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Dualism- God and Devil?

Rex

Founder
When believing in God in the Christian sense, you must believe in the opposite the devil

And the devil has all of these god like powers.


Why does this not constitute Dualism?
 

Runt

Well-Known Member
My belief: God is a polar force, creative and destructive at the same time, and "good" and "evil" are merely (inaccurate) human attempts to understand these forces. I personally believe God and the Devil to be polar manifestations of the same GOD.
 

ErikaLee

Member
I believe in Positive Energy and Negative Energy. If you open yourself up to either, then either good things or bad things can happen.

Then, of course, sometimes schtuff just happens.

I believe personally, that the story of Lucifer/Satan is the ultimate story of "See what happens when you go against God?". And that the idea of the Devil was instituted as a way of fearing people into going the right way.

I'm a good person. I treat others they way they treat me, I'm kind and considerate. And I do it all because I want to, not because I'm afraid of going to hell. (Which I believe is another fear tactic. I don't believe in hell, or heaven. When you die your energy goes out, your soul goes out and, yes, I do believe in reincarnation.)

Anyway, when explaining to a child the correct way to behave, you cannot simply say " Because you should." and expect them to understand and comply. You teach them cause and effect, and I believe that the concept of Satan is the same.

It would probably also help me to believe in Satan if I believed in God, but even when I was a Pagan and worshipped the God and Goddess there was no Satan in the mix. I don't think there has to be.


EL

I just reread your first post and realized I didn't even come close to answering your question.... I'll try now.

In order for it to be Dualism, don't both entities have to be on the same side?

If not, Satan wouldn't count anyway because, much as he'd like to be, he is NOT God or his equal. He has powers only because God allows him to because God knows in the end, we will choose him regardless. :)
 
:evil: Satan has ALL the best tunes.....honest....

Dualism...falsness...yin and yang

A battery has a negative and a positive end..but its still a battery....

Now ..where did I leave my bra? :roll:
 
I know that God exists, but I also acknowlege Satan as existing. How is this not dualism? God is the creator; He is onimpotent and omniscient. Satan, however, is still a creation of God. God created Satan as on of the most beautiful of all the angels, but Satan, opposed to serving, rebelled. Like I said before God is the creator; He is all powerful and can do anything. Satan can not create, but can only mock and defile creation. He has no creative powers himself.
 

Master Vigil

Well-Known Member
by definition all of what you are talking about is a dualistic view, but not dualism. dualism is actually the idea of the body and soul being separate and distinct entities. alot of people get that confused.

i do not believe (god) to be good or evil, it just is. and we percieve its effects on the world as either good or evil. this is due to the fact that none of us have the same idea of what is good or evil. i believe the idea good and evil only exists inside the our minds and our perception. and if (god) was soley good, than why would there be evil, for the single idea of good is to get rid of evil. but we all know of such a thing as evil, even though its only in our minds. if we are able to see that our idea of evil exists, than (god) cannot be solely good. but if its not solely good, it cannot be solely evil either. so therefore, it is neither. it just is.
 
master vigil couldnt agree more...

good and evil are subjective dependant upon culture and context...

and good and evil are really the same thing...

they just "are".....

god is light...and god is dark....
you cannot have the light without the dark....



bed....

dei gloria intacta......
 

painted wolf

Grey Muzzle
I agree with masters Vigil and Hoomer.
Creator was both, one can not survive without the other... but then our concepts of 'good and evil' are very different from "western" or eaven "eastern" society.

wa:-do
 

Death

Member
I don't think it counts as true dualism, since the powers aren't equal. It's a clearly dualistic idea though, with some civil-war mythology behind it.

Of course, good and evil don't objectively exist, they're subjective value judgments based on what is beneficial and detrimental to us in life.

The Devil was made up more as a sort of bad guy of christianity so their archetype of all things good wouldn't be credited with the evil in the world, that was all the fault of humanity and the Devil.
 

painted wolf

Grey Muzzle
much like the old idea of the sape-goat.
In anchient Isrial (I believe, though it may have been another group in the area) people would attach all thier sins (in the form of ribbons and string) to some poor shmuck of a goat and then toss him into the desert to die.
The idea was that the goat would suffer the sins of people and the people would be purified for it....
at least untill next year....

makes you wonder about the Jesus story eh? 8)
the ultimate scape-goat.

wa:-do
 

Gaurick

New Member
Runt said:
My belief: God is a polar force, creative and destructive at the same time, and "good" and "evil" are merely (inaccurate) human attempts to understand these forces. I personally believe God and the Devil to be polar manifestations of the same GOD.

To some similarities of this, I believe God, the Devil, mankind, animal kind, the universe in itself, to be known as The Oneness. I'm not sure anyone else believes it, but this is how I understand it. The Devil is simply a representation of all that is "evil" in The Oneness. Anger, hate, deception, etc. Where as God is a representation of all that is good and just. In the end, it's all one GIANT entity.
 

Runt

Well-Known Member
I believe God, the Devil, mankind, animal kind, the universe in itself, to be known as The Oneness.

Yeah, my beliefs are very similar. Actually, they might really be the same.

I wrote this in another forum on this site (where, incidentally, some people are telling me that this view of God CANNOT be called "God"... which makes me like your word "Oneness" a lot :p)

"It is everything within human perception but also outside of human perception (bigger than we can "see" or "imagine")--like I said, transcendent. Meaning all views of God probably touch on Its nature, (including the view of Nature as a divine force), but are not the TOTALITY of It. It created the laws of science and uses them but is Itself more than the reality that science has (or can) discover.... The natural world is part of God, but not Its totality. The natural world is merely a MANIFESTATION of this entity, one of Its creations, and a vehicle through which it interacts with Its creations within this creation (and remember that at the same time Its creations are a part of It....we are a part of It, nature is a part of It, all scientific phenomenon is a part of It) and cannot be used alone to describe the full nature of this entity..."

As for "good" and "evil", they are simply terms we apply to the creative and destructive forces of God, depending on whether or not we "like" a particular action of God...
 

Master Vigil

Well-Known Member
Its sad, but my views and yours are so much like the Force from star wars. I mean, everything you said could be construed as the Force. Damn george lucas and his brilliancy!! haha!!
 

Runt

Well-Known Member
LMAO

"The Force" as a religion is supposed to have about 10000 followers in Canada...
 

Runt

Well-Known Member
LOL. From the Star Wars Religion website:

"The Star Wars Trilogy, just like many other religious texts or cannons, can serve as an inspiration and hope that the power of compassion can transform anyone of us into a force for peace and redemption, capable of untwisting what has been twisted and bearing what has been unbearable."
 

Master Vigil

Well-Known Member
HAHAHAH!!! I LOVE IT!!!! It is sad though, because the force can be used to describe how I feel the universe is connected. Other words can have the same meaning as well, Chi, Ki, Qi... and those of the asian philosophies. The force was taken from those ideas. Even the way jedi's were dressed came from asian culture. It has so much appeal to me. I often use the force as an analogy for my vigil practice.
 

anders

Well-Known Member
At the age of 60+, I don't watch childrens' movies, so excuse me for returning to the starting question. The Christian and Jewish faiths have some dualistic parts, but they both recognise one Boss and one only, so they are monistic. But we need evil. Otherwise, we would not know what "good" is.

(If there is someone out there who does not feel offended by the first sentence, please tell, and I promise to try to include you as well the next time.)
 
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