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why are the clergy so fanatical against homosexuals?

Shiranui117

Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
Premium Member
What exactly are you talking about? Are you talking about the ban against homosexual marriage and the condemnation of homosexual acts?

If you think the Orthodox Church itself hates homosexuals as people, this is not the case. Homosexuals are often encouraged to become priests and monks. If you saw the Comparative Religions thread, you'll see that one such individual, Fr. Seraphim Rose, is actually beginning to be regarded as a Saint.

EDIT: I will note that any animosity towards homosexuals on the part of anyone, whether of the Orthodox Church or any other religion, is due to ignorance at best, and bigotry at worst. Any priest who is hostile to homosexuals is clearly out of line; the clergy are never to cause spiritual harm to the faithful, knowingly or unknowingly. I strongly feel that, if there is any discrimination against homosexuals as people in the Church, it will fade out as homosexuals are better understood. And as homosexuals are better understood, the clergy will more consistently be able to offer greater spiritual guidance and aid. The Church has always been made up of imperfect people, but this is no excuse for discriminating between people in the Church, and building back up the middle wall of division between mankind that Christ broke down.
 
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davidthegreek

Active Member
What exactly are you talking about? Are you talking about the ban against homosexual marriage and the condemnation of homosexual acts?

If you think the Orthodox Church itself hates homosexuals as people, this is not the case. Homosexuals are often encouraged to become priests and monks. If you saw the Comparative Religions thread, you'll see that one such individual, Fr. Seraphim Rose, is actually beginning to be regarded as a Saint.

EDIT: I will note that any animosity towards homosexuals on the part of anyone, whether of the Orthodox Church or any other religion, is due to ignorance at best, and bigotry at worst. Any priest who is hostile to homosexuals is clearly out of line; the clergy are never to cause spiritual harm to the faithful, knowingly or unknowingly. I strongly feel that, if there is any discrimination against homosexuals as people in the Church, it will fade out as homosexuals are better understood. And as homosexuals are better understood, the clergy will more consistently be able to offer greater spiritual guidance and aid. The Church has always been made up of imperfect people, but this is no excuse for discriminating between people in the Church, and building back up the middle wall of division between mankind that Christ broke down.


Your words are so encouraging and quite rational. But what do you mean by "orthodox". The reason I am asking is because I have been given a different response every time regarding that. Do you mean an orthodox protestant, or eastern orthodox? Thanks
 

Shiranui117

Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
Premium Member
Your words are so encouraging and quite rational. But what do you mean by "orthodox". The reason I am asking is because I have been given a different response every time regarding that. Do you mean an orthodox protestant, or eastern orthodox? Thanks
I mean Eastern Orthodox, though I also consider the Oriental Orthodox to be Orthodox as well. Protestants are not Orthodox. Whether or not the "O" is capitalized will tell you if the person is speaking of Orthodox Christianity (if capitalized) or Protestantism/Catholicism (not-capitalized)
 

davidthegreek

Active Member
I mean Eastern Orthodox, though I also consider the Oriental Orthodox to be Orthodox as well. Protestants are not Orthodox. Whether or not the "O" is capitalized will tell you if the person is speaking of Orthodox Christianity (if capitalized) or Protestantism/Catholicism (not-capitalized)


Ok. Thanks now I get it. But these day everyone believes they are Orthodox. Even if they have nothing to do with it.
 

Shiranui117

Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
Premium Member
Ok. Thanks now I get it. But these day everyone believes they are Orthodox. Even if they have nothing to do with it.
Again, look at whether the O's capitalized or not... There can be a big difference between people calling themselves "Orthodox Christian" and "orthodox Christian." ;)

And yes, there are annoying cases where non-Orthodox call themselves Orthodox, either they're posing as "Orthodox" in an attempt to poach the true Orthodox (many Protestant "evangelists" to traditionally Orthodox countries do this, going so far as even to imitate the Orthodox liturgy, priesthood and iconography to deceive the faithful there), or they know of the Orthodox Church, and are trying to set themselves up in opposition to her. I see lots of Roman Catholics doing this especially, calling themselves "Orthodox Catholics."
 

