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Namaskar Ratikala
I voiced my concern in the OP and let me repeat it.
When a person, actually holding Lokyata belief, professes to be Hindu Advaitin, it is untruth.
Lokyata belief on one hand and advaita or ajAtivAda understanding on the other, are diametrically opposite. Advaita believes in one truth called Brahman of the intrinsic nature of Sat-Chit-Ananda. This is the teaching of Veda, Vedanta, and of advaita Guru Shankara. This one truth is like an infinite un-cut marble that has all the designs. It is itself the truth, existence, and knowledge. It does not take birth due to material interactions. Material interactions become possible due the Sat-Chit-Ananda.
Lokyatas, wilfully (or due to sheer ignorance?), are misguiding readers of Hinduism forum.
I believe that there is nothing wrong in believing one way or another. But it is wrong to impose upon other readers that:
1) Veda is not the core of Hindu dharma.
2) Brahman is mere electrical energy.
3) Consciousness rises in brain due to chemical reactions.
4) There is no soul and its reincarnation.
5) Consciousness is limited to one body-brain and one life. etc.
2) Brahman is mere electrical energy.
3) Consciousness rises in brain due to chemical reactions.
4) There is no soul and its reincarnation.
5) Consciousness is limited to one body-brain and one life. etc.
These are all basic tenets of Materialism and these are not taught in Hindu Dharma.
My concern is that some newcomers may get misguided that Hindu dharma teaches materialism. This has to some extent happened to Buddhism Dir. It should not happen to Hinduism Dir.
But the way of Ishwara is inscrutable. I bow to that.
Regards.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
I have always maintained that I am a maverick 'advaitist' and that "I do not in any way represent the well-meaning though superstitious Hindu majority". How does one impose his/her views in a forum? Every one states his/her own opinion if different.
1. Yes, I believe that Vedas are an addition to Hinduism and not the core of Hinduism. Parts of Vedas are close to the core since they were were written after Aryan settled in India.
2. As you say, Ishwara is inscrutable. It could even be energy. We do not know it fully.
3. Consciousness by chemical and electrical impulses is a scientific fact.
4. There is no proof of God, soul, and hence no reincarnation.
5. Yeah, through what material or process does it transfer to another life or body?
This is 21st Century. By 2050, India will be one of the two or three most prosperous and powerful nations of the world. Do not hold it back. Move with times.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
Oh, I see, I am off your ignored list. Thanks.
Like in 'Advaita', there are no clear dividing lines between religion, science, politics, economics, materialism and philosophy. One thing impacts another.
There is no 'moksha' in 'advaita', when all things are Brahman themselves.The only hindrance is realization of this fact. "Brahma veda Brahmaiva bhavati"
I hope someday this will be understood.
अहं निर्विकल्पॊ निराकार रूपॊ विभुत्वाच्च सर्वत्र सर्वेन्द्रियाणाम् l
न चासंगतं नैव मुक्तिर् न मेय: चिदानन्द रूप: शिवोऽहम् शिवॊऽहम् ॥
"Aham Nirvikalpo Nirākāra Rūpo, Vibhutvaachcha Sarvatra Sarvendriyānām;
Na Cha Asangatam Naiva Muktir Na Meyah Chidānanda Rūpah Shivo'ham Shivo'ham."
I am all pervasive. I am without any attributes, and without any form. I have neither attachment to the world, nor to liberation. I have no wishes for anything because I am everything, everywhere, every time, always in equilibrium. I am the form of eternal happiness, the auspicious, Shiva.
http://www.geetganga.org/nirvana-shatakam-निर्वाण-षटकम्
Changed Goswami Tulsi Das' line a little in my signature.
Like in 'Advaita', there are no clear dividing lines between religion, science, politics, economics, materialism and philosophy. One thing impacts another.
There is no 'moksha' in 'advaita', when all things are Brahman themselves.The only hindrance is realization of this fact. "Brahma veda Brahmaiva bhavati"
I hope someday this will be understood.
अहं निर्विकल्पॊ निराकार रूपॊ विभुत्वाच्च सर्वत्र सर्वेन्द्रियाणाम् l
न चासंगतं नैव मुक्तिर् न मेय: चिदानन्द रूप: शिवोऽहम् शिवॊऽहम् ॥
"Aham Nirvikalpo Nirākāra Rūpo, Vibhutvaachcha Sarvatra Sarvendriyānām;
Na Cha Asangatam Naiva Muktir Na Meyah Chidānanda Rūpah Shivo'ham Shivo'ham."
I am all pervasive. I am without any attributes, and without any form. I have neither attachment to the world, nor to liberation. I have no wishes for anything because I am everything, everywhere, every time, always in equilibrium. I am the form of eternal happiness, the auspicious, Shiva.
http://www.geetganga.org/nirvana-shatakam-निर्वाण-षटकम्
Changed Goswami Tulsi Das' line a little in my signature.
