Putting Taoism to the Test (experience, faith, verse)

[ChrisP]

Originally Posted by Scarlett Wampus

I can see/feel that the Tao is the root of all and that everything shares in that, yet that awareness is not evident in the way people go about things and thus there is great disharmony. If this were not the case there would be no such thing as Taoism!

I agree, humans are out of step with Tao. I just find it hard to accept that given that everything is Tao. That's probably the hardest thing to understand (for me)

[Scarlett Wampus]

The paradox I encounter is that, the more sense of people's original perfection I get, the more I feel that ignorance, hatred and other things are not a reflection of the awareness of this perfection.

[PureX]

Originally Posted by windcarver

Hmmmm what are my doubts about taoism????? I guess I don't really have any doubts, persay, but there are parts of it that sort of confuse me. For example, i still haven't figured out how it is possible to have no desires, including the desire to have no desires. ? . I'm lost. - - But how could I put my faith to the test? I could try not wanting anything, but then I'd be desiring to have no desires, and then I'd start to desire that I could understand this whole desiring thing, and - -
If that answers your question.

It's simple. Stop thinking. Be quiet. Breathe in, .... breathe out. Enjoy the fresh air as it enters your lungs. Savor it, and then enjoy letting it back out slowly.

The "cure for desire" is the natural fulfillment that come with joyfulness. Find the joy in this moment, and you will desire nothing else.

[ChrisP]

Originally Posted by Scarlett Wampus

The paradox I encounter is that, the more sense of people's original perfection I get, the more I feel that ignorance, hatred and other things are not a reflection of the awareness of this perfection.

You make so much more sense than I ever could... please write a book.

[PureX]

Originally Posted by ChrisP

I have trouble comprehending how humans are the only creatures capable of abstractly examining the existence of Tao.

We are the only ones foolish enough to do such a thing. *smile* The other life forms on Earth are not blinded by their own abstract thoughts.

Originally Posted by ChrisP

I also wonder about some things that happen which (to me) seem unnatural, but the tao accepts this and adapts, which is at it should be I suppose, but these things still occur...

Human beings are naturally superstitious. We anthropormorphize the unknown.

Originally Posted by ChrisP

I'm talking in general about the cloning/growth of life in testubes... it doesn't seem... at all right to me. Duplicating something that IS already.

A clone is not a duplicate. A clone is simply a twin born later through the manipulations of science.

Originally Posted by ChrisP

Everyone likes to test their faith to reassure them that their faith is justified.

The Tao is what is. What point would there be in doubting what is? This would be the exercise of insanity.

Originally Posted by ChrisP

Faith NEEDS NO justification. How is it possible to test something that is Nothing and Everything, Benign and omniscient (in the sense of understanding)... as a human it can't be done. The Tao is the only thing that could test itself, and when something limitless test it's limits... well who knows what happens.

See how this train of thought spirals down into nonsense? This is the exercize of insanity.

Originally Posted by ChrisP

[/size][/font]I am incapable of conceiving infinity, and yet I do not accept finity.

-Simone de Beauvoir

Simone was thinking too much, and making too much of himself. Thus he became both confused and unhappy.

[PureX]

Originally Posted by ChrisP

I have trouble comprehending how humans are the only creatures capable of abstractly examining the existence of Tao.

We are the only ones foolish enough to do such a thing. *smile* The other life forms on Earth are not blinded by their own abstract thoughts.

Originally Posted by ChrisP

I also wonder about some things that happen which (to me) seem unnatural, but the tao accepts this and adapts, which is at it should be I suppose, but these things still occur...

Human beings are naturally superstitious. We anthropomorphize the unknown.

Originally Posted by ChrisP

I'm talking in general about the cloning/growth of life in testubes... it doesn't seem... at all right to me. Duplicating something that IS already.

A clone is not a duplicate. A clone is simply a twin born later through the manipulations of science.

Originally Posted by ChrisP

Everyone likes to test their faith to reassure them that their faith is justified.

The Tao is what is. What point would there be in doubting what is? This would be the exercise of insanity.

Originally Posted by ChrisP

Faith NEEDS NO justification. How is it possible to test something that is Nothing and Everything, Benign and omniscient (in the sense of understanding)... as a human it can't be done. The Tao is the only thing that could test itself, and when something limitless test it's limits... well who knows what happens.

See how this train of thought spirals down into nonsense? This is the exercise of insanity.

Originally Posted by ChrisP

[/size][/font]I am incapable of conceiving infinity, and yet I do not accept finity.

-Simone de Beauvoir

Simone was thinking too much, and making too much of himself. Thus he became both confused and unhappy.

[PureX]

Originally Posted by Scarlett Wampus

The paradox I encounter is that, the more sense of people's original perfection I get, the more I feel that ignorance, hatred and other things are not a reflection of the awareness of this perfection.

Paradox occurs when we can see both the yin and the yang at the same time, but we can't see how they are complimenting each other, and working together in expressing the Tao. When we can see how they fit together and compliment each other in expressing the Tao, the paradox is solved.

Thus, a paradox is an illusion created by our own ignorance. When we understand this, we also understand that disharmony within the Tao is a paradox, and is therefor also an illusion.

[d.]

Originally Posted by PureX

Simone was thinking too much, and making too much of himself. Thus he became both confused and unhappy.

herself. and i don't think she was that unhappy, actually.

otherwise, great post.