ForeverFaithful

Son Worshiper
Haven't heard any sermons on homosexuality, in fact most of them have been about forgiveness and virtue. In fact aside from when those outside the Church go on the offence I rarely hear it mentioned at all. It's a clearly teaching of the church, that sex is for a married heterosexual monogamous couple, but we don't feel the need to fanatical about it. This of course excludes some schismatic and near schismatic groups who make it part of their agenda to go insane about about it, either to be liberal or pseudo-traditionalist
 

kjw47

Well-Known Member
I really want to know that.


Gods word teaches 1 corinthians 6:9-11--- fornicators( sex out of marriage) ,adulterers,homosexuals,drunkards( drug addicts) idolotors,greedy,thieves-- ( athiests,false god worshippers can be included) will not inherit Gods kingdom( eternal life)-- it goes on to say--that is what some of you were( past tense= true repentence-they stopped doing these gross sins that God will not accept)
i dont see why the homosexuals think they are being targeted--all of those listed are in the same boat--what percentage of mankind does one think falls into this category? Jesus taught--FEW will find the road leading to eternal life.
 

Shiranui117

Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
Premium Member
Gods word teaches 1 corinthians 6:9-11--- fornicators( sex out of marriage) ,adulterers,homosexuals,drunkards( drug addicts) idolotors,greedy,thieves-- ( athiests,false god worshippers can be included) will not inherit Gods kingdom( eternal life)-- it goes on to say--that is what some of you were( past tense= true repentence-they stopped doing these gross sins that God will not accept)
i dont see why the homosexuals think they are being targeted--all of those listed are in the same boat--what percentage of mankind does one think falls into this category? Jesus taught--FEW will find the road leading to eternal life.
It's interesting to note that the word translated as "homosexual," μαλακός, actually refers to a catamite:

metaph. in a bad sense
  1. effeminate
    1. of a catamite
    2. of a boy kept for homosexual relations with a man
    3. of a male who submits his body to unnatural lewdness
    4. of a male prostitute
Catamite - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Malakos - New Testament Greek Lexicon - King James Version
 

Desert Snake

Veteran Member
Again, look at whether the O's capitalized or not... There can be a big difference between people calling themselves "Orthodox Christian" and "orthodox Christian." ;)

And yes, there are annoying cases where non-Orthodox call themselves Orthodox, either they're posing as "Orthodox" in an attempt to poach the true Orthodox (many Protestant "evangelists" to traditionally Orthodox countries do this, going so far as even to imitate the Orthodox liturgy, priesthood and iconography to deceive the faithful there), or they know of the Orthodox Church, and are trying to set themselves up in opposition to her. I see lots of Roman Catholics doing this especially, calling themselves "Orthodox Catholics."

Protestants don't have icons. What is the church called of these so called "Orthodox Protestants"?
 

Shiranui117

Pronounced Shee-ra-noo-ee
Premium Member
Protestants don't have icons. What is the church called of these so called "Orthodox Protestants"?
They're not Orthodox. They're Protestants who mimic the Orthodox to try and poach the faithful. This has happened, especially in Georgia (the country, not the state)

DSC_0212.jpg


The congregations of the Evangelical Baptist Church of Georgia represent a fascinating case study in Baptist receptive ecumenism that includes striking forms of liturgical as well as ecclesiological reception. In a culture that is historically Eastern Orthodox, the Evangelical Baptist Church of Georgia has maintained “belief in believer’s baptism, autonomy of the local church, freedom of conscience and religious liberty,” while adopting an ecclesial structure that is a hybrid of congregational and episcopal governance with a threefold ministry of bishops, presbyters, and deacons. In this structure the local congregations are autonomous in relation to one another and to the structure of the Evangelical Baptist Church of Georgia, but they are presided over by a bishop, whose office is a “symbol of unity” with the “responsibility...to provide spiritual guidance to the whole church as prophet, preacher, and teacher of the Gospel.” The ministers of the Evangelical Baptist Church wear Orthodox vestments and employ the Orthodox use of the sign of the cross, incense, and icons in their worship services. The Church sponsors monastic orders for men and women and a school of iconography. As their archbishop puts it, they “technically should be considered a Reformed Orthodox Church.
Source.

In other words, it's nothing more than wolves in sheep's clothing. They mean to deceive the Orthodox and trick them into leaving the Church.
 
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