I see no value in atheism

[ArtieE]

"Atheism is the absence of belief in the existence of gods."

What is implicit in this definition of the meaning of the concept of atheism is that an atheist believes in no gods... It's not as though an atheist does not form an idea in their mind as to what the concept of god means to them, they do......but rather than believe this idea to be true, the believe it is not true...

Atheism is the absence of belief in the existence of gods, not the belief that gods don't exist. All atheists have an absence of belief in the existence of gods. Some atheists in addition to having an absence of belief in the existence of gods actively believe gods don't exist. These we call "strong atheists".

 

[ArtieE]

We know something is true by direct observation or by the testimony of others.

The testimony of others can of course be completely unreliable.

We may acquire knowledge in two ways - either by direct observation (you see a man knocked down by a car in the street), or through the testimony of others (you read an account of the accident in the evening paper

Who in their right mind would believe everything they read in the papers?

Now, who will say that such faith, such willingness to accept testimony, is unscientific, or unworthy of a rational being?

I will. If a person testifies that he has been abducted by aliens throughout his life believing him without any corroborating factual objective evidence would be completely unworthy of a rational being.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Atheism is the absence of belief in the existence of gods, not the belief that gods don't exist. All atheists have an absence of belief in the existence of gods. Some atheists in addition to having an absence of belief in the existence of gods actively believe gods don't exist. These we call "strong atheists".

Repeating the absurdity does not change the facts.....let us proceed methodically to see how this works out...

First question...presuming you are an atheist, and that you know the concept of god exists...did you or did you not form an idea of what the concept 'god' meant when you first heard or read about it?

 

[paarsurrey]

When babies are born, I don't think we would even refer to them as atheists.

I agree that by nature one is theist.

Regards

 

[JoStories]

My concern is that people are hijacking the general term "atheist" and redefining it so as to more easily attack anyone who doesn't believe in God. If they redefine the term as having a positive belief that God does not exist, it is distorting what an atheist is into a much more declarative position, declaring that atheism is a world view, when it certainly is not. Strong atheism is, but not agnosticism and weak atheism. They are simply defined as a lacking of certain beliefs.

I agree. But that doesn't change that various cultures will and do view some concepts differently. There are some, mostly hardheaded theists, who will see atheism as a declarative statement of a belief. I think it justifies their opinion that atheists are wrong and that God does exist, and that arheists are denying that fact.

 

[JoStories]

I agree that by nature one is theist.

Regards

How so? Belief in something, such as God, requires a cognizant process to accept that belief. From a natural POV, with no knowledge or exposure to the idea of a deity, no one would be a theist.

 

[paarsurrey]

How so? Belief in something, such as God, requires a cognizant process to accept that belief. From a natural POV, with no knowledge or exposure to the idea of a deity, no one would be a theist.

Like one believes in one's parents very naturally from birth till one dies. The concepts could evolve with one's knowledge and experience and become strong with one's journey into maturity.

Regards

 

[Looncall]

"Atheism is the absence of belief in the existence of gods."

What is implicit in this definition of the meaning of the concept of atheism is that an atheist believes in no gods... It's not as though an atheist does not form an idea in their mind as to what the concept of god means to them, they do......but rather than believe this idea to be true, the believe it is not true...

Furthermore, this idea of god that an atheist believes not to exist, may not be, and most likely isn't, the same idea of god as held by other atheists, and for that matter among theists...and definitely among non-dualists...

I find it helpful to include the notion of provisional disbelief. That is, lacking convincing evidence of god(s), one proceeds on the basis that gods do not exist until such evidence is encountered.
This is different from a definite statement that no gods exist.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

I find it helpful to include the notion of provisional disbelief. That is, lacking convincing evidence of god(s), one proceeds on the basis that gods do not exist until such evidence is encountered.
This is different from a definite statement that no gods exist.

That would fall under agnostic....

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

That would fall under agnostic....

- agnosticism and atheism are not mutually exclusive.
- agnosticism isn't just "I don't know whether any gods exist"; it's "the existence of gids is unknowable."

 

[ArtieE]

Repeating the absurdity does not change the facts.....let us proceed methodically to see how this works out...

First question...presuming you are an atheist, and that you know the concept of god exists...did you or did you not form an idea of what the concept 'god' meant when you first heard or read about it?

I didn't form any idea of any concept myself. I just looked at all the other concepts people had formed from the Christian God to Allah and Brahma and Zeus and Thor and Poseidon and on and on. I have simply never had any need to believe in any kind of supernatural superhuman beings or forces or whatever. I have never had any special need to believe they don't exist either.

 

[ArtieE]

I find it helpful to include the notion of provisional disbelief. That is, lacking convincing evidence of god(s), one proceeds on the basis that gods do not exist until such evidence is encountered.
This is different from a definite statement that no gods exist.

This would be an agnostic atheist.

 

[ArtieE]

I agree that by nature one is theist.

Regards

Are you a Muslim then? Every Child is Born Muslim Or does it depend on where you are born? Is a child born in a predominantly Muslim country born a believer in Allah and is a child born in a predominantly Christian country born a believer in God and a child born in a predominantly Hindu country born a believer in Brahma? Or are they just born believing in a general god?

 

[Willamena]

Nope. I'm asking how can you know something is true?

I can't answer it any differently than I already have.

 

[paarsurrey]

Are you a Muslim then? Every Child is Born Muslim Or does it depend on where you are born? Is a child born in a predominantly Muslim country born a believer in Allah and is a child born in a predominantly Christian country born a believer in God and a child born in a predominantly Hindu country born a believer in Brahma? Or are they just born believing in a general god?

Core of every revealed religion is same and in origin they are from the same One-True-God.
In that sense every person born in any part of the world or belonging to whatever ethnicity/language is a theist naturally.

Regards

 

[ArtieE]

Core of every revealed religion is same and in origin they are from the same One-True-God.
In that sense every person born in any part of the world or belonging to whatever ethnicity/language is a theist naturally.

Regards

You might be interested in this article. A reason to believe

 

[paarsurrey]

You might be interested in this article. A reason to believe

Thanks and regards

 

[Willamena]

My concern is that people are hijacking the general term "atheist" and redefining it so as to more easily attack anyone who doesn't believe in God. If they redefine the term as having a positive belief that God does not exist, it is distorting what an atheist is into a much more declarative position, declaring that atheism is a world view, when it certainly is not. Strong atheism is, but not agnosticism and weak atheism. They are simply defined as a lacking of certain beliefs.

Heaven's sake... No one is hijacking anything, it's just a semantical discussion. The term strong atheist fits my beliefs, and I've just been explaining how. If you feel the very definition of the term is threatened by that, that's your problem.

 

[Willamena]

And both a connotation and the denotation of atheism are "a lack of belief in a God". I fail to see the issue.

If connoting is equated with denoting, it goes away. It's just a denoting.

Edit: Unless you meant it in two senses, with "lack of belief" in some non-literal sense. But I didn't get that from what you said.

 

[Willamena]

Strong atheism is, but not agnosticism and weak atheism. They are simply defined as a lacking of certain beliefs.

The agnostic neither believes nor doesn't.

I am hard atheist and agnostic. I found that, in understanding the way in which god neither exists nor doesn't.