Aquatic Ape Theory (evolution)

[Tau]

Why do or why don't you agree with this theory?

[3.14]

wel its pretty logical conclution so i agree with it untill proven otherwise

[Willamena]

It would be a more productive thread if you posted what the theory was and what you think of it.

The aquatic ape hypothesis (AAH), sometimes referred to as the aquatic ape theory, asserts that wading, swimming and diving for food exerted a strong evolutionary effect on the ancestors of the genus Homo and is in part responsible for the split between the common ancestors of humans and other great apes. The AAH attempts to explain the large number of physical differences between humans and other apes, such as lack of body hair, larger brains and upright posture, in terms of the methods of feeding and types of food of early hominids living in coastal and river regions.

Aquatic ape hypothesis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[painted wolf]

Why I don't agree

1) Fur seals, otters, taipers (most aquatic/amphibious mammals have fur)
2) Human hair isn't 'hydrodynamic' (Just look at everything swimmers do to counter that) It is however very like that of terrestrial apes.
3)Salt-glads are found in lots of terrestrial animals from desert dwelling reptiles. All primates shed salty tears.
4)All mammals have the infant swimming response. Clearly not all mammals are aquatic in ancestry.
5)All mammals have a 'dive reflex' and can hold their breath. Again clearly not all mammals are aquatic in ancestry.
6)Human fat is nothing like aquatic mammal blubber. It is like that of other primates, distributed in the same way and attached in the same manner. Human fat may be unsightly but it will do no better than a fat gorilla in keeping warm in the water. (Hypothermia anyone?)
7) humans do not have 'waterproof' skin... just soak in a bath and look at the wrinkles.
8) Early hominids ate tough plant foods that left distinctive marks on the teeth. These show a diet high in rough foods like nuts, tubers and woody materials. Not the sort of food one finds in the water.
9) most early hominid finds are in dry environments like savannas and such. Not aquatic environments.
10) Upright posture has been shown to be very effective at cooling the body, in conjunction with sweating.
11) Apes like Gibbons and Orangutans show that upright walking in the trees is also a good way of moving around. Finds like Orrorin show that walking upright predated leaving the forests. Orrorin was found in dry evergreen forest environment, not a wet one.

here are just a few of many reasons I find Aquatic Apes to be a poor explanation for human evolution.

wa:do

[3.14]

now i don´t agree anymore

[fantôme profane]

Originally Posted by painted wolf

Why I don't agree

1) Fur seals, otters, taipers (most aquatic/amphibious mammals have fur)
2) Human hair isn't 'hydrodynamic' (Just look at everything swimmers do to counter that) It is however very like that of terrestrial apes.
3)Salt-glads are found in lots of terrestrial animals from desert dwelling reptiles. All primates shed salty tears.
4)All mammals have the infant swimming response. Clearly not all mammals are aquatic in ancestry.
5)All mammals have a 'dive reflex' and can hold their breath. Again clearly not all mammals are aquatic in ancestry.
6)Human fat is nothing like aquatic mammal blubber. It is like that of other primates, distributed in the same way and attached in the same manner. Human fat may be unsightly but it will do no better than a fat gorilla in keeping warm in the water. (Hypothermia anyone?)
7) humans do not have 'waterproof' skin... just soak in a bath and look at the wrinkles.
8) Early hominids ate tough plant foods that left distinctive marks on the teeth. These show a diet high in rough foods like nuts, tubers and woody materials. Not the sort of food one finds in the water.
9) most early hominid finds are in dry environments like savannas and such. Not aquatic environments.
10) Upright posture has been shown to be very effective at cooling the body, in conjunction with sweating.
11) Apes like Gibbons and Orangutans show that upright walking in the trees is also a good way of moving around. Finds like Orrorin show that walking upright predated leaving the forests. Orrorin was found in dry evergreen forest environment, not a wet one.

here are just a few of many reasons I find Aquatic Apes to be a poor explanation for human evolution.

wa:do

May I suggest:

12) the theory in not necessary to explain the loss of body hair.

[Alex_G]

Aditionally it could just as easily be argued that loss of hair provided cooling benefits in the hot climate. Additionally it may not be directly down to survival benefit, but rather sexual prefrence, possible steming from neoteny, where juvenile traits remain in the adult. This might have been a successfull sign of youth, to possess villus hair rather than fully matured body hair.

[Tau]

Originally Posted by Willamena

It would be a more productive thread if you posted what the theory was and what you think of it.

Oh? Sorry...

Personally I don't think it holds water, pardon the pun.

Humans evolved bipedalism in order to survive after the forests retreated, primarily it allowed them to scan the horizion for predators and by freeing the arms and hands humans could carry loads and throw missles at predators and then later prey, the fact that humans are the only animals that can harm from a distance is surprisingly overlooked when their origins are considered, humans and their ancestors spent a lot of time making small sharp pointy things to fling at threats, a band of flint slinging humans is enough to force even large predators away, before spears and hand axes were in common use.
Humans have good aim....good eyesight for targeting spatially, and they inherited that from their remote simian ancestors 'learning' to avoid slamming into trees as they swung through the vines.... binocular depth perception, very useful eh?

Bipedalism + Language + Necessity + A little monkey magic = Technological advances.

[logician]

The aquatic ape theory has been around a while, I don't put much stock in it either. More likely bidpedalism and walking upright gave significant advantages in the terrain apes migrated to, thus the emphasis on those traits as time went by. Increasing intelligence could have evolved in several ways I think.

[Somkid]

There are monkeys in Asia that dive for fish so, it is possible.