I need help with a friend problem

b.finton said:

In other words, he did not meet your expectations and he yet persists in non-compliance?

Not talking about it is a wise approach to an impasse, from my perspective: "Time is on our side," as the song goes.

b.

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I guess you could say that. Then it's, i dont know. I try to put myself in his shoes to see what I would feel, and I'm thinking that it's simple. How could he like just automatically for some reason start acting like this. Then I think, do I just be distant for a little to see if he like comes to me and shows he still cares, or then go ack to see if any things different. I think about that, but then never do it because, what if he finds its better, and doesn't want anything to do with me.

Bump

Bump back!

Within the realm of expectations? As far as I can go.

b.

crhodes9898 said:

I guess you could say that. Then it's, i dont know. I try to put myself in his shoes to see what I would feel, and I'm thinking that it's simple. How could he like just automatically for some reason start acting like this. Then I think, do I just be distant for a little to see if he like comes to me and shows he still cares, or then go ack to see if any things different. I think about that, but then never do it because, what if he finds its better, and doesn't want anything to do with me.

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You're expecting someone else to know what to do and you're expecting someone else to meet your needs just because you need them - that's not how a healthy relationship works, man; it's how selfishness works...

The only person responsible for meeting all of your needs is you. Other people that we have in our lives are likewise only totally responsible for their own needs. When and if others meet us in life and decide to help out along the way, then that's great and everything feels nice - but even in the closest relationships there is no obligation of the other person to make you feel better every time you need it.

I don't say that to you coldly - it's a simple truth that we all have to embrace and understand sooner or later.

He's obviously asking for a little space and breathing room and it seems from reading your posts that you aren't giving him that because you want things to be a certain way. Your resolution is not his resolution and there's nothing you can do about it. You have to stop expecting him to meet every single one of your needs and you'll both start feeling better.

I promise.

jonathan180iq said:

You're expecting someone else to know what to do and you're expecting someone else to meet your needs just because you need them - that's not how a healthy relationship works, man; it's how selfishness works...

The only person responsible for meeting all of your needs is you. Other people that we have in our lives are likewise only totally responsible for their own needs. When and if others meet us in life and decide to help out along the way, then that's great and everything feels nice - but even in the closest relationships there is no obligation of the other person to make you feel better every time you need it.

I don't say that to you coldly - it's a simple truth that we all have to embrace and understand sooner or later.

He's obviously asking for a little space and breathing room and it seems from reading your posts that you aren't giving him that because you want things to be a certain way. Your resolution is not his resolution and there's nothing you can do about it. You have to stop expecting him to meet every single one of your needs and you'll both start feeling better.

I promise.

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I've tried this the past week and a half. I guess it's been a little better. But it just seems distant. And like there isn't much caring or very little. But this is what I don't get, he is always saying you've done nothing wrong. It's me.

crhodes9898 said:

I've tried this the past week and a half. I guess it's been a little better. But it just seems distant. And like there isn't much caring or very little. But this is what I don't get, he is always saying you've done nothing wrong. It's me.

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Have you been lovers?

Curious George said:

Have you been lovers?

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No...we're both males. And we're not gay. You could say there's a sense of love though but not in that way.

crhodes9898 said:

I've tried this the past week and a half. I guess it's been a little better. But it just seems distant. And like there isn't much caring or very little. But this is what I don't get, he is always saying you've done nothing wrong. It's me.

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So he recognizes his inclination towards being distant and goes so far as to let you know that it's nothing you've done. He's probably just working through something internally and doesn't feel like he needs to tell you what it is... Chances are he doesn't know what it is either... He just wants some space.

Go do you and just let him do him. If and when he gets over whatever this is, your relationship will right itself. You can't force people to be on your timeline.

Chin up, man. And don't spend so much time thinking about it - that almost always exacerbates the problem with this constant feeling of dread. Ain't nobody got time for that.

crhodes9898 said:

No...we're both males. And we're not gay. You could say there's a sense of love though but not in that way.

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No worries, had to ask because of all of your "different than normal friends" "we are more" type comments.

jonathan180iq said:

So he recognizes his inclination towards being distant and goes so far as to let you know that it's nothing you've done. He's probably just working through something internally and doesn't feel like he needs to tell you what it is... Chances are he doesn't know what it is either... He just wants some space.

Go do you and just let him do him. If and when he gets over whatever this is, your relationship will right itself. You can't force people to be on your timeline.

Chin up, man. And don't spend so much time thinking about it - that almost always exacerbates the problem with this constant feeling of dread. Ain't nobody got time for that.

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Well my thought is, if I just do me, and let him do him, that he won't bother coming back or whatever.

