, in the Matthew passage I quoted earlier, where he talks about how believers shouldn't even worry about where their food is going to come from. In other passages, he tells his disciples to go out without their moneybag or supplies.

AFAIK, starvation can be lethal. No?

 

[averageJOE]

Suit yourself.

I know Jesus does not agree with you pro-military Christians.

Jesus is not for His followers killing each other. Jesus is not just for your country. Jesus is for the whole world. He does not play favoritism.

You can rant all you want. It does not change the fact that Jesus does not advocate killing each other.

I'm talking about the actions of god, not jesus (unless you believe Jesus was god himself). Do you recognize that god used the services of a military to do his killings?

 

[Shermana]

But he talks about potentially lethal situations in other passages. For instance, in the Matthew passage I quoted earlier, where he talks about how believers shouldn't even worry about where their food is going to come from. In other passages, he tells his disciples to go out without their moneybag or supplies.

AFAIK, starvation can be lethal. No?

Totally different subjects. Going out without money has nothing to do with a person about to run you through with a sword. Besides, it's commonly argued that he was talking about a one time event, in which the Disciples were miraculously blessed with everything they'd need as they went out preaching. So by this logic, you'd have to assume that Jesus would be saying that they never would actually be run through or their families assaulted. Simply doesn't work, comparing apples to carrots.

Now with that said, it's quite obvious that Jesus was referring to petty slaps, insults, and lawsuits, not danger of being violently assaulted/killed. Besides, the context is "You have heard it said eye for an eye", it can also be said he was talking about not taking revenge on petty issues. But the idea that he was saying to just sit there and get assaulted/let your family get assaulted defies any logic, the ancients weren't THAT stupid.

 

[NIX]

I'm pretty sure I recal correctly that Yahweh warned the Jewish people not to put themselves under a king. But they wanted a king like all the other nations so their god finally did give them a king as they wanted.

Usually it's kings/emperors/presidents/prime ministers who lead armies and institute wars.

Not sure exactly what relevance my thoughts here have to the conversation.

 

[Shermana]

I'm pretty sure I recal correctly that Yahweh warned the Jewish people not to put themselves under a king. But they wanted a king like all the other nations so their god finally did give them a king as they wanted.

Usually it's kings/emperors/presidents/prime ministers who lead armies and institute wars.

Not sure exactly what relevance my thoughts here have to the conversation.

He had Moses and Joshua lead them into battle quite often.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

does God give them that status?

Many Christians would say so....
Others would say that they were simply very "Godly" men.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

You've not really answered my question. Does everything happen according to God's will or not?

That is what is called a "Loaded" question.
It presupposes that God has a "Will" about everything.
Where in fact God has left many choices down to us.

While our "Freewill" might entail choices that go against his teachings.
and result in his condemnation, these bad choices are always open to us.
Were that not to be the case "Evil" and "Sin" would not exist.
The corollary is the existence and need for repentance and forgiveness

 

[dawny0826]

Sorry, this thread is about "Jesus' servants" not "Your nation's servants"



How am I being hypocrite for serving Jesus? I am Jesus' servant.

I'm sorry that I misunderstood the intent of your OP.

 

[Meshak]

He had Moses and Joshua lead them into battle quite often.

True Christians dont live by OT practice. They follow Jesus' teachings and commands.

Jesus is Christ. That's why Jesus' followers are called "Christians".

 

[Meshak]

I'm sorry that I misunderstood the intent of your OP.

Most here in this thread did not seem to read the OP.

I am protesting against Christians practicing the military because they are misrepresenting Jesus with this practice. Jesus is not for the war. Jesus is called prince of peace.

blessings.

 

[Meshak]

I'm pretty sure I recal correctly that Yahweh warned the Jewish people not to put themselves under a king. But they wanted a king like all the other nations so their god finally did give them a king as they wanted.

Usually it's kings/emperors/presidents/prime ministers who lead armies and institute wars.

Not sure exactly what relevance my thoughts here have to the conversation.

Please read the OP. This thread is about "Christians in the military".

 

[Meshak]

Everyone,

The title of this thread is about "Christians in the military".

This is not about the military itself. Christians have no right to interfere with political matters. that is another reason for Christians should not get involve with the military.

Jesus says that His followers are not of this world. His followers have no business butting into the political issues. The military is political matter.