Satanic Governance

[Adramelek]

What would be your idea of a Satanic or LHP form of government, for instance what kind of rule of law would be implaced and how should it be enforced? The concept of human morality, how would it be affected? Etc...

Xeper.
/Adramelek\

 

[Adramelek]

Also, would a Satanic form of government be something like or a combination of Capitalism, Marxism, Imperialist, Aristocratic, Isolationist, Platonic, facist, dictatorial, socialistic, etc?.. Please explain.

Xeper.
/Adramelek\

 

[Mindmaster]

What would be your idea of a Satanic or LHP form of government, for instance what kind of rule of law would be implaced and how should it be enforced? The concept of human morality, how would it be affected? Etc...

Xeper.
/Adramelek\

Realistically this is probably impossible without military action. Sorry, if you want to reset the system someone has to tear down the current one. Now assuming that could occur. You are left with the dilemma that all current laws are based on Abrahamic belief systems. The problem with this is that while Christianity is rather non-racially specific Islam and Judaism are highly semetic and you basically are launching a race war once you go against them and even if you are fair in dealing with them they will see it that way. It takes far less to motivate these people to kill others -- if you aren't ready to crack a few eggs you might as well not even start. The powers that be are well aware of this thus all the false flag attacks in foreign countries and the like.

At this juncture I feel it is impossible to go straight to this and really the first step is writing a book of Satanic thought that isn't cowing to Satanists. It has to be educational and enlightening; think what Mien Kampf did for Hitler. Certainly, I am not advocating his platform but understand what that book meant for his movement. Without putting these informative pieces out and heavily promoting there is really nothing to win. This book was the sole reason that Hitler wasn't a bum or starving artist and became a cult of personality type figure -- read about Hitler's life before the Reich -- he was nothing more than drifter/vagabond. Rebellion is always empowered by the people, and thus to have a lasting change you have to change minds. Power really can only be sustained as so far as it is directly supported or mindlessly tolerated.

Our entire constitution would have to be destroyed and legal system removed. In a LHP government other people cannot decide your fate OR make laws on your behalf. It is do-able.

1) Absolute freedom is the only required right. No law can be made for or against an individual. The prevents people from using law against others plain and simple. It works against another persons freedom to deprive them of possessions or harm them so thus this is still illegal. Corporations are not people and are not protected like them. Half of our problems are from laws being applied unfairly, but the other half is them being forced through on the backs of rogue bills due to corporate interests.

2) Military and other socially related institutions have to be run like non-profit organizations. They have to be completely worthless and powerless other than for their intended purpose. You need a military only to defend you from attack you don't need one to conquer Iraq. Thus you may have to pay tax to pay for the military, but your amount can be the same as everyone. No more three hundred dollar hammers at least if the democratically voted admins don't want to lose their jobs. We currently suffer from this because all of these people are appointees of corporations whom make the hammers ( because the funded someone higher up the chain..). Conversely, this means we don't have to enlist people (pay them all day for doing nothing, really...) -- we merely call up volunteer forces to protect the homeland. Other countries in the EU already do this -- most of them simply have a one year mandatory service (simply to train them) and then its just as needed or voluntary. If there is no money to be made in it then it stays on task. We currently spend around five thousand a person to defend this country per year. Please understand how ridiculous this number is when the average price of a handgun is $300-$800 and a rifle is $200-$2000. It would be cheaper to buy every grown person in the country a rifle. Crime would probably drop too -- as historically, in areas where guns are common the crime rate is lower.

3) Any and all government officials would be merely administrative to see that things like health, defense, and other social and economic concerns are safe. Key people need to be democratically elected. We have computers and the web, and we can give people a pin or code to cast their vote. We no longer need representative government outside of ambassadors to other nations (where it would be very difficult to do otherwise).

