A question for non-theist UU's. (hell, attend, church, atheist)

[Nanda]

Originally Posted by lilithu

I would think it would be for the same or similar reasons that theist UUs join and attend a church. With respect (I do understand that your question is sincere), I don't see why believing in God is relevant to attending church. At least not a UU church. My god does not tell me that I have to go to church. I don't need to go to church to "be with God." My god is not confined to one building and does not "need" me to be there either.

As a UU, I go to church to be with other UUs. To draw strength and sustenance from our bond of community. All week long I have to deal with a world where too often people look out only for themselves. They're not bad - that's just the way they've been socialized. If I am not careful, I start falling into that too. But once a week I set aside some time to be with people who, like me, have decided to intentionally aspire to our highest, best selves - selves that encompass others. Each week we are reminded of what it means to be human, what is most important. On most Sundays (not all), after a rousing worship service and bonding over lunch and coffee, I leave feeling rejuvenated, ready to face the world again.

What a wonderful answer. Thank you!

[applewuud]

I'm not a Unitarian-Universalist atheist, but my personal theology is strongly humanist and I enjoy the honesty of many atheists. Community is an important reason for people to be involved with church, but another reason is to be prodded along by the ideas of others in our "free and responsible search for meaning". Forums like this one are good, but they're not the same as being involved in the nuts and bolts of congregational life with other people.

In practice, going to a UU church implies that you're comfortable with having your assumptions challenged sometimes. If you're a liberal Christian who's uncomfortable hearing atheist or earth-centered or humanist concepts in your church, you're more likely to attend a Congregational or Episcopal church. By the same token, if you're an atheist/humanist who is revolted by the very idea of a personal God, exposure to the teachings of Jesus or other religious prophets, there will be Sundays when you may not feel comfortable going to a UU church.

This all varies by congregation, by the way; there are UU congregations (or "fellowships", for groups who don't like the implications of the word "church") that are strongly theist (e.g., King's Chapel in Boston is basically Anglican in its liturgy, with the omission of the Apostle's Creed and any reference to the Trinity). Other congregations have a strong humanist basis and their ministers mention the word "God" only with disclaimers, in deference to congregation members who have a negative history with orthodox religion. The majority of UU congregations are in the middle somewhere. That's why we're in the "syncretic religions" part of the forum.

It also accounts in part for Unitarian-Universalism being a relatively small denomination, despite its deep roots in American culture, having descended in part from the Puritan churches of New England. It's understandable that people are more comfortable being with others who believe pretty much the same theology.

[Caina]

Originally Posted by Trey of Diamonds

That is one thing I have heard some athiest say is that they like the Religious Education classes of UU churches. They want their children to receive an unbiased introduction the all the worlds religions so that they can make their own choices when they are older.

Exactly, personally I would like to see religion restricted to high school or later. Let them learn fact and with age move into speculations

[lilithu]

Nanda, when are your tats going to heal so I can read more about Ugly Girl?

I don't know the origin of your name. From the discussion regarding your tats, it seems Japanese? But whenever I see your name I think of Nanda, Lord Shiva's bull.



edit:
I originally wrote Krishna. As Pariah pointed out to me, Nanda is Shiva's bull, not Krishna's. Ironically, I consider myself more shaivite than vaishnavite. (Hey, when I think bovine, I think Krishna.) Sorry Lord Shiva, I should know better.

[spiritually inclined]

I am an atheist, though not a Unitarian Universalist. However, I am attracted to the religion because of its tolerance of theological diversity. Even many Progressive Christian churches would be uncomfortable with atheists.

I'm not sure why I want to have religion in my life. I actually have very little religion in my life and no official religion because of previous experiences with a border-line cult (Oneness Pentecostalism) and the fact that I don't know what to do with my religious impulses. Also, religion has such a negative reputation that I am hesitant even to become involved in a very positive religion that basically supports humanist values, with which I agree.