Last edited:
ratikala
Istha gosthi
Namaskaram Aupmanyav ji
this comment is not nececarily aimed at you but just observation ....when people express veiws there is allways someone impressionalble who's thoughts and actions will be coloured by what they read especialy if it ia a veiw held by the majority , ....for example I have noticed many times that the word surrender is met with objection even hostility , ..yet it is an important principle in Vedic culture , ...the more materialistic the beleif the more the person clings to self and to oppinion and rejects Vedic principles , ....the more this mistake is vissable in posters outlook the more muddied the waters become , untill old school devotees become looked upon as being unreasonably strict and in the instance of surrender too submissive , ......
we submit for one reason , we realise our limitations as embodied souls , we realise that by dint of birth in human form we have a covering of ignorance or delusion , .....
those of materialistic bent not willing or able to realise this focus overly upon the self thinking it to be everything , this is a severe handycap to any form of Sadhana , .....
so we have to have the principle of surrender , ....we have to have the principle of truth , ....we then have to strive for it .
will I become blue in the face by keep repeating this Veda is a self existing eternaml truth , ....newer was there nor will there be a time when it does not exist , ......Veda's the books we posess became manifest due to our ignorance , ....vedas as revealed texts can prehaps be dated and put in a historical time frame , ...but Veda canot as it is an eternal self existing truth , .......
inscrutable is an excelent word , as it is that which is too vast for our simple minds to grasp , nor can it be found by scientific examination as even science in its advanced state is insuficient , ...going down the line of reasining that thinks it can find or identify such vastness or encapsulate its qualities only leads to frustration as yes in one respect it is the energy , power or creative force behind all things that were or will be , but as it is etenal and we as matter are not it canot be found in matter , nor can it be found by material means , .....it can be found only by the Sadhak who surrenders all sence of self knowing it to be illusuory , ....
I am no scientist but surely even the most inteligent of Scientists will admit that by examining matter all that can be found is matter , .....Consciousness when embodied in matter has an efect which may be measured by way of a reaction or efect on the matter it inhabits , but surely by this method all we can find is the reaction not the consciousness , this then would make the measurable chemical and electrical impulses mearly reactions caused by the presence of consciousness , ...thus also proving the inscrutable nature of consciousness , ....
why do we cling only to measurable material facts ? .....this is like only recognising an action and denying that any intention lay behind it , .........
to whom then are you offering your heart , ..?
O Son of Wind God, destroyer of troubles, of auspicious form; along with Sri Rām, brother Lakshaman and Mother Sīta, O King of Gods, make my heart your sole abode
at last you have answered your own question , ......move with the times , ....are you serious ? ....you mean go headlong into Kaliyuga and embrace Greed and Ignorance ! ....leave behind Knowledge , Wisdom and Goodness ? .....please ask why a white girl like me renounces her own culture to study yours , .....because the pride of powerfull nations makes them totaly blind to the human predicement , both wealth and power corrupt , and in the state of infatuation with their own importance these nations loose all sence of rightiousness , decency and what constitutes true Knowledge , .....
please , please think this through carefully , ......you have this as your signature , .....O Son of Wind God, destroyer of troubles, of auspicious form; along with Sri Rām, brother Lakshaman and Mother Sīta, O King of Gods, make my heart your sole abode , .....
how can you write this and not hold that Rightiousness of Ram as supreme ???
this comment is not nececarily aimed at you but just observation ....when people express veiws there is allways someone impressionalble who's thoughts and actions will be coloured by what they read especialy if it ia a veiw held by the majority , ....for example I have noticed many times that the word surrender is met with objection even hostility , ..yet it is an important principle in Vedic culture , ...the more materialistic the beleif the more the person clings to self and to oppinion and rejects Vedic principles , ....the more this mistake is vissable in posters outlook the more muddied the waters become , untill old school devotees become looked upon as being unreasonably strict and in the instance of surrender too submissive , ......
we submit for one reason , we realise our limitations as embodied souls , we realise that by dint of birth in human form we have a covering of ignorance or delusion , .....
those of materialistic bent not willing or able to realise this focus overly upon the self thinking it to be everything , this is a severe handycap to any form of Sadhana , .....
so we have to have the principle of surrender , ....we have to have the principle of truth , ....we then have to strive for it .
will I become blue in the face by keep repeating this Veda is a self existing eternaml truth , ....newer was there nor will there be a time when it does not exist , ......Veda's the books we posess became manifest due to our ignorance , ....vedas as revealed texts can prehaps be dated and put in a historical time frame , ...but Veda canot as it is an eternal self existing truth , .......
inscrutable is an excelent word , as it is that which is too vast for our simple minds to grasp , nor can it be found by scientific examination as even science in its advanced state is insuficient , ...going down the line of reasining that thinks it can find or identify such vastness or encapsulate its qualities only leads to frustration as yes in one respect it is the energy , power or creative force behind all things that were or will be , but as it is etenal and we as matter are not it canot be found in matter , nor can it be found by material means , .....it can be found only by the Sadhak who surrenders all sence of self knowing it to be illusuory , ....