4) State governments only add complexity and duplication. We're probably wasting half our money simply pushing paper between state and federal offices that do the same thing. Taxation has to be donation based -- if someone truly cannot afford something they should not have to pay, but they shouldn't expect the benefits either. It should be possible to pay 'a la carte' for the services you support. As soon as someone else decides where your money goes the corruption begins. This also deals with the freeloaders as well.

5) Non-fictional information has to be supported with scientific fact whether that be proof via a method or hard evidence. No more faith in anything -- there is either evidence or you aren't allowed to say that it isn't anything but a fiction. it cannot be presented as a truth even at home. Understand that I am a theistic Satanist and I hold myself to this. A truthful religion is not afraid of science and learning in fact ultimately they must meet completely if either approach is valid. We are making our kids stupid and it's starting right in the living room.

Just some ideas... far from perfect... but very simplified.

 

[Orias]

Let me start of by saying, with the way humans are now I think that a Satanic government would be one that is constantly changing and being overthrown.

Even stupid people live in majority, so when their very existence or way of life is threatened they may feel the need to strike back.

Other than that, the ideal Satanic government would be one that is more neutral and tab keeping (but very active behind the scenes).

The process would involve an entire reconstruction of the education system and moral standard.

Churches would be heavily taxed and law enforcement would focus more on the larger liabilities in the social life. Even with that being said, the system would have to broken down in a way that is already more complex then the government of the United States.

Prisons would be likely to be replaced with death camps, which disposes of the murderers and rapists without worrying about handing them back to society. It would very harsh and would take a very strong toppling over of the moral system as we know it.

Onto morals, the system would be likely to drop the "Golden Rule" and adopt the dictum of "Do unto others as they do unto you". It would be a much more efficient way of weeding out the weak and unintelligible and making more room for the potential.

In all, the initial movement would require a very large destruction or "cleansing" of the human race (which at this point would be entirely self destructive).

But then again, with all of that being said, the government in the United States as I know it is pretty Satanic already.

 

[Mindmaster]

But then again, with all of that being said, the government in the United States as I know it is pretty Satanic already.
[/COLOR]

Actually, we have the most puritanical society in the world next to the Arab nations. Everyone else is far more tolerant and understanding than we are. It comes out in morality, the content of our art and music, and even what is taught (and not taught) in our schools. We can't even swear on the radio or TV, or even here. If we weren't so weak-kneed, archaic, misogynistic, and fearful we wouldn't care if a naked man or woman graced our TV it wouldn't even be an event but no this is like still hot crap despite the fact that we were aware of our parts over two million years ago. No, we are living the toddler version of the content of life because that is all we can handle. We're afraid of violence, nudity, and all the other things that always have happened and we do our best not to talk of them just because the fearful notion that we in fact may be just like all the other animals on the rock.

 

[Orias]

I think thats an older and perhaps outdated observation, now days all you see on t.v is sex and violence and subtle underlying curses.

Our government itself is oppositional, because it feels the need to try and correct everything within its realm of reach.

I've always been one to say, the Christian Church is one of the most Satanic entities I'm aware of.

 

[Adramelek]

You both make some interesting points in your posts. In our time I think Nazi Germany was a form of government which derived its power through the fusion of ancient Germanic magic and traditions and politics. A tremendous magical force was unleashed upon the world and was tragically misdirected through extreme antisemetism and notions of racial purity and many other factors. But once the Wolf of Ragnarok is freed upon the world, there is no stopping him till he has had his fill of spilled human blood, chaos, and destruction.

Aside from all that, I wouldn't mind living in any society who's form of governance protects my individual rites to life, liberty, property and otherwise stays the hell out of my life and pocketbook.

Xeper.
/Adramelek\

 

[jasonwill2]

What would be your idea of a Satanic or LHP form of government, for instance what kind of rule of law would be implaced and how should it be enforced? The concept of human morality, how would it be affected? Etc...

