Water Spirits (ritual, America, spiritual, Roman, shaman)

Master Vigil · #1 02-22-2005, 01:02 PM

I remember reading a quote by a sinti shaman saying, "when things get dirty, just run like the water spirits do." What do you think she meant by this comment?

Feathers in Hair · #2 02-22-2005, 01:27 PM

An interesting quote... For me, running with water spirits tends to clean things up. They delicately wipe away the grime (usually) without damaging any of the things you want to stay intact. (Like running a dirty plate under running water.) To me, water usually represents joy, so that could've been what she was meaning, too.

*thinks this quote is worth pondering*

Master Vigil · #3 02-22-2005, 01:34 PM

Your almost completely correct feathers. The gypsies were very cleanly people. Anything seen as dirty was immeditately seen as taboo. "Of course this meant menstrating women at the time which I don't agree with." But still, It also has a nomadic ring to it. When things got bad, the gygsies would pack up and leave. Do you think the ability to pick up and go at any time helped them stay "spiritually clean?"

Feathers in Hair · #4 02-22-2005, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Vigil

Your almost completely correct feathers. The gypsies were very cleanly people. Anything seen as dirty was immeditately seen as taboo. "Of course this meant menstrating women at the time which I don't agree with." But still, It also has a nomadic ring to it. When things got bad, the gygsies would pack up and leave. Do you think the ability to pick up and go at any time helped them stay "spiritually clean?"

The nomadic idea of being able to move on without worrying so much about the land itself does seem intrisically water-like, to me. I'm not sure if it would contribute to being 'spiritually clean', because I'm a bit biased in that area.

(At last count, I've moved 26 times.) I do apologize, since I was unfamiliar with the Sinti, and didn't realize we were dealing with gypsies and the aspects of that culture, versus a Native American tribe. That'll teach me to do my research before replying!

Master Vigil · #5 02-22-2005, 02:09 PM

you did nothing wrong Feathers. Your reply was wonderful. I was just asking another question. I love how youve moved that much, your the only one who has moved more than me (I have only moved 10 times). The water was very important to them, due to them being very clean people. But do you think the ability to move has anything to do with spirituality? Or is it simply relative and subjective?

michel · #6 02-22-2005, 02:10 PM

That is interesting M.V; I would however think that your gypsies are different from ours; ours seem to be reviled by all, abusing their ability to settle wherever they wish, destroying the beauty of whatever site they settle in. I can see how that might be spiritually 'clensing' for them, but the legacy to the world is not so 'pure'.

Master Vigil · #7 02-22-2005, 09:01 PM

I know modern day gypsies get a bad rap in some places. But nowadays the majority of them have settled down in one place. The few that are still nomads are finding it hard in modern day society to keep their nomadic lifestyle. Things (so they say) were much more beautiful back in the day. Of course the sinti's are different than the romani's (you probably are talking about the romanis since there is more of them). The sinti are native to europe, while the romanis are the ones who are native to india. The thing with alot of gypsies is that the rest of the world is sometimes not as important. They have the mentality where they want to stay in their own little world, and everything else can do what they want. The outside world has persecuted them, so they care little about it. This of course is not the majority, but you may be seeing them in that light. Which I think is very common in england.

Master Vigil · #8 03-04-2005, 09:19 AM

I was using a different definition of taboo.

A ban or an inhibition resulting from social custom or emotional aversion.

As such, menstruating women were "dirty" and not sacred. When they would bathe in the stream, women would have to bathe further down stream so they wouldn't contaminate the water. Cats were seen as dirty because they licked themselves bringing thier filth inside of themselves. The "dirt" was not seen as sacred but the opposite. Understand now?