Vatican speaks out at Irish Catholics.

jeager106 · May 27, 2015

Vatican: Irish gay marriage vote a 'defeat for humanity' - AOL.com

In comments to reporters Tuesday evening, Parolin referred to remarks by the Archbishop of Dublin, Diarmuid Martin, that the results showed the church needed to do a "reality check" since it clearly wasn't reaching young people with its message.

The Church isn't reaching young people but one wonders why the parents aren't leading the way
for young people?

Of course the Church hiding child molesters for centuries does little to encourage faith
in the Church.

Desert Snake · May 27, 2015

''Freedom of religion''. doesn't sound so bad, now, does it.

leibowde84 · May 27, 2015

jeager106 said:
Vatican: Irish gay marriage vote a 'defeat for humanity' - AOL.com

In comments to reporters Tuesday evening, Parolin referred to remarks by the Archbishop of Dublin, Diarmuid Martin, that the results showed the church needed to do a "reality check" since it clearly wasn't reaching young people with its message.

The Church isn't reaching young people but one wonders why the parents aren't leading the way
for young people?

Of course the Church hiding child molesters for centuries does little to encourage faith
in the Church.

I think it is because they parents have no reason to think that homosexuality is wrong anymore. The argument against same-sex marriage is lacking to the extent that the Church has lost credibility on the issue. Parents have, most likely, not be convinced by the Church that what they are saying is accurate.

SkylarHunter · May 27, 2015

Whether right or wrong, the Church doesn't have credibility to point a finger at anyone. Catholic leaders should worry about how God sees them instead.
If there is an institution in this world with reasons to be ashamed of their track record, that is the Catholic Church - specially in Ireland.

Shadow Wolf · May 27, 2015

Things like this make me laugh because the church is doing us a favor by excusing itself further from contemporary society.

Kirran · May 27, 2015

Shadow Wolf said:
Things like this make me laugh because the church is doing us a favor by excusing itself further from contemporary society.

Although it continues to influence the views of many people, despite driving a good proportion away in the Western world, primarily.

Shadow Wolf · May 27, 2015

Kirran said:
Although it continues to influence the views of many people, despite driving a good proportion away in the Western world, primarily.

That's true, but far more people today will roll their eyes of such a statement, which ultimately serves to further distance the RCC from the rest of society.

Kirran · May 27, 2015

Shadow Wolf said:
That's true, but far more people today will roll their eyes of such a statement, which ultimately serves to further distance the RCC from the rest of society.

Not sure. I think the majority of self-identifying Roman Catholics will be behind them. Remember most are in Africa and Latin America. Not that there isn't progress going in both those areas in this regard.

I think the Church will either change its stance on this eventually, or it'll schism over it, like the Anglican Communion's doing.

The Emperor of Mankind · May 27, 2015

Kirran said:
Not sure. I think the majority of self-identifying Roman Catholics will be behind them. Remember most are in Africa and Latin America. Not that there isn't progress going in both those areas in this regard.

I think the Church will either change its stance on this eventually, or it'll schism over it, like the Anglican Communion's doing.

I just wonder how long it'll take Africa and Latin America to realise how deceitful the Catholic Church are about things like condoms (and start questioning what else they could be lying about) and start leaving the Church.

Sultan Of Swing · May 27, 2015

A Disgruntled Scotsman said:
I just wonder how long it'll take Africa and Latin America to realise how deceitful the Catholic Church are about things like condoms (and start questioning what else they could be lying about) and start leaving the Church.

The current trend in South America is to leave in droves and join Pentecostalism. If said "leaving" occurs, I'd guess it will simply be a swap to a more informal and less hierarchical Christianity.

gsa · May 27, 2015

A Disgruntled Scotsman said:
I just wonder how long it'll take Africa and Latin America to realise how deceitful the Catholic Church are about things like condoms (and start questioning what else they could be lying about) and start leaving the Church.

In Latin America, it is happening already as Protestantism draws the conservatives away from the RCC and secularism (and liberalism) pull others in the direction of unaffiliated:

Historical data suggest that for most of the 20th century, from 1900 through the 1960s, at least 90% of Latin America’s population was Catholic (See History of Religious Change). Today, the Pew Research survey shows, 69% of adults across the region identify as Catholic. In nearly every country surveyed, the Catholic Church has experienced net losses from religious switching, as many Latin Americans have joined evangelical Protestant churches or rejected organized religion altogether. For example, roughly one-in-four Nicaraguans, one-in-five Brazilians and one-in-seven Venezuelans are former Catholics.

Overall, 84% of Latin American adults report that they were raised Catholic, 15 percentage points more than currently identify as Catholic. The pattern is reversed among Protestants and people who do not identify with any religion: While the Catholic Church has lost adherents through religious switching, both Protestant churches and the religiously unaffiliated population in the region have gained members. Just one-in-ten Latin Americans (9%) were raised in Protestant churches, but nearly one-in-five (19%) now describe themselves as Protestants. And while only 4% of Latin Americans were raised without a religious affiliation, twice as many (8%) are unaffiliated today.

The trend is even more pronounced among Latinos in the US.