Xeper.
/Adramelek\

Also, would a Satanic form of government be something like or a combination of Capitalism, Marxism, Imperialist, Aristocratic, Isolationist, Platonic, facist, dictatorial, socialistic, etc?.. Please explain.

Xeper.
/Adramelek\

I think it would probably be, if it was to NOT be hypocritical and be based on my personal understanding of Satanism:

It would be socially libertarian but probably economically right-winged with a free market. People with inheritable diseases would be dissuaded from having kids, social security would probably cover less people if any at all (though I disagree on these economics as I feel a moderate economical model in terms of left and right wing economics).

I don't know about health-care and education, but I would suspect it would be the same as anywhere else. Actually, education would probably be federal, and have a lot more focus on improving student performance so that the country could compete in the world, since hardwork and excellence are Satanic virtues.

It would probably, if it has any common sense, be a representative democracy to stop the abuse of power by aristocracy and tyrants, but I fear some Satanic views might make a stratified class system based on economics, which is complete bull imho.

It would have, or strive for, a strong military and be quick and decisive in ending and engaging in warfare, and they would probably not hold any punches. They would probably be isolationist politically speaking as much as possible.

There would most likely be freespeech, and Christians would probably not feel very welcome AT ALL. Though on some takes of Satanism Christianity may not even be allowed.

I would think that justice might be heavy handed, but on a point I disagree with many Satanists I think that in a number of cases rehabilitation IS better both for preventing crime and reducing police budgets. For example, putting people in prison for drug possession doesn't stop them... because they are addicted. Only treatment will stop them from committing more minor drug possession offenses. As for murder and rape, prison time is a must. I don't think for the most part that prisoners can be trusted to do work as part of their sentencing, at least it should be limited because if it's overused then arresting people and half-assing a conviction could turn into a cheap labor force for the government.

Though police action would probably be more heavy-handed in say the gettos, even though I disagree that that is the right tactic as the problem is economic at the root, not the actual gangs that people join for survival. So heavy handed would probably happen and might be good for short-term benifits but really wouldnt be a viable long-term goal for dealing with crime infested areas, and would just increase the body count.

Self-defense though might be easier to convince in courts, in the sense of the "stand your ground" laws, but I personally think that it would be best done more moderately than those laws, and if anyone has any sense you won't be able to initiate physical violence because someone is harassing you, as that really isn't a sensible way to deal with things in general.

In many ways a Satanic government would be good, and in other ways very bad, especially from say a LaVeyan point of view... it would need to make compromises and be moderately Satanic in some ways. We are at a point in history where-as the "law of the jungle" mentality is very impractical. That only really works when you are surrounded by marauders, general wars and already brutal situations. An example of when "law of the Jungle" might be appropriate is like with many African countries that are constantly at war, at least to keep the order and the general population safe. But it wouldn't work with say most developing or developed nations.

I can't really think of any other points right now.

 

[Cassiopia]

An interesting question but almost impossible to answer, since I don't think there will ever be a consensus of what Satanic values and priorities actually are other than an emphasis on individualism perhaps. The divergent replies so far here from the small number of Satanists on this board are evidence of that.
I would agree with some of the points that seem to have some agreement here, particularly on law and order. I don't agree with capital punishment except perhaps for terrorism or serial killers, but I do think all prison sentences should be doubled and prison should be primarily a place of punishment which strikes dread into the hearts of anybody considering committing a crime. Life sentences should mean life, but convicted lifers should be given a suicide pill which they could take at any time. Crimes of bigotry and prejudice would be punished more severely than now. On the other hand a lot of things should be taken out of the criminal realm altogether; for example drugs and prostitution should be fully legalized, taxed and controlled.

My views of the most appropriate type of government part company with a lot of Satanists. It should be strongly liberationist but run as a meritocracy with a limited amount of democracy. Since I believe that my needs (and most people's needs) are best met by having well run and administered universal benefits, health and education provision and an efficient national infrastructure the role and nature of government would be broadly socialist. There would be a limited and controlled place for capitalism in order to cater for consumerism and some service industries. The kind of society I envisage would at worst be something similar to modern day China and at best would be something like how Cuba might have been without the imposition of the embargo.

