McBell
Resident Sourpuss
Do you believe Satan is a god?
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Does it make sense to use ''Satan'' for an atheistic religious group?
- Thread starter Desert Snake
- Start date
Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
EtuMalku
Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
There is no reason an atheist cannot embrace an archetypal structure and its mythology into their life . . . you are confusing theistic Satanists with other Satanists
Desert Snake
Veteran Member
AnnaCzereda
Active Member
And why not? All gods, goddesses and demons are archetypes, if you think about it and even if people believe in their actual existence. The Church of Satan considers Satanism to be an atheistic religion. If it's confusing then take, for example, secular humanism with its rituals and ceremonies for atheists. Damn, they even organize something akin to the Christian Mass with songs, lectures about science instead of sermons and shared meals at the end instead of the Holy Communion. Satanic rituals are not that much different from humanist ceremonies, only a little bit more spooky.
Desert Snake
Veteran Member
This of course is from an atheistic viewpoint. We can use Jesus as an example. Part of being an actual Xian or follower of Christ, is believing in the 'realness'' of Jesus, whether as God Himself, or the Son of God, in the the trinity, or God, in a trinity. Merely using Jesus as an ''archetype'', misses the mark as to what the 'being', /literally Jesus/, does, is, and 'who', Jesus is //a living God. An archetype simply doesn't work.
Now, when it comes to ''Satan'', clearly, the character in /tradition, is not merely an archetype, it isn't supposed to be a fictional character.
Are you telling me that you cannot distinguish the consequential differences between a 'fictional' character, and a real being?
EtuMalku
Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
Does it make sense to use ''Satan'' for an atheistic religious group?
There are no 'atheistic religious' groups that would be an oxymoron. So this question is unanswerable . . .
Does it actually make sense for an atheistic religious group to use what they consider an ''archetype'' /fictional character, as part of their atheistic religious ideas?
There are no 'atheistic religious' groups that would be an oxymoron. So this question is unanswerable . . .
So again, I ask . . . what is the question here?
There are no 'atheistic religious' groups that would be an oxymoron. So this question is unanswerable . . .
Does it actually make sense for an atheistic religious group to use what they consider an ''archetype'' /fictional character, as part of their atheistic religious ideas?
There are no 'atheistic religious' groups that would be an oxymoron. So this question is unanswerable . . .
So again, I ask . . . what is the question here?
Desert Snake
Veteran Member
How would you describe the Church of Satan?
EtuMalku
Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
Religion is defined as an organized collection of beliefs, cultural systems, and world views that relate humanity to an order of existence
Buddhism is a way of life, a philosophy for exterminating one's cause of suffering . . .
The Church of Satan is a cabal of individuals who share the basis of Anton LaVey's philosophy . . .
Neither address the concept of an order of existence (cosmology)
The OP is as clear as mud . . .
Buddhism is a way of life, a philosophy for exterminating one's cause of suffering . . .
The Church of Satan is a cabal of individuals who share the basis of Anton LaVey's philosophy . . .
Neither address the concept of an order of existence (cosmology)
The OP is as clear as mud . . .
Erebus
Well-Known Member
If they want to use Satan as a symbol rather than a literal deity, then fair play to them. I can certainly understand somebody finding meaning in an archetype even if a lot of that meaning can be boiled down to shock factor.
The one thing I don't get is when LaVeyans say anybody who actually worships the devil isn't a Satanist. That one always struck me as weird.
EtuMalku
Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
The Cos uses a tactic in which they understand their philosophy of Satanism to be the correct one and thus any others are incorrect, this reinforces the CoS' stance as the only true form of Satanism. They leave no wiggle space for any other Satanic organization.
Jumi
Well-Known Member
There are people who consider themselves Christian, but don't believe Jesus exists/existed as anything but an archetype. These people would also have a problem with the trinity and the Nicene Creed.
Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
The words atheistic and religious group do not belong in the same sentence. They are dichotomous terms. An atheist has NO belief in any god so religion would be a non sequitor.
I disagree. Obviously the majority of religions include supernatural beliefs. But they do not neccessarily have to do so. The Church of Satan would be an example of a religion which is atheistic in nature. It doesn't particularly make sense to me, personally, but it's atheistic, and it has all the trappings of religion.
Erebus
Well-Known Member
Sure, I get that much. I don't get why they want to be seen as the only legitimate form of Satanism. It just seems kind of petty. It also strikes me as fighting a losing battle. Ask a thousand people what Satanism is and I'd put money on 999 of them saying "devil worship."
It's a tactic that I don't really understand the point of at the end of the day.
I suppose, in a manner of thinking, that does make sense. However, I don't think of most atheists as Satanists. To me, that is admitting that there is a being similar to God, only God's absolute opposite. So to me, it seemed like an atheist would have nothing to do with either. However, as I said Lewis, you do have a point there.
Funnily enough, members of the Church of Satan don't actually believe there is such a being as Satan. They see it as a metaphor. There obviously are theological Satanists/Luciferarians but Church of Satan is atheistic. No belief in Gods, including Satan.
leibowde84
Veteran Member
What is an atheistic religious idea? Isn't that self-contradictory?