I don't understand how I could care so much, have this person say they do too, but then it just disappear. He like gets heated when I try to talk about it. And I'm calm and I don't understand.

crhodes9898 said:

Well my thought is, if I just do me, and let him do him, that he won't bother coming back or whatever.

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crhodes9898 said:

I don't understand how I could care so much, have this person say they do too, but then it just disappear. He like gets heated when I try to talk about it. And I'm calm and I don't understand.

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If your thought patterns in this thread are any indication, you're probably just talking about it too much - that's why he gets heated. From what you've described of his sayings and behaviors, he's tried to express that he doesn't want to talk about it or is quietly asking for space. He's expecting you to understand his way of communicating in the same way that you are expecting him to understand yours, and it's making you both more frustrated.

Like I said - you have to put some distance between the two of you in order to let whatever it is that's going on cool off. When you're constantly stirring the pot, you're not helping things.

You're obviously concerned about him never returning to your friendship. But, frankly, that's just silly. If he is really the close friend that both of you claim, then a little distance won't change that. If it has all been a sham and he's just a dick, then he'll never talk to you again. Either way, the truth will reveal itself, right? You can't force someone to care about you, regardless of what they mean to you.

My best friend and I can go 6 months without ever checking in with each other and it literally means nothing at all. We're close friends whether we talk every week or once a year.

You have to loosen up a little bit and accept that this is how it's going to be a while. No manner of trying to talk about it is going to change the fact that he obviously wants some space and you need to work on yourself a little bit. You know what I'm saying?

Ask yourself these questions :
Why are you soo concerned about how he expresses his feelings?
What is it about you that makes you need his friendship so badly?
What's the worst that could happen by taking a little break from the whole situation?
Where do you place your expectation of stability? Is it on yourself or on others?

Take some time to chew on those and be honest with yourself.

jonathan180iq said:

If your thought patterns in this thread are any indication, you're probably just talking about it too much - that's why he gets heated. From what you've described of his sayings and behaviors, he's tried to express that he doesn't want to talk about it or is quietly asking for space. He's expecting you to understand his way of communicating in the same way that you are expecting him to understand yours, and it's making you both more frustrated.

Like I said - you have to put some distance between the two of you in order to let whatever it is that's going on cool off. When you're constantly stirring the pot, you're not helping things.

You're obviously concerned about him never returning to your friendship. But, frankly, that's just silly. If he is really the close friend that both of you claim, then a little distance won't change that. If it has all been a sham and he's just a dick, then he'll never talk to you again. Either way, the truth will reveal itself, right? You can't force someone to care about you, regardless of what they mean to you.

My best friend and I can go 6 months without ever checking in with each other and it literally means nothing at all. We're close friends whether we talk every week or once a year.

You have to loosen up a little bit and accept that this is how it's going to be a while. No manner of trying to talk about it is going to change the fact that he obviously wants some space and you need to work on yourself a little bit. You know what I'm saying?

Ask yourself these questions :
Why are you soo concerned about how he expresses his feelings?
What is it about you that makes you need his friendship so badly?
What's the worst that could happen by taking a little break from the whole situation?
Where do you place your expectation of stability? Is it on yourself or on others?

Take some time to chew on those and be honest with yourself.

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It's hard though, because when you see him daily, and he gives everyone else attention, when he claims I mean a lot to him and all that bull. It's been like this for a while, but it's just getting worse.

crhodes9898 said:

It's hard though, because when you see him daily, and he gives everyone else attention, when he claims I mean a lot to him and all that bull. It's been like this for a while, but it's just getting worse.

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I understand.

But read what you just wrote to me again....

Do you see how it's at least partly motivated by jealousy?

Jealously is a very selfish thing, my man. You need to focus on what it is in you that motivates such a feeling. You have to figure out why you're so jealous.
There is a reason why he's being distant and there's a reason why you're jealous of that - neither of you know why though, and only you can figure yourself out.

Sometimes you just have to consciously and purposefully make the space that I'm talking about.

You guys can still interact, you just have to intentionally make it NOT about your emotional doubts of friendship all the time. I highly doubt that when you first became friends that you constantly talked about how much you care about each other and how you emotionally made each other feel, right?... Just get back to what made you buds to begin with. And Hell, if interacting is too hard for you because of your feelings, then just refrain from engaging him for a little while. If he cares about you, he'll come to you when he's ready. (I will go ahead and warn you, however, that it will not be on your schedule so you'll have to be patient.)

jonathan180iq said:

I understand.

But read what you just wrote to me again....

Do you see how it's at least partly motivated by jealousy?

Jealously is a very selfish thing, my man. You need to focus on what it is in you that motivates such a feeling. You have to figure out why you're so jealous.
There is a reason why he's being distant and there's a reason why you're jealous of that - neither of you know why though, and only you can figure yourself out.

Sometimes you just have to consciously and purposefully make the space that I'm talking about.