There would be a huge emphasis on education with science given priority. Faith schools would be banned, but multifaith religious and cultural education should be available in all schools.

All religions and philosophies would be tolerated unless anything they did or advocated broke any pre-existing laws.

Defense and the military should be sufficient to truly defend the country from attack (which must include the possibility of a preemptive first strike). It should be a voluntary force, perhaps supplemented by volunteer prisoners whose prison sentences could be reduced if they agreed to serve as cannon fodder in the most vulnerable positions.

I don't particularly expect many people to agree with my vision of Satanic governance. And I am open to the possibility that some of my ideas will change over time. But that is the point. Satanism rates free will and intelligence very highly which means there is always going to be a lot of disagreement on some very fundamental issues. In truth I don't think we could have any form of consensual Satanic government at the moment. We might get ONE satanist's version of government imposed on us as a dictatorship, but then we would all rebel and destroy him or her. Perhaps Satanic government could only happen as an invisible background influence...

 

[The Sum of Awe]

100% Capitalist/Libertarian.

 

[Adramelek]

The Libertarian party is the most Satanic to me. As it promotes the rights and liberty of the individual and always defaults to freedom. Yes, law and order is essential to any civilized society as human beings by nature can be just as vicious as our four legged counterparts, but we have the ability to control our natural instincts.

On a personal note: my black heart goes out to those potential Setians, Satanists, other Occultists who are trapped in places across the world like the Middle East. In countries like Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Iran, or Seria, where they must remain in the closet for fear of being arrested for blasphemy and sentenced to cruel deaths as it is the law of the land. "Woe, woe, woe, woe, be to the Earth, for its foulness will be great!" Thank Set I was born in a country like the USA!

Xeper.
/Adramelek\
Gnothi seauton!

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I think it would be such a mixture of various political theories it would have to have it's own name. I think it would have a very strong Marxist theme, as those who actually run the nation receive due credit. Politicians would be probably nothing more than mediators that ensure human rights and dignity are not denied. Police would exist only to intervene when things get really bad, such as a shoot-out. To some it may seem tyrannical as religion would be strongly kept our of the public sector. Input from accredited scientists and universities would probably be considered first when deciding policy. I could also see a tyrannical zeal to ensure all citizens are equal and have equal input, and that money is in no way considered to speech. I could also see very strong regulations protecting citizens from unfair and unsafe business practices, in the essence of preserving personal equality. I would think foreign policy would become less hypocritical, less involved, and would call for military action only for self defence or when a nation is legitimately oppressed.
I also see such a government being much more willing and eager to accept and address criticism, and much quicker to learn from mistakes. I also see such a government putting our current government and politicians to shame as citizens began to live under a government that not only allowed for, but encouraged and stimulated the development of advanced school curriculum greater than any Asian country, great scientific pursuits that lack the "playing god" inhibitions and other religious hindrances, and a flourishing of the arts not known since the Renaissance.

 

[The Sum of Awe]

Meh I think Marxism is pretty RHP politically.

 

[Cassiopia]

I think it would be such a mixture of various political theories it would have to have it's own name. I think it would have a very strong Marxist theme, as those who actually run the nation receive due credit. Politicians would be probably nothing more than mediators that ensure human rights and dignity are not denied. Police would exist only to intervene when things get really bad, such as a shoot-out. To some it may seem tyrannical as religion would be strongly kept our of the public sector. Input from accredited scientists and universities would probably be considered first when deciding policy. I could also see a tyrannical zeal to ensure all citizens are equal and have equal input, and that money is in no way considered to speech. I could also see very strong regulations protecting citizens from unfair and unsafe business practices, in the essence of preserving personal equality. I would think foreign policy would become less hypocritical, less involved, and would call for military action only for self defence or when a nation is legitimately oppressed.
I also see such a government being much more willing and eager to accept and address criticism, and much quicker to learn from mistakes. I also see such a government putting our current government and politicians to shame as citizens began to live under a government that not only allowed for, but encouraged and stimulated the development of advanced school curriculum greater than any Asian country, great scientific pursuits that lack the "playing god" inhibitions and other religious hindrances, and a flourishing of the arts not known since the Renaissance.

