What is a "Kind"?

[painted wolf]

We're all just a bunch of inbred mutts huh????...LOL!!!

not at all... we are one of a bunch of highly successful, highly diverse variations from a shared starting point.
We all started at the same place but one by one we have chosen to break away from the group and make our own paths.

Miacis was an example of where one of those breaking point started. Proailurus began the path that leads to cats and another to Hesperocyon who was the first "dog". (and also fairly weselish in appearance)

wa:do

 

[Mr. Peanut]

O.K I just have to ask its drivign me "nuts" Peanut...

The comment made about the thread least deserving to be polluted that you agree with was made with a quote of mine...by polluting are ya'll referring to me???

Seriously I hate to think that after one day here I would be considered a "pollutant"..I misenterpreted the OP's meaning of Kind...Im sorry for that..I seriously thought he meant kind in an action way.."beign kind to someone or something"...I meant no ill will..Honestly it hurt my feelings..

Maybe Im paranoid and it has nothing to be with me..But yet I was quoted..

Blessings

Dallas

Ah, I see. No worries!

 

[Mr. Peanut]

so what kind am I?

If lions make lions and tigers make tigers.... this poor guy is kindless.

wa:do

And also cannot reproduce after its own kind.

 

[Azakel]

so what kind am I?

If lions make lions and tigers make tigers.... this poor guy is kindless.

wa:do

Is that a Liger or a Tigon? ^_^ I love them so much.

 

[painted wolf]

actually Liger and Tigron Females are fertile and can reproduce...
How about the "Bengal"cat.. a Hybrid between the domsetic cat and the Asian leopard cat. (A small wild cat species.)
These "Bengal" cats can reproduce after thier own kind.

Woves and Jackyls can inter breed and produce fertile offpring...
Many species of birds and butterfiles can do the same.
not to mention all the hybid plants!

wa:do
ps. he's a Liger named Patrick

 

[Mr. Peanut]

If the offspring can reproduce or closely related animals can, I would consider them within the same kind. What is it, the horse and mule can make a donkey, but the donkey cannot make more donkeys, or something like that...

 

[DallasApple]

actually Liger and Tigron Females are fertile and can reproduce...
How about the "Bengal"cat.. a Hybrid between the domsetic cat and the Asian leopard cat. (A small wild cat species.)
These "Bengal" cats can reproduce after thier own kind.

Woves and Jackyls can inter breed and produce fertile offpring...
Many species of birds and butterfiles can do the same.
not to mention all the hybid plants!

wa:do
ps. he's a Liger named Patrick

But from what I understand..That Liger??...They have determined would be ill equipped to survie in the wild...There were many points ...from his massive size ..to his lacking in instincts...

I think he is awsome..He is beautiful...But from what I understand he is incable of survial on his own...And it has nothing to do with beign handled by humans either..

Blessings

Dallas

 

[DallasApple]

Also...their can really only be a liger if you cotninue to breed lion and tiger..If you breed Liger to Liger is it really still a Liger???...Its impossible..A liger and a liger offspring wouldnt even be the same(kind) as its own parents would it???

Blessings

Dallas

 

[Azakel]

Also...their can really only be a liger if you cotninue to breed lion and tiger..If you breed Liger to Liger is it really still a Liger???...Its impossible..A liger and a liger offspring wouldnt even be the same(kind) as its own parents would it???

Blessings

Dallas

It would wouldn't what else would it be. But the fact that male Ligers can't breed how will we every know(no really how I don't know how these thing work).

 

[DallasApple]

It would wouldn't what else would it be. But the fact that male Ligers can't breed how will we every know(no really how I don't know how these thing work).

Hey Azakel,

I think I saw you on antoher forum last night too..If you are the same Azakel Im assuming..Im the same DallasAplle...(just so you know)...

SOOO...the Liger (male) cant reproduce???Why is that??...Physically he cant do the deed or so far unseccesful inpregnating a female lion or tiger??