You guys can still interact, you just have to intentionally make it NOT about your emotional doubts of friendship all the time. I highly doubt that when you first became friends that you constantly talked about how much you care about each other and how you emotionally made each other feel, right?... Just get back to what made you buds to begin with. And Hell, if interacting is too hard for you because of your feelings, then just refrain from engaging him for a little while. If he cares about you, he'll come to you when he's ready. (I will go ahead and warn you, however, that it will not be on your schedule so you'll have to be patient.)

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I have thought about the whole jealousy part and I see in some parts I definitely am jealous with some things. But if you are a close friend, with someone with caring feelings and all that, why would there be little attention? And actually when we met and first hung out, we clicked. We've been through a lot as it is, and I mean a lot.

jonathan180iq said:

I understand.

But read what you just wrote to me again....

Do you see how it's at least partly motivated by jealousy?

Jealously is a very selfish thing, my man. You need to focus on what it is in you that motivates such a feeling. You have to figure out why you're so jealous.
There is a reason why he's being distant and there's a reason why you're jealous of that - neither of you know why though, and only you can figure yourself out.

Sometimes you just have to consciously and purposefully make the space that I'm talking about.

You guys can still interact, you just have to intentionally make it NOT about your emotional doubts of friendship all the time. I highly doubt that when you first became friends that you constantly talked about how much you care about each other and how you emotionally made each other feel, right?... Just get back to what made you buds to begin with. And Hell, if interacting is too hard for you because of your feelings, then just refrain from engaging him for a little while. If he cares about you, he'll come to you when he's ready. (I will go ahead and warn you, however, that it will not be on your schedule so you'll have to be patient.)

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Now all of a sudden everytime I need help with something and when I go to him he "doesn't know" what to do. Like he gets irritated when I'm upset and go to him. And it makes me feel like a burden. I think okay I'll leave you alone, but then I think, I can't, I need him.

crhodes9898 said:

I think okay I'll leave you alone, but then I think, I can't, I need him.

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That, right there, is the problem...

You haven't taken the time to assess why you need him. Once you figure that out, you can start to address it.
Like I've said before, you're expecting too much of someone else and you really need to sort out why. All of this worry and constant anxiety is not going help the situation.

If you really feel right now like you just have to have someone to talk to, I'm sure you can find free counseling services in your area or at your school. You need an unbiased person to bounce these ideas off of, and the internet probably isn't good enough.

Surely you feel exhausted by all of this, don't you? And you obviously recognize that it's not helping your relationship with him, right?
So then why do you keep using the same approach? And why do you keep convincing yourself that going to talk to him is something you should do?

jonathan180iq said:

That, right there, is the problem...

You haven't taken the time to assess why you need him. Once you figure that out, you can start to address it.
Like I've said before, you're expecting too much of someone else and you really need to sort out why. All of this worry and constant anxiety is not going help the situation.

If you really feel right now like you just have to have someone to talk to, I'm sure you can find free counseling services in your area or at your school. You need an unbiased person to bounce these ideas off of, and the internet probably isn't good enough.

Surely you feel exhausted by all of this, don't you? And you obviously recognize that it's not helping your relationship with him, right?
So then why do you keep using the same approach? And why do you keep convincing yourself that going to talk to him is something you should do?

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Well, i do know why I need him. And I don't really expect that much, considering the things he has done in the past are just enough for me, and that's all he has to do. I use him and he uses me, so we have like "taken care of each other". But now, it's like when I need something we never finish talking about it or helping, and that kills me inside, because he never "has time", but when it's someone else in the same situation or something he needs from me, he has all the time in the world.

From "The Song of the Earth," by Gustav Mahler https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Das_Lied_von_der_Erde

Where do I go? I go, I wander in the mountains.
I seek peace for my lonely heart.
I wander homeward, to my abode!
I’ll never wander far.
Still is my heart, awaiting its hour.
The dear earth everywhere blossoms in spring and grows green
anew! Everywhere and forever blue is the horizon!
Forever ... Forever ...

Space.

Friend, you are arguing with yourself; and it seems as though you're projecting one side of the debate upon your friend.

When I'm captured by dilemma, I've found that grappling with the issues only binds me more tightly, entangling me in my own arguments. Resolution capable of satisfying and lasting must come from the hidden place within ourselves. No human argument can long reach that fulcrum.

I've been married 42 years. The wife and I give each other space. We understand that-- close as we are-- we must each come to our fullest stature as individuals. Our life together is an aspect of our lives.

So my advice, for what it's worth, is that you should let it go: walk around a bit, or much. Peace is within you, because it's within every man. Discover it there.

And don't worry: you'll not lose your friend through wandering. Peace is the place where all are One. No mention of it is required.

b.