This is more along the lines of what I would like to see. Maybe a little more optimistic than what I posted earlier.

Meh I think Marxism is pretty RHP politically.

Why?
And so what? Satanism is about free thought and independence. It is not about keeping rigidly to what somebody else defines the LHP as.

 

[The Sum of Awe]

Why?
And so what? Satanism is about free thought and independence. It is not about keeping rigidly to what somebody else defines the LHP as.

It supports Communism in theory.

 

[Cassiopia]

Why?
And so what? Satanism is about free thought and independence. It is not about keeping rigidly to what somebody else defines the LHP as.

It supports Communism in theory.

This tells me you do not like communism, but it does not answer the question as to why you think left wing politics is incompatible with Satanism or the LHP.

 

[jasonwill2]

The Libertarian party is the most Satanic to me. As it promotes the rights and liberty of the individual and always defaults to freedom. Yes, law and order is essential to any civilized society as human beings by nature can be just as vicious as our four legged counterparts, but we have the ability to control our natural instincts.

On a personal note: my black heart goes out to those potential Setians, Satanists, other Occultists who are trapped in places across the world like the Middle East. In countries like Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Iran, or Seria, where they must remain in the closet for fear of being arrested for blasphemy and sentenced to cruel deaths as it is the law of the land. "Woe, woe, woe, woe, be to the Earth, for its foulness will be great!" Thank Set I was born in a country like the USA!

Xeper.
/Adramelek\
Gnothi seauton!

I think it would be such a mixture of various political theories it would have to have it's own name. I think it would have a very strong Marxist theme, as those who actually run the nation receive due credit. Politicians would be probably nothing more than mediators that ensure human rights and dignity are not denied. Police would exist only to intervene when things get really bad, such as a shoot-out. To some it may seem tyrannical as religion would be strongly kept our of the public sector. Input from accredited scientists and universities would probably be considered first when deciding policy. I could also see a tyrannical zeal to ensure all citizens are equal and have equal input, and that money is in no way considered to speech. I could also see very strong regulations protecting citizens from unfair and unsafe business practices, in the essence of preserving personal equality. I would think foreign policy would become less hypocritical, less involved, and would call for military action only for self defence or when a nation is legitimately oppressed.
I also see such a government being much more willing and eager to accept and address criticism, and much quicker to learn from mistakes. I also see such a government putting our current government and politicians to shame as citizens began to live under a government that not only allowed for, but encouraged and stimulated the development of advanced school curriculum greater than any Asian country, great scientific pursuits that lack the "playing god" inhibitions and other religious hindrances, and a flourishing of the arts not known since the Renaissance.

I am stuck between these two.

 

[Orias]

It supports Communism in theory.

Communists produce less homeless people.

 

[The Sum of Awe]

This tells me you do not like communism, but it does not answer the question as to why you think left wing politics is incompatible with Satanism or the LHP.

Because I feel the LHP is about being completely independent. It's funny that you support Left Wing Economics as a satanist, as Satanism is somewhat influenced by Ayn Rand, and Ayn Rand was definitely libertarian.

Communists produce less homeless people.

Would you rather have homeless people or economic parasites?

 

[Father Heathen]

I think Sum has a point. Satanists (if we're going by the philsophies of Rand, LaVey, etc.) obviously wouldn't be social conservatives, but I don't think they would be fiscal liberals, either, since it's all about being centered on the individual; personal freedom, self reliance, etc. right?