Sand Dancer
Crazy Cat Lady
For those who want to be a bodhisattva, do you have control over Nirvana or not? I hope I am using the right terminology. This is all new to me.
-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
How do you hold off Nirvana?
- Thread starter Sand Dancer
- Start date
Good question. Nirvana is peace of mind, bliss, freedom from suffering. Maybe your life otherwise remains the same. You just lack the attachments to it which cause suffering.
Maybe a cessation of rebirth. Doesn't seem a good thing to me if you're enjoying life. So maybe I'm still attached. Life without suffering. In meditation I can find peace and bliss which is not affected by the world. This seems a good thing to me. I can enjoy the experience of living without being attached to the world.
"During the Buddha's lifetime he was sometimes accused of being a nihilist, a charge he strongly denied, adding "One thing and only one thing do I teach, suffering and the cessation of suffering". It would seem therefore that Nirvana is neither complete nothingness or existence being in the way that these words are usually used. One thing is certain though, it is not a heaven state and it is not the absorption of the individual soul into an Absolute, an idea that is more indicative of Hinduism. However, whichever way it is understood, the Buddha's saying that "Nirvana is the ultimate happiness" (nibbanam paramam sukham) makes it clear that it is a worthwhile goal. Several criticisms of the doctrine of Nirvana are sometimes expressed. If, it is asked, desire, wanting and craving causes rebirth then how could one ever attain Nirvana because in wanting to attain it one would be strengthening the very thing that prevents it from being attained? This comment fails to understand that Nirvana is not an object that one acquires by wanting and then pursuing, rather it is the state of being utterly without wanting."
Buddhist Studies: Nirvana
Maybe a cessation of rebirth. Doesn't seem a good thing to me if you're enjoying life. So maybe I'm still attached. Life without suffering. In meditation I can find peace and bliss which is not affected by the world. This seems a good thing to me. I can enjoy the experience of living without being attached to the world.
"During the Buddha's lifetime he was sometimes accused of being a nihilist, a charge he strongly denied, adding "One thing and only one thing do I teach, suffering and the cessation of suffering". It would seem therefore that Nirvana is neither complete nothingness or existence being in the way that these words are usually used. One thing is certain though, it is not a heaven state and it is not the absorption of the individual soul into an Absolute, an idea that is more indicative of Hinduism. However, whichever way it is understood, the Buddha's saying that "Nirvana is the ultimate happiness" (nibbanam paramam sukham) makes it clear that it is a worthwhile goal. Several criticisms of the doctrine of Nirvana are sometimes expressed. If, it is asked, desire, wanting and craving causes rebirth then how could one ever attain Nirvana because in wanting to attain it one would be strengthening the very thing that prevents it from being attained? This comment fails to understand that Nirvana is not an object that one acquires by wanting and then pursuing, rather it is the state of being utterly without wanting."
Buddhist Studies: Nirvana
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
In how I view, taught, and learned is that Buddhas are all Boddhistvas. We have a choice to take the vow and live as one or not (formally). Control over Nirvana? I dont think so. The Buddha didnt plan when He would be enlightened. Its spontenous.
Im not a formal Buddhist; and, that understanding of it.
Sand Dancer
Crazy Cat Lady
Thanks!!
The way I see it, Nirvana is the environment of harmony that people with skilled habits end up nurturing around themselves.
A Bodhisattva is by definition someone who has attained that auspicious achievement, yet decided that just attaining it is not good enough. It is instead necessary to step out of his own conquest's benefits and do something to lessen the burden of less skilled people and show them the way towards better habits and better environments.
I believe some people will have divergent understandings, perhaps to the point of full incompatibility.
Sand Dancer
Crazy Cat Lady
I guess I thought that Nirvana was where you went after being done with reincarnation. Okay, I am a wannabe. I need skills.
I think some other people take that interpretation as well. I do not. It is not really at all compatible with my emphatically non-reincarnationist understanding of Buddhism.I guess I thought that Nirvana was where you went after being done with reincarnation. Okay, I am a wannabe. I need skills.
Don't forget we're in a world full of ignorance; be careful what you take as being fact, when unenlightened people don't actually know.
Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
I think the bodhisattva vows to return to the human realm having achieved Nirvana.
ratikala
Istha gosthi
namaskaram Thirza ji
at first we adopt Bodhichitta as an aspiration, .....the Aspiring Bodhisattva prays constantly , ...''may I attain liberation for the benifit of all beings '' ...this liberation is seen as the ceasation of Ignorance and suffering , however the Bodhisattva vows to continualy take birth in this human realm to help eleviate the suffering of conditioned beings , ...and vows not to talk final liberation untill all beings have been liberated .
we may refer to the higest of the heavenly realms as nirvana , this is better explained as final nirvana , but one can experience Nirvana whilst still in the embodied state , ...Nirvana in that sence is the non attatchment that frees one from ignorance and suffering .
so no one would not need to control Nirvana it is an attainment of a pure state of mind , the Bodhisattva can use this pure state of mind in the generation of loving kindness .
at first we adopt Bodhichitta as an aspiration, .....the Aspiring Bodhisattva prays constantly , ...''may I attain liberation for the benifit of all beings '' ...this liberation is seen as the ceasation of Ignorance and suffering , however the Bodhisattva vows to continualy take birth in this human realm to help eleviate the suffering of conditioned beings , ...and vows not to talk final liberation untill all beings have been liberated .
we may refer to the higest of the heavenly realms as nirvana , this is better explained as final nirvana , but one can experience Nirvana whilst still in the embodied state , ...Nirvana in that sence is the non attatchment that frees one from ignorance and suffering .
so no one would not need to control Nirvana it is an attainment of a pure state of mind , the Bodhisattva can use this pure state of mind in the generation of loving kindness .
ratikala
Istha gosthi
namaskaram Carlita ji
this is a very nice example , Gautama Buddha attained liberation (as liberation brings freedom from suffering it equates to the state of Nirvana) ..and became an enlightened being half way through his life , allthough he over came suffering by understanding the true nature of reality he remained in the body for another fourty years in order to teach the Dharma , ...when he finaly left his body he attained Parinirvana , ..this is the final Nirvana , the final release for those who have attained liberation or Nirvanaduring their embodied life time , ....(many Buddhists do also regard this to be akin to a heavenly realm .)
this is a very nice example , Gautama Buddha attained liberation (as liberation brings freedom from suffering it equates to the state of Nirvana) ..and became an enlightened being half way through his life , allthough he over came suffering by understanding the true nature of reality he remained in the body for another fourty years in order to teach the Dharma , ...when he finaly left his body he attained Parinirvana , ..this is the final Nirvana , the final release for those who have attained liberation or Nirvanaduring their embodied life time , ....(many Buddhists do also regard this to be akin to a heavenly realm .)
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
I like that. I had the impression from the Lotus Sutra that the Buddha is still alive in that we are all manisfisations of His Wisdom and search for enlightenment. He says that "people will offer alms to my relics" and search for the Buddha but he said he will not be there in body. A lot of analogy. Have you heard it said that way?
ratikala
Istha gosthi
namaskaram Carlita ji
there are many comentaries , and each explain it in a minutely different way , ....whos comentary are you reading ,?
you say , ....
the different traditions will all see and explain this differently how ever there is no point to argue over our incomplete understandings , ....
we all have the capacity for that enlightened understanding , for our selves to become Buddhi , ...pure knowledge , ...but that nature is covered by our physical sence perception , ..so yes that capacity is there , many times it is called Buddha seed or Buddha nature , ...it pervades our very being , ...it is our higher nature , ...yet to realise it we must understand the levels of our physical perception which cover that pure insight , ...our search for inlightenment is to go beyond these levels of sence perception and attain true realisation , ...
yes , ....Buddha pervades all space and time and is present throughout not just this universe but pervades all , ....in the Heart Sutra it is said that when Buddha spole the Bodhisattvas from the ten directions listened to his disscourses with delight .
there are many comentaries , and each explain it in a minutely different way , ....whos comentary are you reading ,?
you say , ....
....to a Mahayana practitioner this is very true the Buddha in that respect is eternal , the historical Buddha is just a manifestation of that Buddhi .
the different traditions will all see and explain this differently how ever there is no point to argue over our incomplete understandings , ....
we all have the capacity for that enlightened understanding , for our selves to become Buddhi , ...pure knowledge , ...but that nature is covered by our physical sence perception , ..so yes that capacity is there , many times it is called Buddha seed or Buddha nature , ...it pervades our very being , ...it is our higher nature , ...yet to realise it we must understand the levels of our physical perception which cover that pure insight , ...our search for inlightenment is to go beyond these levels of sence perception and attain true realisation , ...
yes , ....Buddha pervades all space and time and is present throughout not just this universe but pervades all , ....in the Heart Sutra it is said that when Buddha spole the Bodhisattvas from the ten directions listened to his disscourses with delight .
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
Thank you for your answer. I went to zen veitnamese temple with my friend. He showed me the different smaller Buddhas who mirror the larger Buddha in the center. He prays to one for blessings, another for safety, etc then we bowed and used three insense per how many people were praying for, bowed in front of the buddha, and offered our prayers.