I am not sure about the trend in Africa, if any; irreligion is up across the globe, but the advanced economies are ahead of the curve.

gsa · May 27, 2015

Sultan Of Swing said:
The current trend in South America is to leave in droves and join Pentecostalism. If said "leaving" occurs, I'd guess it will simply be a swap to a more informal and less hierarchical Christianity.

The unaffiliated are also rising. I think that people who are likely to believe in spirits and supernaturalism are drawn to Pentecostalism. They are also fairly syncretic, mixing that with other practices and beliefs inconsistent with either Catholicism or Pentecostalism. From the Pew survey I linked to above:

Many Latin Americans – including substantial percentages of both Catholics and Protestants – say they subscribe to beliefs and practices often associated with Afro-Caribbean, Afro-Brazilian or indigenous religions. For example, at least a third of adults in every country surveyed believe in the “evil eye,” the idea that certain people can cast curses or spells that cause harm. Beliefs in witchcraft and reincarnation also are widespread, held by 20% or more of the population in most countries. Other beliefs and practices vary widely from country to country. For instance, a majority of Mexicans (60%) and more than a third of Bolivians (39%) say they make offerings of food, drinks, candles or flowers to spirits, but just one-in-ten Uruguayans (9%) do so. Overall, the survey finds the highest levels of indigenous or Afro-Caribbean religious practice in Panama, where most people (58%) – including 66% of Panamanian Catholics and 46% of Protestants – engage in at least three out of the eight indigenous beliefs and practices mentioned in the survey.

While the Catholics tend to be more heretical on these points, Latin American Protestantism is nearly as weird. I imagine that the same results would show up in Africa.

Mindmaster · May 27, 2015

Everyone that was in my family who aren't dead have basically been completely driven away from Catholicism for various reasons. It's really OK for them to stop at any time. **lol**

JayJayDee · May 27, 2015

Sultan Of Swing said:
The current trend in South America is to leave in droves and join Pentecostalism. If said "leaving" occurs, I'd guess it will simply be a swap to a more informal and less hierarchical Christianity.

Or perhaps less ritualistic to more entertaining forms of worship. Out of the frying pan into the fire really. Neither adhere to the teachings of Jesus Christ. Both rely heavily on the gullibility of believers in useless miracles and fake healings.

The miracles of the first century ended with the apostolic age for good reason....those who cannot discern this are open to the trickery of the devil.

Father Heathen · May 27, 2015

jeager106 said:
In comments to reporters Tuesday evening, Parolin referred to remarks by the Archbishop of Dublin, Diarmuid Martin, that the results showed the church needed to do a "reality check" since it clearly wasn't reaching young people with its message.

The Church isn't reaching young people but one wonders why the parents aren't leading the way
for young people?

Maybe today's youth are more informed, better educated, and more inclined to use critical thought and rational inquiry? I suppose the church could forcefully perform lobotomies to make people more receptive and less skeptical of their message and leadership.

Father Heathen · May 27, 2015

JayJayDee said:
Or perhaps less ritualistic to more entertaining forms of worship. Out of the frying pan into the fire really. Neither adhere to the teachings of Jesus Christ. Both rely heavily on the gullibility of believers in useless miracles and fake healings.

The miracles of the first century ended with the apostolic age for good reason....those who cannot discern this are open to the trickery of the devil.

Peas in a pod, pot and kettle, etc.

Revoltingest · May 27, 2015

[OTE]
Ikkk

Kirran · May 28, 2015

I've experienced myself the high levels of syncretism in the Roman Catholic Church of Latin America. Barely-veiled worship of a Mayan deity as a Catholic saint for the Mayan peoples alone. I'm pretty sure he's worshipped by the Evangelicals, the Catholics and the followers of indigenous religion alike. I think this kind of thing lends itself to a switch to Charismatic styles of Christianity, chiefly Pentecostalism, as it's less hierarchical.

LDS missionaries are working hard in many of these regions. Could well bear fruit.

My Chilean family is primarily irreligious, as much as I'm aware.

EverChanging · May 28, 2015

Of course it isn't reaching the young people. I'd say in my society our secular culture doesn't always have a healthy attitude to sex, but I'm not sure that of the Church is a much better alternative. Many priests and even some bishops and cardinals don't hold to the party line either, not to mention the majority of the laity in Western societies. I don't know that the official doctrinal position will change much in my lifetime if at all, but I imagine some sort of "pastoral" adaptation will arise that is more tolerant than the official norm.

Vatican speaks out at Irish Catholics.

jeager106

Learning more about Jehovah.

Desert Snake

Veteran Member

leibowde84

Veteran Member

SkylarHunter

Active Member

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber

Kirran

ॐ

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber

Kirran

ॐ

The Emperor of Mankind

Currently the galaxy's spookiest paraplegic

Sultan Of Swing

Well-Known Member

gsa

Well-Known Member

gsa

Well-Known Member

Mindmaster

Well-Known Member

JayJayDee

Avid JW Bible Student

Father Heathen

Veteran Member

Father Heathen

Veteran Member

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian

Kirran

ॐ

EverChanging

Well-Known Member