Religious impulses are hardwired into the brain and the DNA. Studies in twins indicate that some people are naturally more religious, and this is probably why I am still investigating whether religion or religious rituals can play a part in my life. The sense of community is also appealing to me.

However, I am drawn to ritual, and given its Protestant origins, Unitarian Universalism doesn't seem to have much ritual or liturgy. Does anyone know if some congregations have a more complex liturgy, like an Anglican liturgy, in the United States?

James

[lilithu]

Hi James, namaste.

Originally Posted by spiritually inclined

I am an atheist, though not a Unitarian Universalist. However, I am attracted to the religion because of its tolerance of theological diversity. Even many Progressive Christian churches would be uncomfortable with atheists.

I'm not sure why I want to have religion in my life. I actually have very little religion in my life and no official religion because of previous experiences with a border-line cult (Oneness Pentecostalism) and the fact that I don't know what to do with my religious impulses. Also, religion has such a negative reputation that I am hesitant even to become involved in a very positive religion that basically supports humanist values, with which I agree.

Religious impulses are hardwired into the brain and the DNA. Studies in twins indicate that some people are naturally more religious, and this is probably why I am still investigating whether religion or religious rituals can play a part in my life. The sense of community is also appealing to me.

I can understand where you are coming from. I am not atheist, but even when I essentially was atheist, I was still earnestly searching for a religion which I could accept and which would accept me. Funny, both my parents are atheists and I've often wondered where my very strong impulse towards religion comes from. Maybe some people are genetically predisposed. But I tend to think that ALL people seek meaning, and that's what religion ultimately is for. Paul Tillich, a Christian existentialist, said that everyone has a religion, even if they are not part of an organized tradition. Everyone seeks meaning, and whatever you most cherish, whatever your highest value is, that is your religion. Anyway, I digress.

Originally Posted by spiritually inclined

However, I am drawn to ritual, and given its Protestant origins, Unitarian Universalism doesn't seem to have much ritual or liturgy. Does anyone know if some congregations have a more complex liturgy, like an Anglican liturgy, in the United States?

James

Yeah, I'd say that is where we are most lacking. Granted, some people have negative associations with the smells and bells and so the relative lack in UU is comforting for them. I like ritual. In fact, I have in mind to create some (more) uniquely UU rituals. (We do already have a few.)

Where in the country are you located, if you don't mind my asking? The reason I ask is because where you are will likely greatly influence what the UU congregation is like near you. Both Unitarianism and Universalism started on the East coast, and the older churches, the ones that were already existed before the splits with the Calvinism, tend to have retained some ritual and liturgy. For example, All Souls in NYC and National Memorial in DC both still sing a traditional doxology. National Memorial holds communion 3 or 4 times a year. A lot of the UU churches in New England also do. Otoh, the newer congregations tend to not have these things.

If ritual/liturgy is important to you, do NOT by any means attend a UU "fellowship." Look for a UU "church." Attending UU church will not guarantee that you will get ritual, but attending a UU fellowship will guarantee that you won't.

Lastly a word of caution: if you want ritual, you're going to have to be comfortable with the "God-talk." They kinda go hand in hand. At least I have yet to see a UU congregation that is heavily atheist and yet is heavy in ritual. But of course, you are free to interpret the God-talk in the way that makes the most sense to you.

[Nanda]

Originally Posted by lilithu

Nanda, when are your tats going to heal so I can read more about Ugly Girl?

I usually update on Mondays. I'm feeling pretty good, so it should be up this week.

I don't know the origin of your name. From the discussion regarding your tats, it seems Japanese? But whenever I see your name I think of Nanda, Lord Shiva's bull.

In my case it's not Japanese, that's just a happy coincidence. I'm called Nanda because when my youngest brother was two, he couldn't pronounce "Amanda."

[spiritually inclined]

I am living in Texas, so Unitarian Universalist churches probably won't be common here, though I've seen a couple. But they are far away.

James