Thats another thing...What is the offspring of a Liger that breeds back to a lion or a tiger..?

A LigaTiger??? Or a LioLiger??

Blessings

Dallas

 

[DallasApple]

It would wouldn't what else would it be. But the fact that male Ligers can't breed how will we every know(no really how I don't know how these thing work).

It wouldnt be...Becuase a Liger is 1/2 lion and 1/2 Tiger...And if two Ligers bred the offspring would Not be 1/2 and 1/2 anymore..It would be something else ...I think...(confused now)

Blessings

Dallas

 

[Azakel]

Hey Azakel,

I think I saw you on antoher forum last night too..If you are the same Azakel Im assuming..Im the same DallasAplle...(just so you know)...

SOOO...the Liger (male) cant reproduce???Why is that??...Physically he cant do the deed or so far unseccesful inpregnating a female lion or tiger??

Thats another thing...What is the offspring of a Liger that breeds back to a lion or a tiger..?

A LigaTiger??? Or a LioLiger??

Blessings

Dallas

He will still do the did but a male Liger is sterile. I should have been a little more clear, not good at that I am. Other then that, I don't know that much.

 

[fantome profane]

If the offspring can reproduce or closely related animals can, I would consider them within the same kind. What is it, the horse and mule can make a donkey, but the donkey cannot make more donkeys, or something like that...

You are giving the one of the more common definition for species, two organisms can be said to belong to the same species if they can successfully interbreed and produce viable (fertile) offspring. Is “kind” the same thing as “species”?

If “kind” is the same as “species” does that mean that it is not possible for a new species to evolve from other species, regardless of how similar those two species are?

 

[painted wolf]

A cross between a liger and a lion is a li-liger... or a Ti-liger if crossed with a Tiger.
(li-tigron/ ti-tigron are the other possiblities)

Presumably the male liger is infertile due to a messed up Y chomosome.

Now what about a fox?
A fox is often regarded as "dog kind" but can not produce offspring with any of the other canines.
Is "fox kind" its own kind?

wa:do

 

[Somkid]

Do you mean "humankind"?

 

[camanintx]

If the offspring can reproduce or closely related animals can, I would consider them within the same kind.

So if the offspring of a group of organisms split into two groups which were incapable of reproducing with each other, would they be considered two separate "kinds"?

 

[Mr. Peanut]

All I know is everything reproduces after its own kind, humans make humans, rabbits-rabbits, apple trees make apples and seeds and more apple trees. This is seen every day and in the fossil record as well. There should be a huge abundance of missing links showing the slow changes of animals into what they are today, but they don't exist.

 

[fantome profane]

All I know is.....

That is such an interesting phrase, isn’t it? But is it all you want to know? Do you aspire to know more? If I talk to you tomorrow, or next week, or next year, will this still be “all you know”? Or will you have learned more?

Biologists have discovered several examples of new species arising through the process of evolution. The new species can no longer interbreed with the original population.

Observed Instances of Speciation

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CB/CB910.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speciation

http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/VSpeciation.shtml

http://users.rcn.com/jkimball.ma.ultranet/BiologyPages/S/Speciation.html

.....everything reproduces after its own kind,

This is why it is so important to understand what is meant when creationists use the term “kind”. Is it the same thing as species? If it is not, then what is it?

How can we evaluate this claim if we don’t know what “kind” is? How can we evaluate the claim if we don’t understand what is being claimed?

 

[Mr. Peanut]

As I said, a human will reproduce humans. We won't and don't and haven't produced anything but humans. Same for apple trees. They make apples and seeds and more apple trees. That is all the Bible is saying.

 

[fantome profane]

As I said, a human will reproduce humans. We won't and don't and haven't produced anything but humans. Same for apple trees. They make apples and seeds and more apple trees. That is all the Bible is saying.

Many people know what the Bible says, but I am not sure anyone understands what it means.

For example, what does the word “kind” mean when it is used in Genesis? That is the question. Can you answer it in terms that we can understand and use?