I am no scientist but surely even the most inteligent of Scientists will admit that by examining matter all that can be found is matter , .....Consciousness when embodied in matter has an efect which may be measured by way of a reaction or efect on the matter it inhabits , but surely by this method all we can find is the reaction not the consciousness , this then would make the measurable chemical and electrical impulses mearly reactions caused by the presence of consciousness , ...thus also proving the inscrutable nature of consciousness , ....
why do we cling only to measurable material facts ? .....this is like only recognising an action and denying that any intention lay behind it , .........
to whom then are you offering your heart , ..?
O Son of Wind God, destroyer of troubles, of auspicious form; along with Sri Rām, brother Lakshaman and Mother Sīta, O King of Gods, make my heart your sole abode
at last you have answered your own question , ......move with the times , ....are you serious ? ....you mean go headlong into Kaliyuga and embrace Greed and Ignorance ! ....leave behind Knowledge , Wisdom and Goodness ? .....please ask why a white girl like me renounces her own culture to study yours , .....because the pride of powerfull nations makes them totaly blind to the human predicement , both wealth and power corrupt , and in the state of infatuation with their own importance these nations loose all sence of rightiousness , decency and what constitutes true Knowledge , .....
please , please think this through carefully , ......you have this as your signature , .....O Son of Wind God, destroyer of troubles, of auspicious form; along with Sri Rām, brother Lakshaman and Mother Sīta, O King of Gods, make my heart your sole abode , .....
how can you write this and not hold that Rightiousness of Ram as supreme ???
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
While I appreciate your excellent words, Ratiben, I have always done that, you are such a wonderful person, only too far from where I stay, notwithstanding our little differences of opinion, otherwise we would have had some great time together, I will like to mention that I arrived at my conclusion after some sadhana and through the grace of Lord Rama.
As for Lord Rama, Mother Sita, brother Lakshaman and Lord Hanuman, they are my idols, my beacons in life, that is why I keep them in my heart, all the time.
ratikala
Istha gosthi
Namaskaram Prabhu ji
My best regards also , ...I am humbled by your kind remark , ...after all had you not opened the thread I would not have commented , ....I am humbled also by your comitment to maintain the purity of traditions , .....Prabhu ji I thank you .
My best regards also , ...I am humbled by your kind remark , ...after all had you not opened the thread I would not have commented , ....I am humbled also by your comitment to maintain the purity of traditions , .....Prabhu ji I thank you .
ratikala
Istha gosthi
Namaskaram Aupmanyav ji
beware what you say , ...when finances permit , ....I will be coming to Jaipur , ...which means coming through Deli then we can happily discuss the Grace of Lord Rama , ....next to which small differences of opinion are nothing , ...
Jai Jai for that I am made very happy , .....
beware what you say , ...when finances permit , ....I will be coming to Jaipur , ...which means coming through Deli then we can happily discuss the Grace of Lord Rama , ....next to which small differences of opinion are nothing , ...
As for Lord Rama, Mother Sita, brother Lakshaman and Lord Hanuman, they are my idols, my beacons in life, that is why I keep them in my heart, all the time.
Jai Jai for that I am made very happy , .....
ajay0
Well-Known Member
I found the second laughable.
But seriously speaking, if this sort of stuff is happening in this forum, it does not serve the purpose of Hinduism, but of Maya.
It would be the duty of the moderators and forum members to ensure proper information is disseminated and the forum does not become the devil's platform.
Category No.
Carvaka, Ajjivika, Jaina, Buddha, Samkhya, Vaisesika etc. have always been a part of the discourse of Dharma that is today called Hinduism All the great philsophers and theologians of the Dharma (Sankara, Udayana, Ramanuja, Vacaspati Misra etc.) have included them in their arguments and dialogue partners as contending darsana-s, but not as alien dharma-s. Such treatises of eminent scholarship were being written right up to the 18th century and includes all these groups. What has been excluded from this 3000 year dialogue are the truly alien religions :- Judaism, Greek religions, Islam, Christianity, Zoroastrianism, Confucianism etc. even though all of them were known and people were familiar with them. An example
Vidyaranya - Wikipedia
Of course Vidrayana's belief that Vedanta is the culmination of all Hindu darsana's is his own take (Gangesa or Prabhakara will disagree) . But that is not the point. The point is these groups have always considered themselves part of the same conversation regarding dharma and many of the sramanic traditions (ajjivika, jaina etc.) are as old as the upanisads and much older than later theistic Hinduism based on agamic texts. You do not get to exclude them from the Hindu fold.
Same confusion repeated, IMO.
The term 'Hindu' can be used in multiple context. But Hindu dharma primarily means Vaidika dharma.