I loved the whole visit. I was wondering, after awhile, was he (raised Buddhist) praying to The Buddha Himself or for the wisdom of the Budhi? Is it he and other buddhist bowing to the actual Buddha or to what he represents..our Buddha nature, wisdom, etc
Oh. Its the Lotus Sutra itselt by Burton Watson
I loved the whole visit. I was wondering, after awhile, was he (raised Buddhist) praying to The Buddha Himself or for the wisdom of the Budhi? Is it he and other buddhist bowing to the actual Buddha or to what he represents..our Buddha nature, wisdom, etc
Oh. Its the Lotus Sutra itselt by Burton Watson
Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
Is this vow really skillful means, a way of developing compassion?
ratikala
Istha gosthi
namaskaram Spiny ji
in the aspirational stage , yes , in that one tries to exchange the self cherishing mind for a mind that cherishes others , ....
in the aspirational stage , yes , in that one tries to exchange the self cherishing mind for a mind that cherishes others , ....
ratikala
Istha gosthi
namaskaram Carlita ji
it is very nice to go with someone who knows the tradition and etiquete of that particular temple , ..every tradition will be a little different and each person will describe the meaning behind the differnt methods of worship with different empasis this depends on their level of understanding and commitment . from all these explanations one gradualy peices together the full depth of meaning .
doing things in three's is common to many traditions , ....on entering the temple many cultures prostrate or bow three times , .....on many occasions you will see Buddhists raise folded hands first to their forhead then to their mouth and then to their chest before bowing infront of the Buddha , ...we were taught to do this and to silently remind our selves that when we come before Buddha that we should prostrate with ones Body , ones Speach and ones Mind , ....then when one bows (often touching ones head to the floor) one is seeking refuge first of the Buddha him self , secondly seaking refuge in the Dharma the word and law revealed by the Buddha , and thirdly seaking refuge in the Sanga , the spiritual comunity .
many people who are culturaly reared as Buddhists do these things habitualy without realy thinking of the meaning , ...or not thinking that others dont understand these etiquets , ....
but on the whole the majority of Buddhist approach prayer a little differently , the first and most important prayer is reffuge prayer , ....Buddham Saramam Gacchami (to Buddha I go for refuge) , .... Dharmam Saranam Gacchami (to Dharma I go for refuge) ,...Sangam Saranam Gacchami (to Sanga I go for refuge), .... this is recited daily by many Buddhists world wide .
by going for refuge to Buddha , Dharma and Sangha one is taking shelter of the Buddha himself , ...then of the wisdom contained in the Dharma the Buddhas word , ... and finaly in the sangha the spiritual comunity who keep the dharma alive .
when we pray for blessings this may be on a matterial level as everyone needs material security and wellbeing , or it may be on a spiritual level whereby we might pray for blessings to remove ignorance and to assist us on our spiritual path .
many Mahayana Buddhists also pray for the happiness of others and for their spiritual progress and wellbeing .
it is very nice to go with someone who knows the tradition and etiquete of that particular temple , ..every tradition will be a little different and each person will describe the meaning behind the differnt methods of worship with different empasis this depends on their level of understanding and commitment . from all these explanations one gradualy peices together the full depth of meaning .
doing things in three's is common to many traditions , ....on entering the temple many cultures prostrate or bow three times , .....on many occasions you will see Buddhists raise folded hands first to their forhead then to their mouth and then to their chest before bowing infront of the Buddha , ...we were taught to do this and to silently remind our selves that when we come before Buddha that we should prostrate with ones Body , ones Speach and ones Mind , ....then when one bows (often touching ones head to the floor) one is seeking refuge first of the Buddha him self , secondly seaking refuge in the Dharma the word and law revealed by the Buddha , and thirdly seaking refuge in the Sanga , the spiritual comunity .
many people who are culturaly reared as Buddhists do these things habitualy without realy thinking of the meaning , ...or not thinking that others dont understand these etiquets , ....
but on the whole the majority of Buddhist approach prayer a little differently , the first and most important prayer is reffuge prayer , ....Buddham Saramam Gacchami (to Buddha I go for refuge) , .... Dharmam Saranam Gacchami (to Dharma I go for refuge) ,...Sangam Saranam Gacchami (to Sanga I go for refuge), .... this is recited daily by many Buddhists world wide .
by going for refuge to Buddha , Dharma and Sangha one is taking shelter of the Buddha himself , ...then of the wisdom contained in the Dharma the Buddhas word , ... and finaly in the sangha the spiritual comunity who keep the dharma alive .
when we pray for blessings this may be on a matterial level as everyone needs material security and wellbeing , or it may be on a spiritual level whereby we might pray for blessings to remove ignorance and to assist us on our spiritual path .
many Mahayana Buddhists also pray for the happiness of others and for their spiritual progress and wellbeing .
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Best forget it. No point in poundering.I guess I thought that Nirvana was where you went after being done with reincarnation. Okay, I am a wannabe. I need skills.
I agree. There is such a thing as trying too hard. Particularly when one uses concepts of other lives.